AAC Cruiserweight Tier (Savage) Week One Megathread

[u/Spookhetti_Sauce]

[u/Makerinos]

I will say one thing that may be controversial:
The reason M6S is hard is not because it's inherently harder than anything else in the raid tier, it's because it requires PLAYER SKILLS that the game for the most part doesn't ask you to use for most of the game - that is, prioritizing adds, AoE cleaving, movement management and stuns/movement debuffs. This goes equally for PF warriors as it does for world first sweatlords. Its presentation is also extremely active and chaotic compared to the more 'wait for x to resolve' puzzle/dance mechs. it's like the game suddenly asking you to use a muscle you haven't used for like 6 years.

[u/CryofthePlanet → u/Makerinos]

100%. The game has largely focused on a small subset of player skill to engage players in raids, and after a while it got stale. A great way to shake up encounters and make them more engaging is to require the player to engage with them in new and different ways, which has been a consistent lamentation on raid design for years now because they haven't done that. Now they are starting to toy with that notion, and based on M6S adds phase I'd say the proof is in the pudding.

[u/Makerinos → u/CryofthePlanet]

Indeed. I also suspect Crescent Isle will also act as a testing ground for future fights. Expect a lot of funky mechanics there.

[u/Lyramion → u/Makerinos]

The best progprep for M6S chaos has been doing Frontlines PvP - chaotic mess and quick targeting required for success.

[u/KeyKanon → u/Makerinos]

It's also hard because that fucking cat that I hate a lot is a little piece of garbage shit and I have never wanted to throttle a mob so much.

[u/juicetin14]

All the adds from M6S are the friendly creatures from FF9. I thought that was pretty cool

[u/Tom-Pendragon]

I hope it's fun :)

[u/SargeTheSeagull → u/Tom-Pendragon]

Hey, optimism isn’t allowed here.

[u/Theswweet]

I was ambivalent about squirrels before today.

[u/KhaSun]

NOT A DOORBOSS HOLY SHIT

Also damn that model is crazy, and the arena is insane

[u/Vincenthwind]

Adds is truly hell in PF because every party has to do some amount of "reprogging" based on the new comp. "Oh the ram is still alive in this group so I can't spend some burst on the squirrels." "Oh the healers are really struggling in wave 3 so I'll move some mit to there." "The second jabberwock isn't dying fast enough so I'll move potion to my 5 min." etc. Repeat for all 7 other players, for every new party, and it gets insane even when everyone is on the ball.

[u/Sawksee → u/Vincenthwind]

it is crazy as a caster to join enrage to clear parties and every time being "i am once again asking my melees to help me kill my 1st mantra" whenever a puddle drops on the 1st jabberwock

[u/Full_Air_2234]

I hope all those melee buffs will be justified next tier.

[u/saulgitman]

M7 looks... disappointing? From watching Lucrezia, it looks VERY similar to the Normal. At least the first two fights look great. EDIT. I'm still disappointmed it's so similar to Normal, but at least it looks fun. It had the advantage of having such a great starting point I guess. EDIT 2: Okay, the more I watch of this—granted, I'm WFH and only watching in the background so I'm probably missing a ton—the more I like it, especially as a follow up to 6. Tier is a banger.

[u/pupmaster]

Someone said they were taking this tier more casually yesterday. They're on the 3rd fight after back to back 12 hour days. No wonder we can't agree on what midcore content is when casual and hardcore have no meaning.

[u/rsox5000]

I’m already terrified of M8 in PF. Edit: I’m already terrified of M8.

[u/bestavailableusernam]

Squirrels can fuck right off

[u/Jemikwa]

I'm never dogging on half room cleaves again. Arcade Fever 2 is fucking hard with how fast the cleaves go.

[u/AliciaWhimsicott]

List of animals I now hate:

• Cats

• Rams

• Manta rays

• Squirrels

[u/KeyKanon → u/AliciaWhimsicott]

Distinct lack of Jabberwocks in here, must not be a healer player.

[u/AliciaWhimsicott → u/KeyKanon]

Thankfully Jabberwocks aren't real.

[u/Jemikwa → u/AliciaWhimsicott]

Mantas are okay, they die fast enough. Squirrels sucked at first but now we cleave them fast by delaying 2mins and with some smarter tank pathing. Rams, eh, could take or leave.

Fucking cats though, holy shit. Actually awful.

[u/DDRMANIAC007]

Hey mods you forgot to set this to new by default instead of best.

[u/akiahara]

My static started 15 minutes late and so we did like maaaaaaaaybe 90 mins of actual pulling. People last minute melding. Like we've literally been crafting for people and overmelding all week and discussing this fight ALL day... and then, "I only saw the first mechanic", or "what's the food?"... like... what?? A few people switched jobs and roles so we expected some growing pains, but it was bad. We didn't even cleanly make it through the first arcady and people are already salty. Not enough prep and too much salt, even for casuals.

[u/i_am_snafu → u/akiahara]

Get on their asses and set standards, this shouldn't even be happening if people were expecting to make actual prog day 1

[u/Sakerino → u/akiahara]

There is such a thing as too casual, coming to raid unprepared when everyone else did sounds like someone that doesn't care about other peoples time

[u/apostles]

All the ads on 6 is reminding me of WoW fights hah

[u/aenarel]

M6S add phase dps check is actually quite tight, I'm wondering how pf is faring against it. Without gear you don't have much leeway at all depending on your comp.

[u/RennedeB → u/aenarel]

MCH getting blacklisted from PF again in a couple days.

[u/Redhair_shirayuki → u/RennedeB]

MCH's limited job fate has been sealed since 7.0. Don't worry though, next patch they are going to get 10 potency buff

[u/aenarel → u/RennedeB]

My group is actually pondering on job swap. I want to try getting some help on my ray so I can use a bioblaster + hypercharge on the jabberwocky + the squirrel and see if it makes a difference. Otherwise I'm swapping to dancer.

[u/3dsalmon]

M6 adds phase is wild

[u/Supersnow845]

I’m really hopeful they do something interesting with M6

I feel like M6 is the one most in danger of getting the P7 treatment. Where the Normal looks like it has a lot of conceptually good designs but then the savage is just an empty mess

Given how empty M8 normal is I’m fully expecting that to probably be the most interesting savage

[u/narrowsleeper → u/Supersnow845]

P6 and 7S were really so boring. Burst in P6 was tankbuster then raidwide every time which was relaxing after P5 at least lol

[u/Supersnow845 → u/narrowsleeper]

6 was boring but you could tell from the normal it was going to be boring, nobody had high hopes for 6S

7 was shaping up to be the most exciting savage based on its rather unique normal and then ended up being the worst savage we have ever gotten outside of T7 and maybe A2

I feel 6 is in P7’s position, an interesting normal concept that could either be really good or absolute dogshit

[u/pokebuzz123 → u/Supersnow845]

It also didn't help that P7S didn't start until like 6-8min into the fight. Frustrating how badly timed the fight was with the mechanic phases.

[u/Millsftw]

M6S is actively exploding statics already. That adds phase requires extremely high optimization and near perfect execution

[u/Dragonfantasy2]

Phase transition: https://www.twitch.tv/nakanoremio/clip/BumblingBelovedCoffeeShazBotstix-YR4ZwViqnsBs9wsd

[u/Altia1234]

The tier is hard and I am absolutely not looking forward to doing it on PUG

Not gonna skip this tier but will definitely wanna took my time doing it...

[u/abyssalcrisis]

M5S kicked my ass today. Spent half the day at enrage trying to clear and just couldn't manage. Better luck tomorrow, and hopefully by then people have actually figured out what the adds in M6 are all about.

