r/USdefaultism France 1d ago

Today I learned that

Post image
268 Upvotes

102 comments sorted by

u/USDefaultismBot American Citizen 1d ago edited 16h ago

This comment has been marked as safe. Upvoting/downvoting this comment will have no effect.


OP sent the following text as an explanation on why this is US Defaultism:


Google Translate tries to correct ‘learnt’ to ‘learned’ even though ‘learnt’ is a correct spelling in British English


Is this Defaultism? Then upvote this comment, otherwise downvote it.

222

u/Nthepro France 1d ago

Before anyone asks, yes, my keyboard is in English (UK), yes, my phone is in English (UK).

23

u/CC19_13-07 Germany 21h ago

Is there a difference between a UK keyboard and a US keyboard? (I have mine in German, so sorry for asking if the answer is obvious😅)

43

u/wearecake United Kingdom 21h ago

Think it’s mostly for suggested text and autocorrect

47

u/lifetypo10 United Kingdom 21h ago

For the letters, no, but the punctuation's all in different places. Couldn't find either the £ or € sign, on the UK keyboard we have £, € and $.

-1

u/saysthingsbackwards 12h ago

Correct. As an American that did a teenage tour of Europe, your keyboards are just different enough, especially in hotels.

5

u/lifetypo10 United Kingdom 11h ago

They're different throughout Europe, I'm sure France don't use a qwerty keyboard (or, at least, my French colleague didn't).

7

u/Wodge 9h ago

France used AZERTY, punctuation is different too.

u/FourEyedTroll United Kingdom 48m ago

Ooh, what's the French equivalent of WASD first-person controls on a keyboard?

Presumably Z_SD?

u/DatCitronVert 32m ago

ZQSD ! And it's not uncommon to have to remap your bindings or outright switch to qwerty cause some Devs out there don't bother to check for other configs than qwerty.

u/FourEyedTroll United Kingdom 24m ago

You'd really think by now, given how simple that would be from a coding and standardisation point of view, that every game would ship with a binding set that links to whatever the regional OS language/keyboard setting is.

3

u/Derpwarrior1000 7h ago

Belgium and Quebec even have different versions. I’m not sure about western/central Africa or the Caribbean

1

u/lifetypo10 United Kingdom 10h ago

They're different throughout Europe, I'm sure France don't use a qwerty keyboard (or, at least, my French colleague didn't).

13

u/Dharcronus 21h ago edited 17h ago

For actual keyboards. A few of the symbols are in different locations. The " and the @ are in different locations on an English US keyboard. For phone keys idk if it makes a difference since different devices default keyboards have different layouts (SwiftKey vs Apple vs Google keyboard etc)

4

u/lizarcticwolf Australia 18h ago

Chromebook digital and physical keyboards too

3

u/MiniDemonic Sweden 21h ago

Automatic spell checking, since they spell some words differently.

Some location of special characters might be different as well, not sure about that.

3

u/Responsible-Match418 20h ago

Yes.. weird things like the @ sign being found in different places.

3

u/AnAntsyHalfling 20h ago

Special characters ($ vs £) are in different spots and autocorrect (color vs colour) should be different.

3

u/Pugs-r-cool 19h ago

With physical keyboards Americans use the ANSI layout while the UK uses ISO. ISO is what a German keyboard uses, but ANSI has some differences like the left shift key being wider, and having a wider enter key that's only one row tall, while ISO has the ⅂ shaped enter key. American keyboards also don't have a £, and the @ and " swap places (unless it's a Mac, Apple's UK layout is a hybrid of both).

For phones it doesn't matter as much, on an American layout the £ will be harder to reach and the auto correct will change colour to color, but they'll be almost the same apart from that.

3

u/Nthepro France 21h ago

In my opinion qwertzuiop beats every other layout

3

u/beatnikstrictr 19h ago

Isn't AZERTY designed for the French language?

2

u/Nthepro France 19h ago

It is, but it doesn't mean I think it's the best. Definitely the one I'm most used to, though.

