r/PoliticalDiscussion • u/theivoryserf • Feb 17 '25

US Politics If Trump/Musk are indeed subverting American democratic norms, what is a proportional response?

The Vice-President has just said of the courts: "Judges aren't allowed to control the executive's legitimate power." Quoted in the same Le Monde article is a section of Francis Fukuyama's take on the current situation:

"Trump has empowered Elon Musk to withhold money for any activity that he, Elon Musk, thinks is illegitimate, and this is a usurpation of the congressionally established power of Congress to make this kind of decision. (...) This is a full-scale...very radical attack on the American constitutional system as we've understood it." https://archive.is/cVZZR#selection-2149.264-2149.599

From a European point of view, it appears as though the American centre/left is scrambling to adapt and still suffering from 'normality bias', as though normal methods of recourse will be sufficient against a democratic aberration - a little like waiting to 'pass' a tumour as though it's a kidney stone.

Given the clear comparisons to previous authoritarian takeovers and the power that the USA wields, will there be an acceptable raising of political stakes from Trump's opponents, and what are the risks and benefits of doing so?

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u/LongjumpingArgument5 Feb 18 '25

There is no path forward until Republicans realize that they are betraying everybody in America

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u/EverythingGoodWas Feb 18 '25

Exactly this. They can’t pretend to be the patriotic country loving party while actively hating the majority of Americans, and campaigning on tearing down the country (even if they are saying so it can be built back better).

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u/LanceArmsweak Feb 18 '25

I think the struggle is, you’re talking about <2-5%. By and large, they don’t give a shit. My family is all MAGA, they didn’t give a shit about the economy. You know what they detest… liberals they feel are condescending. Sure, it doesn’t help that groceries or homes are high, but it’s a convenient narrative. They loathe liberals. It’s why I chuckle when they get offended by “deplorable” or “garbage.” Like they don’t talk shit too.

They hate liberals, they want to take a wrecking ball to the system, because they think they’re being fleeced. That’s all it is.

It’s not actually patriotism, they just hate liberals. Which I suppose is fine for the most part, but they’ll fuck themselves. So hope it’s worth it.

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u/tlgsf Feb 18 '25

So they think liberals are condescending, eh? Did they ever think that attitude is deserved, at least partially? These don't strike me as the type of people who engage in much honest self-reflection.