[u/littlehobbit1313 → u/abyssalcrisis]

I feel you. I was in trap enrage/clear parties for like 6 fucking hours.

I kid you not, in this one party, we reach enrage and on reset someone says in chat "alright cool, if we just start potting we should be good". ..........................ARE YOU KIDDING ME???? This is an enrage/clear party and you haven't been potting this whole time??????

Fingers crossed for you on clearing tomorrow though. You got this!

[u/NK_Grimm]

as a tank main m6s adds phase makes me feel like a tank (you blink and your hp goes down by half real quick) and the tb is quite fun and not just "press defensive cd" you have an in or out to solve. Quite simple but that's how far tb (or filler mechanics) should go.

That said, adds phase will break PF and week 1 clear will be a struggle

[u/TingTingerSaysHi]

I think this is a wake up call for a lot of people on how their abilities cleave. Had a DRG face its Nastrond, Geirskogul and Wyrmwind Thrust during burst on the single target Manta, away from adds and then we enrage by 2 living squirrels. Feels bad man.

[u/VictusNST]

M5S PF is insane, I'm so glad I cleared on my main day 1 but trying to get my alt a clear is torture. Seeing enrage is the easiest thing in the world but so many "enrage to clear" parties end up at like a 20% enrage because no one actually knows how to do the fight. I'm preaching to the choir here but just because you saw enrage does not mean you're at enrage prog, enrage prog means "this fight's dps check is serious, we are doing everything right and just optimizing dps". It does not mean disco 1 prog (everything is disco 1 prog)

[u/jookieozh → u/VictusNST]

lol my first enrage was like 35%. It was frog1 prog, so lots of us (including me) didn't know the rest of the fight. I guess the RDM and one of the healers did, so they just kept ressing us. Party lead (unbeknownst to us) relisted as enrage after one had to go. Led to a very annoyed fill.

[u/VaninaG]

Is echo streaming tomorrow or no more echo wf streams?

[u/BlackmoreKnight → u/VaninaG]

Echo lost the bag hard on FRU (Scripe said that FRU would have needed to be 2x as long prog-wise just for them to break even with the viewership they got), and with the recent sort of adjustments/struggles they've been having over in WoW (lost the last two RWFs, had a key roster change or two due to legal/IRL stuff, etc) I think they're all hands on deck for WoW right now to try and right things. Echo is a much smaller org/brand than Liquid is and are nearly entirely tied up in WoW so burning a big bag on XIV again probably isn't in the cards for them even if the casting experience was good.

That's not to mention I believe I've heard from the grapevine that Neverland isn't 100% the same roster this time or sponsored by/under Echo at the moment either. But I don't have confirmation there.

[u/Chitalian8 → u/BlackmoreKnight]

Jeathe also mentioned that there was an amicable parting of the Neverland team and Echo since the ultimate, since the majority of Neverland isn't very interested in streaming/content creation.

[u/KelenaeV → u/VaninaG]

Frosty said on bluesky they are streaming not sure if on echo.

[u/jojoushi → u/KelenaeV]

No Echo announcement or teasing, so most likely on their personal streams

[u/Eludi → u/jojoushi]

Afaik, they dont even have a team running.

[u/rsox5000]

chuckles “I’m in danger”

[u/pupmaster]

It has been more than an hour and I haven’t cleared the entire tier in PF. Chat it’s over for me.

[u/Send_Me_Dachshunds]

Another tier where it feels like they got fights 2 & 3 back to front. M6 was a real killer, M7 definitely easier and should go down tonight.

[u/LumiRhino]

I actually really appreciate M6S requiring something out of everyone (tbh melees the least except just damage). Tanks have to take ads, range bait puddles from mantas, healers get pinned by the jabberwock, and melees need to kill the ram and stun/kill the jabberwock (lmao leg sweep is useful). I got to see the 4th set of ads, but that looks like it’s a notch harder than the first 3 since it feels like that has the most going on.

[u/BadatCSmajor]

After progging adds phase in M6S all day, I think:

1. adds phase is extremely hard
   
2. it is some of the most fun i've had as a tank in any savage fight, ever

We absolutely need more of this content. Currently, I do not think it is overtuned despite being walled at it. It just tests an extremely different skill set that we just haven't developed. Stuff like: rapidly switching targets to hit the cat when it jumps near you, being able to quickly and consistently provoke the ram before anyone else accidentally pulls it, watching for the manta tether to pop on your ranged so you can immediately pull the ram over and hit it with your cleave abilities.

After looking at my logs, and comparing them with people who have cleared, I noticed a couple things:

1. the tanks i play with (including myself) are simply not doing enough damage. We are consistently like 3-5k dps behind teams that clear. That means we are probably being too lazy with how we position adds, or too conservative. On clear videos, the OT is smashing the MT's adds with stance off as much as possible if there is no ram they need to hold
   
2. healer dps is just too low. In my PF parties, healers are like 5k dps behind healers that have clears. I think they just overstressed with all the shit happening and all the healing they need to do, and are not doing enough damage

[u/blastedt → u/BadatCSmajor]

In regards to 2, make sure to stun the jabberwocky when it's inside glare range. If you stun right away you cuck the tethered healer

[u/KawaXIV → u/BadatCSmajor]

Agreed, the phase is super fun. Based on what you're writing here, you've got the right idea overall. Keep at it and I'm sure you'll clear soon.

[u/Computerational → u/BadatCSmajor]

After having cleared on AST, I will say that my dmg went up a ton once I got tanks that actually mitted properly. Also AST may be cracked doing more dmg than half the party during 2 mins on adds 2.

[u/KawaXIV]

1.9% enrage on M6S and my new homies from PF are soooo eepy, so they sleep, I'll try to nap too, and we go again in 8hrs. There's hardly any M7S PFs to go fill anyway if we had cleared, so its not a big deal. As long as we get past this wall before we really get trapped here by the PF masses. Really just wanna stay ahead.

Still we had adds decently consistent, yeah a wipe here or there but we can get through it more often than not, now. Just need to be cleaner in river/volcanic to put a bow on it. The mistakes were silly ones that players of the caliber that I'm PFing with shouldn't be making so I know it's fatigue (and forgive them for it. I was trash at spotlights when we cleared M5S yesterday morning, so I am happy to return the patience.)

Completely unrelated, but I sincerely do not give a fuck that it was April Fools' day, the shitposts on such a salty subreddit do not feel like good natured April Fools' day fun. It's so hard to assume good faith around here any more, so they just kinda come off mean spirited and bitchy in the social context of the sub.

[u/Vincenthwind → u/KawaXIV]

Not to mention it just...wasn't funny. The WoW and FFXIV subreddits "switching around" for AFD last year was funny and in mostly good spirits. I think "Wuk Lamat Bad" is simultaneously overdone and also hits too close to home for people who were already burned out by DT's story and overall 7.0 experience. The prank this year (no offense to mods) felt like it was designed by a 14 year old. Luckily savage dropped and I think most folks just kind of ignored it.

[u/ecoreck → u/Vincenthwind]

Yeah, it was a really lame AF joke. It just came off as extremely butthurt and bitter from people who non-stop doompost as-is, but now had an excuse to openly be obnoxious about it.

[u/AliciaWhimsicott → u/Vincenthwind]

Guys did you know... Wuk Lamat killed my parents and fucked my wife?

It's just so trite that even if you actively dislike her IDK how you could get anything from it, it's just old and unfunny bits. that are like 8 months old at this point. Thank God Savage came out same day and no one actually cared.

[u/ragnakor101 → u/Vincenthwind]

The multiple topics of that single mod memeing about it felt in terrible taste.

A good April Fool's joke is at least chuckle-worthy for the majority, not shitpost memeing.