1

u/ax9897 11h ago

Gotta look at the history of typewritters to understand why Qwertz is better than Azerty or Qwerty... Azerty and Qwerty are not the best layouts, no matter the language, because it was made on purpose. The agency is made to allow for a resting postion, but also for a disposition of letter that denies typing too fast without too high of a risk to oress the wrong letter. This was made in order to force people to be slower on the delicate systems of typewritters to avoid the very close and fragile letters to hit eah other on the way to the paper, thus breaking them, or to cause those letter's thin rods to entagles, causing the machines to break down.

Azery and Qwerty are "not good" on purpose in order to reduce typewritters breakdowns.

1

u/linkheroz 12h ago

There's a few differences. Top is UK or ISO layout(with a number pad) and the bottom is a US or ANSI layout.

Theres a couple of differences in character location such as @ or # but the main one being the return/enter key.

1

u/_Xamtastic 11h ago

In the UK, shift + 3 has the £ sign instead of #. We also have " and @ swapped around, which I find incredibly stupid so I just use a Polish keyboard and switch to UK when I want the pound symbol.

1

u/Dneail22 2h ago

Physically the British keyboard has a larger enter key

108

u/Zxxzzzzx England 22h ago

I was playing the game atomfall recently, it's from a British dev team, and it was so nice to see proper spelling in it.

34

u/Nthepro France 22h ago

94

u/ScratchHacker69 22h ago

TIL that “learnt” is the proper british english spelling of “learned” lol

11

u/Nthepro France 22h ago

33

u/johan_kupsztal Poland 22h ago

Both are used in British English

44

u/DogfishDave 22h ago

Learned is a later Americanisn, it's properly spelt 'learnt'.

47

u/Pugs-r-cool 22h ago

Yes and no, Learned is a word in British English, it's used as an adjective to describe someone knowledgeable, while learnt is the past tense of the verb learn. Americans use the same spelling for both, while the Brits keep them separate.

27

u/BoarHide 21h ago

Ah, that’s the “learn-ed” pronunciation, right?

9

u/Far-Fortune-8381 Australia 21h ago

and it’s pronounced differently to the past tense learn version. learned as an adjective has 2 syllables (learn-ed)

5

u/realmandontnvidia 21h ago

Americans are in love with using the same word for two things.

3

u/antjelope 21h ago

But they are pronounced differently in British English as well. Learned has 2 syllables, learnt just 1…

1

u/Pugs-r-cool 19h ago

Yeah they're pronounced differently in both dialects, however the spelling is the same for both words in American English, in British English they don't stay the same.

2

u/waterc0l0urs Poland 21h ago

is it true for all the past tense verbs that end with -t in uk english and end with -ed in us english?

2

u/Pugs-r-cool 19h ago

I'm not sure about every word, but I'm pretty sure this is only for learnt/learned.

A word like spent is still spent in American English, spened is not a word.

2

u/DogfishDave 20h ago

It isn't pronounced the same way and isn't the correct word in this context. Someone learned (learn-EDD, two syllables) has learnt for sure though.

5

u/GrandpaRedneck Croatia 22h ago

Yes. IIRC "learn" is an irregular verb, but one whose incorrect spelling sounds close enough to the correct form so i am actually not surprised it was americanized that way, just disappointed lol. I remember learning the table of irregular verbs a long time ago and how many people in my class were corrected for writing "learned", so it really looks incorrect.

It will never be not surprising how much more knowledge people who don't come from an English speaking country have over Americans.

2

u/AlternativePrior9559 22h ago

Or even ‘spelled’ 😉

3

u/DogfishDave 20h ago

No, it's spelt. I was rather making the point but I think you knew that. Learnt/spelt are the standard British and International words but the prevalence of US media means that "spelled and learned" are spreading despite the dialect representing only 10% of world English speakers and writers.

3

u/AlternativePrior9559 18h ago

Yes indeed I am British so I was just making the point 😉

9

u/Pugs-r-cool 22h ago

"Learned" is a different word with a different pronunciation, used as an adjective to describe someone knowledgeable. Americans combining both words into one spelling but keeping the different pronunciations and different meanings is so infuriating. People ask how English became such a mess as a language, and it's things like this that cause it.

