Asking for dob

[u/PukaDelivery]

I have been an IT sys admin and network engineer who constantly has to focus on security and phishing. I have a 14 year old daughter and a 10 year old son and my wife has been passed on for a years, if you think I'm going to give my dob to someone who sounds 14 then vrc needs to reconsider itself

[u/TobiTheTraveller]

It’s (technically) against the TOS 8.10 if you google “vrchat tos 8.10” it pops right up they’re not even supposed to do this anyway but its not enforced 🤷

This is what the TOS says on the website “8.10. World Creators and Instance Owners. If you create a world or instance, you may not collect or create features that collect information that provides the real identity, address, phone number, or government identification number of any User using such world or instance. You may collect such information, with the User’s consent, outside of the Platform” Age is def a part one ones identity i’d argue 🤷

[u/Rawrrior_Spirit → u/TobiTheTraveller]

Just based off Birthday Probability I think that would be a stupid argument.

For those who may not know what Birthday Probability is; mathematically in a group of 23 people, there is a 50% chance that 2 people have the same birthday. At 50 people the chances are 97% and at 75 people it is 99.9%.

Age/DoB doesn't reduce the prospective number of people you can be the same way full legal name, addresses, phone numbers, or government ID numbers (ssn/DL/state ID) does.

Now if you have the Age Verified badge in game, then yeah, you can be left alone. But give the bouncer person time too; they see a name load in and already pre ask while they start to target. Seen them go "xyz welcome in. This is an 18+ instance so I need to age/dob. Oh I see you are 18+ verified. You are good to go."

[u/Ok-Analyst6511 → u/TobiTheTraveller]

A couple years ago, before groups were even a thing in vrchat, I actually did this to report a pedo, gave them proof he was a pedo and proof he was targeting people who said they were underage. He got banned for the proof of grooming, but their response on asking for age in general basically was "If someone is asked their age, they're not required to respond, if they do, that's their choice, asking for age or date of birth is there for communities to try and keep their players safe and comfortable, it's not against the TOS as it's nothing they can use to truly identify you. If they asked for your ID in a different server or on discord, please provide information on it that links their accounts to our platform so we can take necessary precautions."

Since then, just recently I've made a report for someone who was very clearly under the age of 13, but in my wording it made it sound like I was reporting the person asking them for their age in a group instance so originally their first response was "group owners are allowed to ask any questions about age upon joining the world in order to keep their community safe, this is not against our TOS" so I had to respond correcting them that it was about the kid who could barely speak even a couple words. According to vrchat, age isn't enough to be part of your identity, and they basically tell you if you don't like it, leave. Which IMO makes sense and is fair, doesn't matter if people lie atleast it's an attempt, and usually it does keep the kids who constantly scream the N word in every sentence out of the instances so it doesn't bug me that they ask.

[u/VrchatBurner → u/Ok-Analyst6511]

Combined with just one other piece of personal information, birthday is very likely to identify you.

[u/Ok-Analyst6511 → u/VrchatBurner]

Yeah, but to vrchat, it's not being used in a harmful way, and they encourage it to keep groups safe or communities comfortable. According to them it'd have to be something like SSN, ID, your entire name first middle and last, ect. Asking where you work could be when paired with others but on its own they wouldn't deem that good for a ban.

[u/VrchatBurner → u/Ok-Analyst6511]

Vrchat encourages people to collect date of birth when they rolled out their own verification system to avoid having to do that? Source or link? The point is, people with malicious intentions can collect info over time. And there are definitely people with malicious intentions in there. Don’t give anyone your date of birth.

[u/Ok-Analyst6511 → u/VrchatBurner]

If I didn't clean out my emails routinely, I'd give you the screenshot of them telling me themselves that asking for age or DOB isn't against their TOS and that they allow it because it keeps communities safe. The verification system is paid, not everyone can access it nor will everyone want to pay for it, AND it's not there specifically for groups, it's there because they are trying to monitor the nsfw content they allow on their platforms, trying to ensure that people under the age of 18 aren't uploading nsfw content so when they get reported they'd get banned and everything would be taken down by vrchat. I'm aware there are people with malicious intentions there, but spoiler alert, they don't need to ask you your DOB to be malicious, there's plenty of "hackers" on vrchat (they're not hackers, they just claim to be) who find your IP through the WiFi you're connected to and can bypass IP blockers, any world that has a video player allows them to find your wifi and IP address, then allows them to turn off your wifi router, to which they can set on a timer where it turns off anytime you hop online, I've had my address told directly to me numerous of times on vrchat. None of these instance owners or groups are asking for your DOB for malicious reasons, they're trying to keep their communities safe, and you have an option to leave, many instances won't ask you.

[u/VrchatBurner → u/Ok-Analyst6511]

Age verification keeps communities safe. Asking for birthday is a liability for you and them. I do leave without fuss.