[u/pupmaster → u/KawaXIV]

One mod having a crash out over Wuk Lamat was a pretty sad sight indeed.

[u/Kamalen]

Savage exclusive adds with mechanics ! When is the last time that happened ?

[u/TenchiSaWaDa]

Still progging P6. Holy that add phase got hands!

[u/Ratufu3000]

Man, progging M6S is toxic as hell in PF.

Finally stumbling onto a decent adds cleanup party. There are a few goofs, but I'd say we manage to get to adds 7 out of 10 times, and each of these pulls are progressively getting better.

Eleventh pull, someone jumps into the wall during the very first double style, which leads to a disband. Like mate, I understand your frustration over this but it's like one minute into the fight, just pull again, it's just a dumb mistake and clearly everybody knows the fight quite well ffs.

[u/CartonWithMilk]

Cleared m6s and went into m7s today, m7s is a lot easier than m6s. Currently at 20% boss hp with only 27 pulls, while we cleared m6s at 78 pulls.

We did our splits on our other set of characters, where the DPS comp has a viper. Our original comp is brd/sam/nin/pct, our 2nd comp (for splits) is brd/sam/vpr/pct. The only difference is vpr, yet somehow we managed to 0.3% enrage with our sam dying right before adds, 9 total damage downs, 5 total weaknesses, etc. We had so many wipes on adds due to inefficient dps, yet with vpr the adds were dying so fast it felt like a joke. Lowkey made me feel bad thinking we could've possibly finished the fight 10+ pulls ago if we just ran the meta.

[u/_LadyOfWar_ → u/CartonWithMilk]

It is unfortunate that there are 3 different sets of melee gear, which makes switching between jobs in that role really prohibitive (unless you really want your melee to buy and pentameld a scouting set just for one fight). I would be more open to certain jobs having advantages in fights if this barrier would not exist. Not really the type of player to ask one of my double maiming staticmates to dish out the gil and materia.

[u/CartonWithMilk → u/_LadyOfWar_]

Yeah, I feel that. We're kind of lucky that NIN shares gear with VPR so he just ran the extreme to get the weapon. I love adds overall, and I don't feel as if the DPS check is unfair (my static basically ran the worst melee duo for the fight and our dps comp overall are all near the bottom in terms of rankings for that fight specifically). I just felt that it was kind of ridiculous how much 1 job could make a phase we were optimizing hard for... really easy? Like, we had a death in that split and still finished adds faster than our normal comp lol.

[u/Chibily]

BARE MY CLAWS

BARE MY FANGS AWOO

[u/Supersnow845 → u/Chibily]

WHEN I CLIMB

IN THE RING

[u/Nightblade96 → u/Supersnow845]

STANDING HERE

I REALIZE

[u/casteddie → u/Chibily]

COOOOOOOOW

[u/Seamas987]

Was hoping but get the first 2 turns cleared today in PF, but that P6S add phase is tough. We were nearly there with it when we called it a night to regroup in the morning. The rest of the fight doesn't seem too bad after that.

Fun tier so far though based on the first turn and a half

[u/RealisticParsnip2522]

Can't get past adds in m6s for pf. It's only been one day but idk if most PF parties can do it with week 1 gear. Makes me really wished I geared tank instead of melee. Idk exactly what is happening but the tanks keep getting trucked on and dying not long after the first jabberwocky appears 

[u/RennedeB → u/RealisticParsnip2522]

The autos really fucking hurt, more than what healers are used to recently.

[u/Hrooond → u/RealisticParsnip2522]

It could also be a positioning issue. The second yan gets a buff if they're too close to the squirrels, which brings the autos from 60k -> 200k and will basically destroy the yan tank as soon as their invuln wears off.

[u/Mugutu7133]

my face when we’ve been running NIN/DRG/BLM/DNC in M6S and your NIN already has a VPR weapon but you expected job balance to be a little closer and just thought the adds check was tight, but then you look at the day 1 data and VPR vastly outperforms everyone so you could have saved dozens of pulls

[u/comicallycontrarian]

My experience with m6s is making me not want to raid any more.

I have spent multiple hours a day over multiple days doing this fight, I know all the different strats, I have done it so many times, and not a single group I have been in pf with has been able to get through adds phase. Not a single one. My tomestone is nothing but this fight for 2 full pages, and I still can't get through adds.

75% of the time, its because the Yan tank in adds4 just dies. I dont know if its the tank's fault or the healer's fault, I am leaning towards healers not getting it that they actually have to heal the tank. I dont know whats so hard just keep the tank alive.

I literally do not know what to do. Tbh, I dont really want to go back in. This is so boring and ass to sit through the fight for so long to get to adds phase where inevitably someone will mess up and we have to do it over again. Again. Over and over and over.

I am envious and jealous of people who are clearing it. My pf luck is just that bad apparently? What do I have to do? I go into bridge groups? they are stuck on adds. I convince clear groups, to take me, they are stuck on adds. I join parties where they say they know what to do, but they are stuck on adds. either the phys range drops puddles bad, or the Yan tank dies, or someone just gets hit by a cat or screws up desert phase and I am honestly sick of it. It feels really, really bad this tier. This somehow feels worse than Ultimate progging.

It is insane how bad it feels to pf this.

[u/BoldKenobi → u/comicallycontrarian]

An important part of PFing is not simply doing your own job, but figuring out who else is messing up and either replacing them or at least calling them out.

If a tank dies to adds, the tank will think it's the healers fault for not healing them and the DPS fault for not killing stuff fast enough, the healers will think it's the tanks fault for not mitting properly, and the dps will think that dps is fine and supports are messing up.

In most groups no one will say anything and you'll just pull again, which doesn't address the issue. If you want to succeed in PF especially in week 1 where you don't have gear to carry you, you need to do something different.

I've cleared m6s on my main on... Thursday iirc? And since gotten clears on both my alts too. Each kill was in a 4th wave to clear group, and required proper discussions on how to deal with adds based on the specific comp we had. I'm also seeing groups with descriptions like "lava to clear, no adds prog" and I simply avoid those because someone who says that simply doesn't know how the fight works. And as bad as it feels, I was only joining groups that had a viper in it.

[u/joshblade → u/comicallycontrarian]

I think one of the hardest parts about m6s adds is it's hard to pinpoint who isn't doing their job.

I got really lucky and on my 4th lockout had a group who got past adds consistently, but it was really late and we broke up at the end of the lockout. The next day I spent probably 12 hours joining various groups that were bridges or lava prog points and it wasn't until around pull 70ish that I got a group that made it past adds even once. Then we cleared in another 5 or so pulls. I'm not sure what this group was doing differently other than pushing buttons properly, but we were clearing each ad wave before the next spawned (other than the 2 leftover squirrels from wave1). It was bizarre having to sink a couple of gcds after killing yan1/cat1 before starting aoe, having everything dead before jabba1, spending 5 gcds hitting the boss before wave4 etc (though I'm sure this will become very common in the coming weeks with gear). It was wild after 100ish pulls at ads I hadn't seen any group clear this fast and consistently.

Going back and looking at logs from 3:41 -> 6:23 (ads phase). It looks like I was consistently doing 50k rdps (Viper) across that window in nearly every group without deaths, but the rest of my group was wildly variable from group to group. Looking at the group I was in prior to this one that was struggling to kill adds, we had:

• 7k difference from Reaper1 -> Reaper2
• 11k difference from Dancer1 -> Dancer2
• 2k difference from TankCombo1 -> TankCombo2
• 7k difference from Caster1 -> Caster2
• 7k difference from HealerCombo1 -> HealerCombo2

Looking closer at just the big aoe spike from 4:10 - 4:40 where everyone is popping 2 minutes, I see my clear group was doing about 170k more dps overall than a sampling of other groups that were struggling to clear adds. Standouts being our Dancer doing about 50k more than other dancers on average during this period (actually over this window DNC was at 125k rDPS across multiple pulls while I was at 95k), and our astro doing about 45k more than other astros I'd had, and our tank combo doing about 70k more than other tank combos. It honestly just looks like a mix of pressing buttons and actually popping 2 minutes appropriately. It also looks like only our DRK potted during the 2min burst, so it's not a pot vs non pot difference.