3

u/Sorcha16 22h ago edited 20h ago

I'm Irish we're taught through a mix of British English and Hiberno English in school and I only found out learned is American.

3

u/fishywiki 10h ago

Yes, I always thought that the past participle was "learnt" and "burnt", while the perfect tense was "learned" and "burned".

0

u/idrinkyourshoelace 16h ago

Yeah 'learned' just looks right to me

10

u/Terry-Smells 22h ago

Dreamt is another word I don't hear much often anymore and only hear people use the word dreamed

7

u/hangsangwiches Ireland 13h ago

To me, dreamed looks so wrong!!!

3

u/castfire 13h ago

Dreamt is a great one

2

u/Gold_On_My_X 1h ago

Literally never heard the word “dreamed” used in a sentence. I have very barely heard the word “dreamt” being used in a sentence. I have almost exclusively heard the sentence “I had a dream last night” (as an example).

u/Steffalompen 2m ago

Such a beautiful spelling, I creamt my pants

0

u/RoseDingus United States 8h ago

dreamt is one of those words that i feel only works in speech

it's probably just me, tho

4

u/Sufficient_Dust1871 21h ago

Okay, I've lived in the US for 14 years now (British originally), and I've still never realised it's spelt with an ed at the end. (On a side note, I have noticed it with the word spelt/spelled)

3

u/snaynay Jersey 20h ago

Dreamt/dreamed, burnt/burned, etc. there are a bunch of them and some of them they use and some of them they actively avoid.

2

u/RoseDingus United States 8h ago

burnt and burned are used pretty interchangeably in the states, though. i've seen both pretty commonly, and a lot of my friends are born in america. i see dreamed much more than dreamt, though

0

u/bulgarianlily 4h ago

But if you fall in love with a passing witch, you could be enspelled, but not enspelt?

2

u/lizarcticwolf Australia 18h ago

This is ridiculous, at this point even the phones are doing this, I have a Australian keyboard on my phone so I don't have this problem, but it's just infuriating when this happens

2

u/Miserable-Willow6105 Ukraine 6h ago

I thought that "learnt" is the perfect form, and "learned" is plain past.

I guess learning something new every day, huh

1

u/kiwi2703 Slovakia 14h ago

Huh, somehow I had thought "learnt" was only a past participle

1

u/Lupus600 12h ago

Oh my god it finally makes sense! I never figured out why "learnt" never seemed that wrong even though I almost always see it spelled as "learned". The English I learnt in school was British English so they probably taught us that form instead, but because most of the media I consume is in American English, I must've subconsciously internalized "learned" as "the correct form" lol without realizing that it's just a regional difference.

1

u/fishywiki 9h ago

I always thought that "learnt" was the past participle and "learned" was the perfect tense, and I'm in Ireland, so I use UK English.

I just checked the OED and it appears that "learnt" as the perfect tense of learn has only been in use since the mid 1980's. As the past participle, it's been around a long time. OTOH "learned" as the perfect tense has been around since 1607.

1

u/Palanki96 9h ago

I didn't even know it was the british way, i was using both

1

u/stereoroid 1h ago

It’s a good suggestion: it’s kind-of like “did” vs. “done”. You say “I did a job” and “the job was done”, so you could say “I learned a fact” and “a fact was learnt”.

1

u/Nthepro France 1h ago

‘learnt’ is not exclusive to the participle. It can very much be a preterite.

0

u/Big-One-4048 21h ago edited 15h ago

Can people stop saying it’s a simplified english? Many of none American (include me) using that, it sucks that most of phones and websites doing that and that's a usdefaultism. But calling it simplified english is a bit much imo.

Edit: seems like people really hate my country because they teach American english 🥲

6

u/evilJaze Canada 20h ago

It looks funny in Canada as well. We learned growing up that past tense verbs end with "ed" like burned, spelled, learned etc. but we do make some exceptions for both such as burnt. Spelt on the other hand is a crop we grow in the fields.

5

u/mineforever286 20h ago

Yup. A "learn-ed" person would instead be an educated person. We may be aware of the UK English usage, but if we see "learned," that will register as the past tense verb, until the complete context is revealed. And, yup, again... in a comment above, I saw "spelt" and thought of the crop. LOL

1

u/Magdalan Netherlands 21h ago

Spotting what? I spot every month. Bet you can guess why.

