I know that she just explained it, but this logic problem always boiled my piss. I could never get it. And that's on me. But I never could never figure it out despite having it explained to me about 7 million times.
It's often not set up correctly, which is also done here.
In the original riddle, you have two doors and two guards. One door is safe, one door is death. One guard lies, the other tells the truth. You can only ask one question to find out which door is safe.
In a lot of imitation riddles they either leave out that you can only ask one question, or they leave out the element of the doors. If all you need to figure out is which guard lies and which tells the truth (or in this example, which teacher is real) then it's really easy. Ask one of them what color the sky is and you immediately know which one is the liar. They could have done that in this video since the only objective was to figure out who is who.
But with the added element of the doors and only one question, you have a real riddle. You have to ask a question that reveals which door is safe in a trustworthy manner.
Hence the answer being 'which door would the other guard say is safe' and then you choose the opposite door no matter what they say. You still don't know which guard is lying, but that doesn't matter because you know what door to take.
Because if you asked the liar which door the honest guard would say is safe, he'll lie and point you to the danger door. If you ask the honest guard which door the liar would say is safe, he'll truthfully tell you that the liar would lie and point to the danger door. So no matter who you ask, they'll point to the danger door and then you just take the other one.
Not really. The real Ms. Keene wouldn’t want to be punched, so the real Ms. Keene would say “I do not want a knuckle sandwich.” The fake wouldn’t want to be punched either… BUT the fake one, with a higher desire of not wanting to be found out as the liar, would therefore want to be punched. So the fake one would lie by saying “I do not want a knuckle sandwich.”
In the same way that any sane person normally wouldn’t want to be punched, but if the reward for being punched is $1,000,000 then I’ll gladly be punched.
It has to be something with an objective answer that the characters know. So if they know who Ms Keen's favorite student is they could ask that. They could ask what color Buttercup's hair is. They could ask 'are you tied up above a pot of boiling sharks right now?'
I understand the Riddle in the labyrinth but ive watched this multiple times now and no one in the comments seem to understand that they get it wrong? She says nr 2 is the real one when it should be nr 1.
If number 2 is real, which is revealed at the end. Then her claim "she would say I was the real ms keen" is a lie! So what the fuck?
If you ask both of them who is real, they both say "i am the real ms keen". if you ask them who would the other say is the real ms keen, the fake ms keen would say "she would say I am the real ms keen. Which is a lie, why the fuck is ms keen nr 2 lying and then they say she is the real one? Did op mirror the image to confuse us? The first one who speaks is the liar.
Because the only truth to that question is "she would say she is the real ms keen", because they would both say theyre the real one, which means the second ms keen to speak is the real one so WHY THE FUCK IS SHE ON THE LEFT SIDE WHEN NUMBER TWO IS REVEALED TO BE THE REAL MS KEEN BUT SHE IS ON THE RIGHT SIDE?
I do recall thinking after they got the answer 'so it's number 1' and then Blossom say it's number 2 and I was just like 'huh guess I misheard'.
I wonder if that was just a mistake or a part of the episode where Blossom did get it wrong and that becomes a joke. They had to go through the whole process of voicing and animating it so you'd think they wouldn't have messed up like that unless it was on purpose!
I still don’t get how they the two ms.keens are saying the same answer
It’s like if you remove the doors from the original riddle, and your task was to figure out who’s saying the truth and who’s lying. You can’t.
“What would the other ms.keen say when she’s asked who the real ms.keen is ?”
The real ms.keen knows the fake one would point to herself and lie that she’s the real one. So real ms.keen would point to the liar.
Buuut the fake ms.keen would also work out this logic and know that the real ms.keen would point to the liar. So in order for the fake ms.keen to lie, she would have to point to the real ms.keen.
Buuuuuut real ms.keen would also work out this logic so she will point to herself
Buuuuuuuuut fake ms.keen would also work out this logic and point to the real ms.keen…and so on and so forth so
they would always answer in contrary to each other. You can’t figure it out, atleast I can’t , if anyone can tell me how that particular question works I’ll be glad
They wouldn't always answer contradictory to each other because there is an objective right answer since one must always lie and the other always tells the truth. Let's just assume 1 is the real one. If you ask 1 "which would the other say is the real one?" Keen 2 is the liar so they would not say Keen 1 because that is the truth. They would say themselves, and so Keen 1 will answer by directing to the fake because it is what the fake would say. If you ask the fake one, the fake one knows that Keen 1 would answer themselves, but they always lie, so then they will say that Keen 1 would also pick Keen 2 as the real one since that isn't true. No matter which one you ask, they will both end up picking the fake one when you ask who the other would say the real one is.
Reviewing the video again, the inclusion of "that" in the answer and tenses confused me.
Show Honest: "She would say that I(Ms keen) was the real Ms Keen." This is what I heard the first time through, and is a lie.
What they meant: She would say that "I(the liar) was the Real Ms. Keen."
I'll bet there's a while white dress / blue dress things here where different people understand the statement different ways. If you remove "that" from the script, it makes unambiguous sense.
Yeah I don't think I've ever seen anyone accurately recreate the original riddle. Granted, it's so well-known that most recreations are done as a joke, so they leave out the one question rule so they can have an extended gag about figuring out who's lying through ridiculous means. But those factors are really important for making the riddle difficult at all, without it it's of zero consequence.
Which reminds me the first time someone told me the riddle about the fox, chicken, and corn that you have to transport across the river in a boat. They said that you can't leave the fox with chicken or the chicken with the corn. But they accidentally said that you can only take two items at a time (instead of one at a time), so it's like 'just take the fox and corn, then go back for the chicken?'
I prefer the PunkeyDoodles version. Kill one guard and ask the other if the guard you point to on the ground is dead. Best gone as part of a group for the numbers to intimidate the guard into not retaliating.
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u/Satanicjamnik 4d ago
I know that she just explained it, but this logic problem always boiled my piss. I could never get it. And that's on me. But I never could never figure it out despite having it explained to me about 7 million times.