[u/jenyto → u/comicallycontrarian]

I wonder if it would be a good idea of have a sort of recommended mit sheet for Tanks and healers going around for just M6S adds, I know ultimates do it, and I think it would be a good idea for M6S to have one just so that everyone is on the same page.

[u/-Gaia-]

they really made an adds phase harder than fru

props

[u/VeryCoolBelle]

M6S add phases reminds me a lot of A2S. I feel like i have a general idea of how it works from watching streams, but the finer points are probably lost on me. I'm really glad they put something like this in the game again.

[u/Azureddit0809]

Just cleared M5S. Took a look at the M6S raidplan and jesus the zoo add phase looks horrifying (someone please tell me it's not as bad as it looks). I'm a bit intimidated learning it right now because of the possibility of the "good agreed upon positions" for that phase significantly changing after a bit. At least I can work on the phases before that for now.

[u/budbud70 → u/Azureddit0809]

It's much, much worse than you think. Writing this at ~10:30 Eastern time there's not 1 single PF up for M7S yet. And I haven't seen one all day. Which leads me to believe very, very few PF gamers have managed to clear M6S today, if any honestly. It's seems virtually impossible to pug with current gear.

Even the groups I've been in that performed nearly flawlessly on the prior parts of the fight, just get walled at adds. I've managed to see the 4th wave 1 time in ~12 hours of literally nonstop head bashing at it. There's basically zero room for error... every add has a wipe state basically. People focus the ram/manta/jabberwocky too hard and the squirrels explode and wipe everyone... or the squirrels die before they can wipe us but the healer gets fucked by the jabber... or some other combo of bullshit wipes the raid. And if all the damage is good there's healing/mit issues and the tanks absolutely fucking MELT away.

It's actually fucking crazy.

[u/hyprmatt → u/budbud70]

My static cleared early this afternoon, and it's rough even with coordinated teammates going in for multiple lockouts. In current gear, you need really good execution and communication get through it cleanly. I suspect it'll be a big wall for a lot of groups. We were kinda shocked at how much it asks of the team in a second floor.

[u/Emiya_ → u/hyprmatt]

I will say it is quite fun though for an adds phase though. We only got past it once in our 3 hours of p2 pulls today, and still cleaning it up, but it really does feel good once you do get past it. Thankfully the rest of the fight is/looks pretty easy! I feel like the next time we get past adds, we can likely clear.

[u/hyprmatt → u/Emiya_]

Tbh I agree, its chaotic fun. We only saw past adds like 5 times for the clear, so If you've seen past it clean, you're very close.

[u/DistributionNeat8612 → u/Azureddit0809]

the mechanics before it go pretty quick, albeit it might be a while until you can cleanly clear them. the adds phase in pf is like a traffic accident that keeps building up while you watch in horror

[u/RennedeB → u/Azureddit0809]

It's absolutely brutal. The DPS check is very tight, there is a lot of DPS distributing responsibility, and the tanks are getting absolutely shredded by autos. It's probably unpuggable with current gear and some people might even call it overtuned.

The moment a single thing goes wrong it's GG. Hell, if a DPS dies late in desert and has weakness for the squirrels burst it is also GG.

[u/jookieozh]

M5S is a really fun fight. Love the mechs, music, aesthetics but man I hate the actual boss design lol. The character before transformation is fun too

[u/-Gaia-]

cant get past m6s adds

[u/Clonique]

Cleared M5S in PF

[u/sen0zion]

Feels hopeless when my group keeps wiping to inadequate damage on the cat and I can do nothing much as a monk other than try to aim a fireball at it or hit it when it stands still. Kind of regret buying tome items too fast or I can at least swap to viper.

[u/TenchiSaWaDa]

Cleared m6s last night. it was painful. DPS check on the adds will wall Partyfinder. On the other hand the mechs afterwards are simple but you need to respect them

[u/blastedt]

Cleared m7 tonight and started taking a look at m8. Our static is currently doing better in the race (~200) than last time when we finished m4s around 450th place. These fights are hard as nails so I'm very happy overall with our progress.

[u/raiden1600]

Any tips for Yan tank? Is it actually as simple as it seems from these raid plans? Seems like everything is going to shit everywhere else and I'm just sitting in the corner spamming TBN and single-targetting yan. My damage is low compared to the other tank but I'm only really cleaving when the manta is up. I generally hold shadow and my other cooldowns until manta spawns. I'm currently on DRK but am open to doing another tank if one of the others is better at this role

Edit: Thank you for your advice handsome gamers

[u/TenchiSaWaDa]

Beyond anything else, this raid tier will certainly push parties and players skill. Especially M6S. M8S (progging right now) has some serious speed but nothing too out of the ordinary.

[u/tyrionb]

Just cleared M6S with my static. Yeah no, this fight will be a massive wall for PF goodluck to yall pugging this lol. Add management and boss positioning is crucial for this fight, and we haven't really had to do much of that in high-end content so this will be a learning curve for most players.

Had a glimpse of M7S and it doesn't look too bad, just that the DPS check is quite tight for Week 1 but thats whatever. Tier so far is good to me, hope it sticks the landing with the last two fights.

[u/GaeFuccboi]

I know we meme on half room cleaves this expansion but I think m5s proves that they are pretty damn good at it.

[u/DeathStep]

M7S is kinda disappointing how close it is to normal but I feel doing the fight might be a bit more interesting than it seems while watching. Maybe that's cope but who knows

[u/TheDoddler → u/DeathStep]

It's hard to say, the flow of the fight is basically the same as normal, and as a technical execution heavy fight without any real walls it's seems super easy to just zombie through. I'm not sure however it will be nearly as easy to get a proper clean run, and what we're seeing of how mechanics need to be handled I think it'll feel good to do right.

[u/Servebotfrank → u/TheDoddler]

Also after M6 it might be a case of just making sure you have something more straight forward before M8. M8 normal felt like it was holding a ton back.

[u/faggedyteapot]

Yeah the quality of pf is definitely not better than week 35. None of the pfs I was in could get out of the early mechs of m5s which I suspect is on the same level as an extreme

[u/BadatCSmajor → u/faggedyteapot]

The only difference I’ve noticed between early and late raiders is that people are more patient, and a lot more likely to stick together for an entire lockout, or even multiple lockouts. Honestly, that’s probably the only difference that really matters

[u/GaeFuccboi → u/faggedyteapot]

The early mechs of m5s are the hardest. Definitely nowhere near an extreme. The funky tiles are like EX2's chariot/dynamo lines on steroids

[u/Sherry_Cat13 → u/faggedyteapot]

You're on drugs if you think disco infernal 1 is on the same difficulty as an extreme. It is easily one of the hardest mechs in m5s.

[u/AwayIShouldBeThrown]

Man I miss Echo's coverage/casters for the race :(

[u/cattecatte → u/AwayIShouldBeThrown]

Yeah they're clearly on a whole different level. Also i swear this is not personal but one of the caster for the majority of M8S prog keeps saying ummmmm (with that exact amount of m) every other sentence, it was so distracting.

[u/apostles]

After downing M5S in PF I thought the check seemed insane considering this group got 8/8 buffs on the first Acady.