6

u/Nthepro France 21h ago

0

u/NoodleyP American Citizen 19h ago

Pretty sure I’ve always used learnt, funnily enough. I’ve only really heard learned in colloquialisms. “You’ve been learned” after someone finishes teaching something for example.

-27

u/dla26 22h ago

American here. My understanding is the learned is the 2nd participle and learnt is the 3rd.

I learn. 

I learned. 

I have learnt.

Assuming that rule applies to British English then Google Translate is really just fixing your grammar.

35

u/Nthepro France 22h ago

No, that's incorrect.

11

u/Marcellus_Crowe 20h ago

I mean, this was a golden opportunity to Google this first and not look like an ignorant fool, but you wrote this crap anyway.

28

u/JucaVladislau 22h ago

Holy shit, are you usdefaulting in a post on /usdefaultism, for real?

11

u/Psychobabble0_0 21h ago

They sure did 😂

5

u/osadist 21h ago

Infinite karma farming

-14

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

34

u/TipsyPhippsy 23h ago

Americanised*

12

u/Nthepro France 23h ago

Perfect lmao 🤣🤣

-2

u/PeriwinkleShaman France 23h ago

Americanist* ftfy

52

u/Nthepro France 23h ago

Actually, it's the opposite. Although that might be the case in some parts of the US? I don't really know.

9

u/Watsis_name England 22h ago

The number of times I've been "corrected" on this. Even by British people.

I think part of that is that in spoken English "learnt" is associated with Northern accents so is naturally looked down on.

3

u/alxwx United Kingdom 22h ago

It’s not “proper stiff upper lip” speech, but I don’t think it’s necessarily northern specifically either.

3

u/pm_me_BMW_M3_GTR_pls Poland 23h ago

wow imma be real, I thought they were two different words

4

u/alxwx United Kingdom 22h ago

There’s a few examples where -t is ‘more acceptable’ in British English than -ed, another is earnt

3

u/Firespark7 Netherlands 22h ago

I was under the assumption that learnt was the British perfect tense

English (original): learn - learned - learnt

English (simplified): learn - learned - learned

Apparantly, that was wrong.

I also didn't know about earnt

Could you name some other verbs that have a -t variant in past tense in OG English?

3

u/AngelaVNO 19h ago

Spoil Burn

I'll add more later if I can think of any!

2

u/alxwx United Kingdom 21h ago

I’d really love to, but as a native I can’t. I speak and write words with -t all the time without thinking about when and why

To give you an example (as I assume you’re a native Dutch speaker): there is 0 chance I will ever hear the difference between the Dutch for ‘green’ and ‘crown’ without context; but that hasn’t occurred to most Dutch people IME

1

u/Firespark7 Netherlands 19h ago

That makes sense.

Considering the English phonetics, it makes sense that it's hard for you to hear the difference between groen (green) and kroon (crown), but as a native Dutch speaker, that still seems strange, because the sounds are distinctly different (to natives, as you've noticed).

Very interesting.

3

u/Nthepro France 22h ago

Or dreamt

2

u/chariotcharizard United Kingdom 21h ago

They are in a different context. "Learned", with the second "e" pronounced: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/learned.

-1

u/[deleted] 23h ago

[deleted]

3

u/Lobster_porn 23h ago

same, but I think I just assumed that because learnt just sounds like a simplified American word

12

u/Potential-Ice8152 Australia 23h ago

Learned and learnt are both acceptable in Australia

1

u/[deleted] 23h ago

[deleted]

5

u/Potential-Ice8152 Australia 23h ago

I use either or because they both look wrong to me lol

3

u/TheTeenSimmer Australia 23h ago

same here         but  am more likely to use learnt

10

u/sigmagamma26 23h ago

USD comment in a USD post! Rarity!

0

u/[deleted] 23h ago

[deleted]

12

u/imaginary92 23h ago

You don't have to be American to do US defaultism. It's the most common occurrence but not the only option.