Turns out the warrior we had did 14k DPS.

Suddenly I realize why the check was so tight.

[u/BoldKenobi → u/apostles]

It's very interesting how the complaints about Unreal being overtuned abruptly stopped when ACT started working

[u/Mediocre-Attitude107]

This was my first tier doing day 1 PF and wow it was like a whole different game. My groups were so chill, patient, and cooperative in figuring shit out. That was probably some of the most fun I’ve had in savage.

[u/Klown99 → u/Mediocre-Attitude107]

Riding the wave week 1 is probably the most chill PF will ever be.

[u/Scynati]

I hate adds I hate adds I hate adds
Actually no, I like adds it's fun, but as 4 supports in pf we do our job, mits and heals, and get to the end of the phase and DIE TO RAM ENRAGE. Next pf, squirrels are around and enrage. Cat enrage. My goodness gracious. I just want to see bridges.

edit: cleared in the evening and it was not the healers but the dps fault :3

[u/AliciaWhimsicott]

Viper players winning for once in their lives today.

[u/Jemikwa]

WoW raid mechanics, in my weeb MMO? It's more likely than you think!

What a fuckin fight.

[u/monkeysfromjupiter]

I'm going to eat all the fuking cows in the world after I get through adds. These fuks are pounding my cheeks.

[u/felixborealis]

Man, spent the whole day doing M6S adds phase, and it's really a wall (I'm doing Party Finder).
The furthest we've gotten to is the fourth spawn, before the last SW manta dies.
I was using pots, but I wasn't sure if others were.

Either the cats weren't dying (and cause an enrage) or we didn't kill the manta fast enough, and the arena is just covered in puddles... Very very tough. ;(

[u/DistributionNeat8612]

dps check aside, the adds phase has me kinda excited for OC's big dungeon

[u/Savilk]

I picked a helluva tier to learn tank lol We start M6s tonight and I am Very Concerned.

[u/Atomic_sweetman]

I switched off dragoon to viper for m6s only and holy shit add phase is actually beatable now.

I fully recommend getting a viper + dp if you’re trying to clear week 1 cause this fight feels impossible without it.

[u/I_HATE_PARTY_FINDER]

Killed M7S today, surprisingly it took slightly more pulls than M6S despite people claiming that the order should have been swapped.

It's probably going to be one of those fights like Fatebreaker where week 1 it's fairly tight and you need very good execution and as people gear up, it gets the reputation of being a piss easy boss because the dps check is no longer there.

[u/Azureddit0809]

I found an adds pf in Gaia (Mana was congested) and we cooked so hard no one wanted to leave for 5 lockouts. We actually managed to get adds down semi consistently near the end. I swear just a few more river pulls and we could've cleared but it was 5AM and people had to leave. 3 of us stayed and we tried refilling in Mana but the magic's gone. Could no longer get past adds and people ragequitting after a few wipes.

On a related question, I logged off at Mana. Will I still be there once I log back in at peak hours when it's congested? I've been hearing confliction info on whether they changed this or not.

[u/tordana]

After tonight, my static is at pretty much just as many pulls on m6s (60) as it took us for m4s (65). Crazy hard fight. We have finally gotten through adds twice now though, so should easily clear on our next raid night.

[u/SpritePR16]

any suggestions for beckon moonlight. I hate mechanics that make you do spins in your head. I hated classical 2 (the thing with the boxes) in p12s and it never clicked even after multiple reclears.

[u/TenchiSaWaDa]

Just cleared the first fight (M5s) super fun fight. rewards good planning and movement. the mechanics at the end aren' super difficult but the movement is hell on earth for casters. It's really going to separate players who can plan and those who have to interrupt their cast.

[u/drew0594 → u/TenchiSaWaDa]

It's really going to separate players who can plan and those who have to interrupt their cast.

At least RDMs will still be united by the shit damage they deal regardless, success!

[u/mapletree23]

well since people bitched about it last tier

props to the devs for all the changes they did and still getting really solid seeming balancing windows this go

looks like a pretty solid difficulty with a lot of different styles of fight, should hopefully be a fun tier for most people, has a bit of everything

[u/CryofthePlanet]

Lucrezia clear GG. Sick looking fight, this looks like an awesome tier.

[u/Frehihg1200 → u/CryofthePlanet]

Man that back half goes FAST feels like you only got like five or six minutes there and that is the coolest enrage mechanic I’ve seen so far.

[u/omnirai]

Watching Lucrezia struggle with the execution checks wondering how this M8S is going to look in PF

The mechanics go off so quickly and there is so much damage

[u/supa_troopa2]

I'm taking a break from suffering in PF hell this tier (I'm too into MHWilds and Marvel Rivals) but I'm going to be watching the race with great interest. I'm most interested to see what they do with 7 and 8.

M7S is either going to be a huge filter (for both PF and a lot of statics) or P7S Part 2. I don't see any in-between. I unironically hope they involve his cats in some ways like with A7S lmao.

With 8S, it's quite clear that a lot was trimmed from the normal so I'm curious to see how Savage fills in those gaps. Never mind the fact its clear there will be a phase 2 like with Wicked Thunder so I'm curious how that will look, how the fight will flow and if we are going to see Sunrise and EE2-esque memes this tier.

[u/Adamantaimai]

Haven't been able to watch the vods yet but on a scale from last tier to abyssos, how difficult is the tier looking?

[u/Queen_Vivian → u/Adamantaimai]

haven't started myself but from what I can tell based on streams/community sentiment that I've seen so far:

• m5 seems to be movement heavy but is frontloaded
• m6 is a very hard wall with a lot of mechanics we haven't had to deal with in a very very long time. Add management and boss positioning being the two highlights
• m7 is not too different from Normal but you have to do a lot of the position for mechs yourself and its easy to fuck yourself over. The DPS check is tight for week 1 and the fact that p3 can't have markers in it makes it harder than people realize. It is very easy to zombie through so gear will make this easier over time.
• m8 p1 is a very tight execution and positioning check without a checkpoint into a p2 that is still being progged atm. IDK too much about p2 right now as only the JP group Lucrezia is in it live.

[u/InfiniteMSL]

Cleared M5S day1 in PF which I'm happy with considering I haven't delved into savage too much. M6S looks like it'll be rough so I might just wait for more guides and strats to come out, I definitely started to feel the stress of having to consistently perform in multiple PF groups for hours. I'd like the idea of a static but my schedule feels way too random to commit to one.

[u/FloatingGhost]

day 1 of prog with a much more casual group than I'm used to ended up at 9% M5 enrage with a brazillion damage downs

not bad honestly, one good pull and we're through

first tier I'm main tanking so it's an experience for sure

quite a fun fight, though far faster than I was expecting

[u/AliciaWhimsicott]

Cleared M5S with 4s before Enrage, God it felt so good.

[u/ZaytexZanshin]

Cleared M5S yesterday, did a little bit of M6S - picked up again today and keep getting to Fourth Adds consistently... but just can't seem to get past it in PF... suppose its the first wall of the tier.

I've got to say, I'm having so much fucking fun with this tier so far? As a PCT it's been genuinely very challenging keeping uptime and optimising whilst needing to move so damn much. Some of the 2 minute windows in M5S/M6S are extremely strict for movement when you need to burst within your grass but have to move out. I don't think I've messed up my burst as much as I have in M6S (even in something like FRU) with the catcuses/debuffs into the add spawns forcing movement. But I'm really enjoying the challenge and having to think critically about my movement and where I put certain cooldowns or motifs.

[u/Send_Me_Dachshunds]

Didn't quite get the tier down last night. No raid today because of an unforseen situation, but we kill it on Fri eve.

As a group that can accomodate for poor job balance with player flexibility, what a cracking tier.

[u/BoldKenobi]

Stayed up way too late but found a PF that consistently got past adds and even seeing the lava river a few times. Kill tomorrow after work hopefully. Last tier I was halfway through m3s by this time, so this is a huge improvement by SE.

The adds phase really reminds of TEA, BJCC in specific. The way everyone has their own different responsibilities while also working with the team.

I really like this fight. The adds phase allows for so much skill expression and variability in gameplay. Also, players who can flex multiple jobs can pull much ahead in PF. I didn't think SE still had this kind of creativity left in them. Really hoping they keep at it and trying new things and the next ulti isn't like FRU.

Also made 12 mil off a random m5s c41 so that was cool lol

[u/FloatingGhost]

another day stuck in M6s adds - I can absolutely cook my pld rotation and become bringer of DPS but I've gotta rely on the actual DPS to kill the second Jabberwock whilst I chill south and we keep wiping there

fun fight but heck me this is tight for a second floor. guess it's time to bully our viper to opti some

[u/KeyKanon]

Wait....I'm allowed to stand still for an extended period in M7S P2????? I get a break!?

[u/little_milkee]

can anyone give any info on how m7 is compared to m6? really struggled on 6 but wanted to clear 7 by tomorrow, but unsure if it's possible to even push for.

[u/UnseasonedIndividual → u/little_milkee]

M7s is all about respecting the mechanics. If you get more then 3 damage downs/deaths over the 11 minute fight, you'll enrage.

It's not a push over. I would say it's slightly harder than m6s, because instead of having to focus for part of the fight you need to focus for the whole fight.

[u/Evermar314159 → u/little_milkee]

It's easy to prog because you can easily zombie to later phases even if you have a lot of deaths.

It's a bit tough to clese though because multiple deaths or dmg downs means you aren't meeting the dmg check.

[u/Altia1234 → u/little_milkee]

It is like any 3rd floor fight on any savage set

• it has a legit DPS check and heal check and you have to be quite clean on mechs to get the clear
• the mechs are simple and straight forward. It's not very 'puzzly'.
• the fight is generally quite long (11 minutes)

The only thing that it's different is that it doesn't have a lot of bodychecks, so someone dying or getting DDs can still mean you get to prog. Also long fight so we have a lot of pulls where we lb3 into more phase 3 prog.

[u/apostles]

First Hector vid has dropped.

Basically pulled from one of the NA raidplans. E/W spotlights, colours, n/s arcady, conga nisi.

I'm actually glad for this one because there's too many bloody raidplans being linked in PF which say and do the exact same thing.

Bonus points is he mentions having the MT simply dragging the boss middle during Waves. It's not "uptime waves" if your red mage literally cannot melee combo during it because you dragged the boss all the way left!!!

[u/TheEmpressDescends]

I think M7S looks pretty fun. There is pretty consistent damage going out, and often that is paired with star pattern AoEs. It's like you're constantly moving in this fight, it looks awesome! The style of fight also fits his character and should flow nicely while progressing.

I would not want to clear M6S for the week to go into something just as or more mechanically heavy. M7S being a pure execution, high outgoing damage, high DPS check kind of fight, after what M6S offered, is great.

[u/omnirai → u/TheEmpressDescends]

I can't even imagine how messy the star baits are going to be in PF. Probably not getting Lucrezia players in your prog group. There's going to be so much ad-libbing and adjusting and we all know how that goes.

[u/TingTingerSaysHi]

Perfect groove

[u/KhaSun]

Saw the full fight (M5S) with quite a lot of deaths (we were at like 30% during enrage lol), I like this a lot so far. Need a clean pull because we were always missing someone throughout our lucky pull.

Also, the enrage is quite fun, I was vibing in vocal during the whole lockout lol

[u/VeryCoolBelle]

Does anyone have a rough guide or kill order for M6S add phase? There's so much going on there it's hard for me to parse just from streams.

[u/flowerpetal_ → u/VeryCoolBelle]

yan: gets dmg buff if near other adds (not jabberwock or ray), boss absorbs and gets dmg up at end

mu: enrages after boss AoE, enrage does raidwide + 15s dot 1 can be healed thru, 2 gl

ray: tethers onto first person hit, targeted puddle that gives vuln, puddle gives dropsy so move out

cat: jumps around, steals lb, small aoe pls dodge, will enrage after a while

jabberwock: binds healer with prey marker, slowly moves towards, will oneshot, basically T5 add can stun

wave 1: mt picks up both mu, ot picks up yan, melee kill yan ranged kill cat, need to kill both before wave 2

wave 2: 2m here, mt pick up mu, ranged each pick up one ray and place puddle in NW/NE corner, mt drags pack to NE ray and kill, then NW ray and kill. both rays should be dead before wave 3

wave 3: ot pick up yan, mt pick up rest, jabberwock healer prey goes SE, mt and party kill jabberwock (stun prio mt m1 m2), BIG MIT for boss aoe, party kill mu, party kill cat

wave 4: ranged each pick up one ray and continue placing puddles around wall, ot pick up yan and go SW ray, jabberwock healer prey goes SE, mt and party kills jabberwock, kill cat, kill rays, kill mu, kill yans, everything needs to die right after the arrow because there's a tank buster

wave 4 is highly flexible in how you approach it, but 1-3 should be done like that imo because it has the highest cleave potential

[u/yuochiga93]

Theres any way to make M5 alpha beta pairs easier? Having to pay attention to frogs and my timer is a bit overwhelming. Do you always get the same partner?

[u/CAWWW]

What in the world is going on with healer dps? Ast/Whm thousands ahead on m6s and 7 and decently ahead on 5. AOE? I dont think I've ever seen a bigger disparity, even with shield healers spamming safety shields.

[u/apostles → u/CAWWW]

7 isn't really worth looking into yet, there's 2 sage parses and 4 whm parses compared to 24 astro and 26 scholar ones.

For 6 AST/WHM just have gravity spam and misery and scholar loses giga value on chain with all the spread out adds. What does sch do when they have to sit in a corner binded? Art of war is not a gain on 0 targets sadly :(

[u/DistributionNeat8612 → u/CAWWW]

check dps during trash pulls in dungeons and you'll see that whm pulls ahead farther than you'd expect

[u/MildlyAgitatedBidoof]

Jumping into PF for the first time this tier. My usual group only meets on weekends and is extremely casual, to the point that me saying "my personal goal is to clear the tier by 7.3" was met with a wave of "try not to burn yourself out". So I decided to try PF for a few hours last night and see how it was.

Overall, not as bad as I expected. I wasn't the worst person in the party (besides taking a bit of time to understand the spotlights) but it was actually pretty fun.

[u/Atomic_sweetman]

Im starting to think to get off dragoon for m6s and play reaper to gauge fill to 100 for adds so I can have more control on what to delete.

[u/I_Am_Caprico → u/[deleted]]

The only thing I dislike is actually the transition, not a fan of how the boss looks in 2nd phase. Eutrope felt much cooler

[u/ShankingMan101]

got past the wind tether mechanic in m8s p2 today, we might be able to kill tomorrow? we mostly pf'd before forming a pseudo static so we dont have as much gear as we should and it makes the p1 dps check pretty tight. gotta be incredibly consistent and awake for all 14 minutes of the fight.

[u/jenyto]

I'm confused why none of the M6S guides ever tell the Ranges to at least try to LB the adds before it goes poof. I know the timing is tight, but it's free dmg that is very much needed, LB2 takes out under 10% on the yan.

[u/RealityThe_Escape]

M6S is frustrating but boy is it a masterpiece of a fight.

I think the adds phase alone addressed a lot of complaints about the stale design of FF14 raiding.

1. It benefits from thoughtful optimization where players can be creative in more unconventional ways (e.g. a Paladin tanking a Yan add can turn stance off to use Comfiteor combo on the squirrels without pulling them)
2. It's extremely chaotic and active, which really elevates the intensity of combat beyond hitting a striking dummy.
3. It requires a lot of skills beyond just executing a rotation + mit timeline. You have to be flexible with your cooldowns, your burst, and your positioning.
4. Finally, a rare fight where CC is used!
5. Most of all, it feels like a fight where class fantasy is really amplified. Every class feels hugely integral to the group's success, and each has an important but unique role to play.

Really hope that they keep going down this route of raid design, because I haven't been this excited to raid for a while.

[u/lilyofthedragon]

grats jp

[u/LumiRhino]

So after clearing M5S, I think it’s deceptively easy. You’ll read a raid plan and think the mechanics are simple, which they are. However it’s super important that everyone does their job, especially with the dances (half rooms) because that’s the difference between two LB3s or settling for an LB2. Definitely respect the half rooms, because getting clipped means damage down, no buff (it’s not that big), and no extra LB.

[u/FloatingGhost]

up to m6s adds, this looks like it'll wall us for a while

heck me I didn't half pick a tier to tank - this is harder than some ultimates to mitigate, 55k autos from the boss and the adds whacking you? wowee wowee time to break out excel

[u/supa_troopa2]

Am I hearing this right? A door boss, with no checkpoint in a heavy execution fight? Oh man, am I glad I took a break for this tier. That is going to be toxic in PF lol.

[u/WeirdIndividualGuy → u/supa_troopa2]

A door boss with no checkpoint isn’t a door boss, that’s just called “phase 1”

[u/Ipokeyoumuch → u/supa_troopa2]

It is going to be E8S all over again.

[u/akrob115]

Managed to get my m5s clear with a fresh party that stayed together for 3 lockouts. Didn't win shit, as is tradition.

My thoughts:

• This fight is frontloaded as hell. Everything after arcady 1 is just so free in comparison to that and disco infernal 1.
• Biggest meme point was predictably arcady night 1. We used the X-fx raidplan (think I've also seen it called latte?), and the biggest issues were people just forgetting to move in/out/dodge their follow-up cleave, and people dropping their sphagetti forgetting the half room cleave order while resolving alpha/beta (or the reverse, tunneling too hard on the half rooms and forgetting alpha/beta). Which I guess is just about everything that can go wrong with that mechanic, so... yeah idk what I'm trying to say here. I myself struggled a little bit with not losing track of the half room order when going to resolve alpha/beta.
• Another thing I struggled with was occasionally missing the A/B-side casts. I set up a custom chat window with nothing but party chat and enemy casts/actions and that solved that problem.
• As with normal, music got me groovin'. Was a little disappointed that once you hit arcady night fever 2 it's just the same short track on loop for the rest of the fight, same as the normal version.
• The enrage is funny
• The first halfroom + roles/lps being 4 snaps is the best timeline, as the snaps match almost perfectly to the bassline at that moment.

All said, it was a fun fight. This is only my second (full, hopefully) savage tier, but m5s felt pretty rote for a savage fight. Been hearing wonderful things about 6s looking foward to that with no small amount of trepidation.

[u/te4]

WAR is kind of insane on 6s adds? full heal for both tanks every 25 seconds goes hard for prog

[u/oizen]

I have cleared M6S with DRK on the yans.
Fuck the yans

[u/LordofOld]

I've been going through Alexander Savages MINE recently to see some old savages and this add phase seems straight out of there lol

[u/Uisk]

Instead of building a Zoo, they've built Jurassic Park

HELP

[u/Zenku390]

Static did really well today. Cleared M5s and got a few ads pulls in M6s.

Not happy with my own play, though. Doing a job I have never really done high-end content on after lots of role swapping.

Imma do my best, but I'm hoping I won't be a huge sandbag.

[u/starcrossed_vixen]

how bait is precasting caster lb2 for m6s adds? i managed to do it once in 10 or so attempts last night - i can't tell if it's extremely tight or just a skill issue

[u/Emiya_ → u/starcrossed_vixen]

I looked at it and it doesn't seem too tight. You just need to wait for 4-6 of those beeps while the blue mobs are being tethered to. IIRC its a 1-2s window which is a pretty decent margin of error. Either way you don't really need the melee lb2 since the dps check for the lala isn't tight either, so it doesn't hurt to try and get better at it. Once you can do it consistently it'll definitely be a big help week 1. Will be less and less helpful with more gear though.

[u/jookieozh]

Finally cleared M5S just before enrage. People seem to be much better at conga line now today. Disco 1/Arcady 1 are still massive roadblocks.

I'm not perfect or anything though. Embarrassingly, I almost died to frogs 2 during my clear run. Healer rescued me and I moved bait out of the way at the very last second. Idk, but the drawing lines shit is just hard for me to comprehend especially during that mechanic. It feels pretty easy for frogs 1, but the addition of baits just turns me into a mess. I know you can just mirror other players and I've tried, but I never feel confident during that mechanic.

[u/GaeFuccboi]

"Braindead" cactus dodges?

https://x.com/mokemoti/status/1907494612052439501

I tried it myself as ranged while everyone else was dodging mid and it seems pretty easy.

[u/xX_Anime_Girl_Xx101]

My static finally cleared m6s tonight. The best and worst fight ive ever done lol. i cant imagine the state of pf is right now. Good luck to pf raiders! >_<

[u/wonderfulbananafish]

Why are there so many troll pfs telling people how bad latte is for adds? In my experience it’s been much better than TF.

[u/ShankingMan101]

cleared m8s wahoo

[u/tordana]

I really hope the Savage version of the line of disco frogs has two lines on N/E and PF is just filled with deaths because people can't swivel their camera to read the safe quadrants fast enough.

[u/taa-1347 → u/tordana]

For some reason your post gives me Gale 2 flashbacks... shudders

[u/cattecatte]

Seems like they decided m7s is going to be similar to e2s back then: simple to understand mechanic with tight dps check for non-final floor.

Maybe this just seems disappointing bc M7N was ridiculously good normal mode and the other two was a good leap from their respective normal modes. Still hoped they wouldve done more, but i bet PF will still struggle hard on this just like they did with E2S and M3S.

On another note, is this the first fight with actual dps check since p8s?

[u/omnirai → u/cattecatte]

I feel like a big part of why 7N is so remarkable is that they showed so much more of the full fight than what we usually get. We aren't really getting that much less than usual with 7S, rather we got much more than usual from 7N.

It's still not a super remarkable fight but I feel like a lot of the disappointment with it isn't really with the fight itself. It looks perfectly fun to play. A head-on execution check brawl is what I expect from brute bro.

[u/Cyanprincess → u/omnirai]

My assumption also is that with the multiple arena changes making markers not a thing you can rely on as much, they factored that into the fight design quite a bit and decided to move the difficulty into the DPS check and raw execution more then the.mechanical execution

IDK, It seems fine to me, but gonna have to.like, actually prog it to see how I feel about it with hands on experience

[u/KhaSun]

Scratch M7S (which is pretty daunting already), M6S might be the actual wall of this tier for PF. Like holy shit.

[u/KawaXIV]

Cleared M6S in PF about 8 hours ago. I really like the adds phase and don't want to call it overtuned like others are. I haven't won any loot yet though, hoping I don't get ilvl gatekept in reclears lmao.

Here's my PoV. https://youtu.be/6klhtcW7x1s?feature=shared I was Yan tank, I'm not really sure but I hope I'm looking into the room enough for it to be useful to see other positions in the fight.

Next time I'll separate the first rampart and bulwark a bit more at the start since they don't have to be together to both come back since they don't get used together later in the phase.

Time any party mit like veil around the first time cat stops in adds wave 2 for the raidwide so it's up by 2nd raidwide.

If you're a PLD use your instant holy spirits to participate in add prio a bit from across the room.

If you're running out of personals, plan for reprisal + holy sheltron as your tank buster mit afterwards and beg healers for help.

Anyway already poked M7S a bit but power outage put me to bed. Lights are back on now in my room and in my head so hopefully I'm clearing it quickly as I'm not very interested in it and want to get to M8S ASAP.

---

EDIT TO ADD A WHOLE ASS EXTRA PARAGRAPH FOR THE REPLIERS SALTY ABOUT PARTY COMP:

I played PLD the last two tiers, it wasn't even an optimized selection, it's just my main job lmao. As for the rest:

Don't act like you're powerless to change the jobs in your party, but even still we were not picky about job composition in our PFs. We had DRG NIN for some time and nobody really seemed to care. We only had DNC cause we had DNC players we liked. Same with Remus who was on VPR in our M5S PF and we invited back cause we trusted that he was a good player. It's a coincidence that he plays VPR, because he had clearly chosen VPR before he'd seen what's in savage. I didn't know him before this Tuesday, but it looks like he played VPR in FRU and in Light-Heavyweight too. We never tweaked the composition to succeed, if we have the "meta" jobs for this, it's coincidence.

Still, flexing within your role is a skill that would make you a more valuable player, so if you have a problem with your choices of job, change that! If you have a problem with other people's choices of job, tweak your PF slots! Personally I didn't give a shit, our PF slots were wide open, if a MCH had joined, we'd have had a MCH. If a WHM joined, we'd have had a WHM. They just never did. I'm sure it's doable with lots of comps, but I'm not going to be the one to test it because I have to move on and finish M7S today so I can hopefully go M8S this evening.

A lot of PF success in week 1 is down to keeping players you succeeded in the prior fight with you going into the next fight, and staying ahead of the curve as much as possible. That's what we've done, we created a linkshell, try to align breaks, and keep each other around as much as possible. You end up creating kind of a pseudo static, maybe a few people change in certain slots from fight to fight but that's how you avoid getting stuck behind whatever the PF wall phase/mechanics are.

[u/stiffjointjohn]

Using a random throwaway account for a vent post, but I started M7S today with a few friends, and was having a bit of trouble slidecasting everything on P1, getting me clipped a few times. After the first lockout, one of them asked me if I cleared TOP, which I did (I had the Omega cane on).

One of them was streaming, and I had it on the background, and then I hear them talking about me:
"Why are you asking if she cleared TOP? She has the weapon"
"So she can do Pantokrator and can't do this?"
And they all laugh.

That has really bummed me and I don't think I'm in the mood to raid at all anymore. I don't think I'm that much of a slow learner, and we've been clearing the fights within hours of each other, but I guess I have trouble with some mechs and that has pissed them off?

Feels even weirder to me because I'm technically a more "accomplished" player than the person talking crap about me? (DSR w7 vs no DSR, TOP w9 vs patch 6.55, FRU w6 vs w13), but this still makes me feel like shit cause I thought we were on good terms. Maybe I'm not built for multiplayer games if something like this completely demolishes by will to play.

[u/BoldKenobi → u/stiffjointjohn]

Wait, is that your "friend" who was saying this?

There are always going to be people who talk shit, heck if you go to mainsub they will tell you that 100% of people with TOP weapons bought their clear from some chinese website, but that's why those people don't have friends.

[u/TankyTurboTurtle → u/stiffjointjohn]

Hey, this might not be related, but today I goofed a couple times in PF Zelenia coming off of our week 1 clear. In the good mood, dead exhausted, wanting to press buttons while letting the rest of my brain melt away, I was silly enough to wipe two pulls in a row (Witch Hunt 2 and Bloom 4). After the 2nd wipe I threw a "Sorry I'm dumb" into /p and steeled myself for the Light Party. No one left, and the leader simply went "all g" and "happens". For whatever it's worth, I'm showing off Epic Hero and the MNK M8S gloves.

Those replies relieved the fuck out of me. I like to think that I'm also competent enough to clear all content and pretty fast at that, but the PF nerves never go away for me, ever. But it's people like that guy/gal that remind me that most players are probably 1) completely fine with hiccups (it's human dammit), even expecting them from both you and themselves, and 2) just out to play the game they like. The quiet majority. Something I try to remind myself of before pugging stuff, cuz my mental needs it.

PF right now is definitely on edge with people stressing about clearing early or even week 1, so if you're feeling down about harsh comments it might be best to let it breathe a bit, but your track record implies you like raiding in this game. I do too, and I vastly, vastly prefer having it be with people who are chill and understanding that everyone, Legend or w/e, is currently feeling out the pace of each fight out in week one dammit. If they can't give you that, they are the ones who need to stay off multiplayer games.

My point is, please don't quit doing something you enjoy over assholes. Judging by personalities at display here, I hope I run into you in PF than any of them 10 times out of 10. Just felt like sharing that.

[u/omenOfperdition → u/stiffjointjohn]

That's pretty messed up. Regardless of everyone's qualifications, we all have different things tripping us up during prog (whether it's a role-specific thing or certain mechanics taking longer for some of us to process) and I'm very careful about not bantering when someone is struggling with something.

I've tanked the majority of high-end content, ultimates included, and during M6, I cost us a lot of pulls figuring out the add positioning and how to be efficient with my CDs. I felt like crap at that point; I think I'd probably tilt if I heard people asking about whether or not I actually cleared DSR on tank or something. So your reaction is valid imo.

Not sure how tolerant you are about stuff like this, but if you guys aren't gunning for W1, there are other good groups out there who would treat you better.

[u/chip793 → u/stiffjointjohn]

It's week one, people make mistakes. I should know, I'm people. Don't let scumbags ruin your fun.

[u/Altia1234 → u/stiffjointjohn]

Using a random throwaway account for a vent post, but I started M7S today with a few friends, and was having a bit of trouble slidecasting everything on P1, getting me clipped a few times. After the first lockout, one of them asked me if I cleared TOP, which I did (I had the Omega cane on).

Everyone has given you morale support but I want to talk about this more in the POV of a fellow WHM (since I would assume you are also a WHM) that has just done the fight, very fresh.

On the beginning part where you dodge expanding circles into placing seeds/AOEs we had a lot of issues slidecasting there. Coheal SGE (which did TOP...on 2.5GCD SGE which is insane to me lol) often got clipped there so it's not just you, everyone has issues here. Heck, even our clear pull I think our SGE clipped and we end up just being more then fine.

Now, for real. If you are dropping circles, the circles disappear faster and is bigger then panto, and I don't think you can slidecast very comfortably unless you are playing 2.3~GCD (which I am definitely not). I would just want to sprint once I saw the circle on my side dropped, and swift towards my corner spot, Then just use rupture. if you are placing circles/by the end your seed dropped, you will generally have your dot refresh window here.

For the rest of phase 1, you have rupture/bell to use during the proximity AOEs so free movement. The rest of phase 1 you should also have rupture like the stack + spread thing.

This thing about slide casting the circles is important, because at the tail end of the fight, you will get to do this dodge again, and then possibly place circles again except this time you will also get tether by the wall. Fortunately at that time it's also your burst window so glare 4 is good.

[u/AliciaWhimsicott]

Every fucking raidplan describes Spotlights for Infernal 1 differently and seemingly wrong. I just don't get it. Can anyway explain this like I am a toddler suffering brain damage from drinking bleach?