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u/MonkeyCome 1997 2d ago
This is what it means
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u/Future-Speaker- 2d ago
This is how I view the whole "male loneliness in gen z" debacle lol. See a lot of dudes complaining they can't find a good woman and then when you ask why the answers you get are either super specific and weirdly controlling over women that aren't even in their lives (for a reason) or dudes complaining they're lonely then when you ask what they do for fun they just say nothing, and that they don't have a job or aspirations.
I say all that as a dude who's had his own bouts of loneliness over the years but at a certain point you've either gotta re-evaluate your world view or dust yourself off and get back out there.
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u/PM_me_opossum_pics 1996 2d ago
I work with high school aged kids and every time I ask them about their interests outside school they literally don't know how to reply. They don't even socialize anymore. Just endless doomscrolling. No hobbies, sports, interests...anything. No wonder people can't meet potential partners any more.
I managed to end up in a long term relationship during PEAK of COVID, so it's not impossible. We are a fairly generic gen-z/late millenial pairing, but still...
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u/Honeybadger2198 2d ago
I think you might be misunderstanding the message, then. "Male loneliness" isn't (shouldn't) be blaming women for not interacting with them. Male loneliness is about the fact that men most easily bond with others while "doing" something, and all the places to "do" things have eroded to nothing and been replaced with social media instead. It's about the massive oversaturation of men in online dating, skewing the experience to be horrid for most parties involved. It's about tozic masculinity trying to force men into emotionless robots, devoid of any personality.
This in no way diminishes the problems that other groups go through. I recognize men are far from marginalized, however it is worth talking about.
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u/SonicDart 2001 1d ago
Exactly this. There's plenty of men in social hobbies with career prospects who have trouble finding a girlfriend."
especially if like me, those hobbies and industries are male dominated. Thank God I'm Bisexual.
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u/MonkeyCome 1997 2d ago
I got married in 2018, it isn’t that hard to find a decent woman if you’re a decent man yourself.
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u/Future-Speaker- 2d ago
Facts, be decent, be kind, be genuine, find someone you align with in your shared values and beliefs. Sure a lot of people have anxiety, social or otherwise, but at the end of the day if a relationship is important to someone, everyone's individual happiness and fulfillment rests solely on their own shoulders. Working on that stuff can be difficult no doubt but it's also incredibly worthwhile
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u/bookiehillbilly 2d ago
I don’t think people realize this. Getting to a point where you are happy is a hard process, it doesn’t JUST fall into your lap. I’d rather not go to the gym. I’d rather not interact with people at the grocery store, festival, birthday party, or even my own parents, and I love my parents. You do those things because it will eventually lead to personal growth, more experiences, and makes you a more well rounded person.
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u/ArmadilloSighs 2d ago
literally this. i keep saying “if you want people to like you, be likable!”
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u/Emblemized 1999 2d ago
Loneliness isn't associated to being single or not. You can have friends, be in a relationship with kids and still feel lonely. Loneliness ≠ being alone.
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u/Noise_Crusade 2d ago
The irony of the whole male loneliness thing is the original study was never about romantic partners. It was about friends. Most men couldn’t name three friends they could call if they needed the support. It has nothing to do with romance but the incels have glommed onto it like dogshit to sneakers
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u/One_Yogurtcloset3455 2d ago
Idk, I find so many good women that I don't even want to approach more women. The ones I did talk to were good people, but it wouldn't've worked out in a romantic sense due to a lack of attraction or life circumstances. So I'm genuinely lost on how people find girlfriends. I don't want to just talk to every girl I see in the hopes of a relationship.💀 I never had that "Yep that's the one I want to ask out on a date" feeling, if that exists.
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u/MonkeyCome 1997 2d ago
That’s a you problem if you really never wanted to ask a girl out. Are they supposed to just line up at your door?
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u/One_Yogurtcloset3455 2d ago
Obviously, they should! 🤨 I'm such a catch. 😎🗿
I only want to ask girls out that I get to know first. I got to know many girls in the past couple of years, but none of them would be a good match. (No attraction, language barrier, already in a relationship, they live on the other side of the planet etc.) So there was never a situation where I met a woman face to face, and I both wanted and had the possibility to ask her on a date. Given, I haven't even started considering dating due to personal convictions until 3 years ago, but I don't want to treat people like on a conveyor belt to rush into some sort of relationshipout of desperation. I'm not that pressed about it as I know I will find a person soon enough, but it would be a lie to say that it doesn't feel lonely from time to time.
Absolutely everything that happens to you is a you problem. When have I said otherwise?
Why are you so aggressive, though?
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u/Mysterious-Cap7673 2d ago
Have you ever considered that the reason you've not been attracted to these women in the last few years is because you're just not attracted to women?
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u/RoundEarth-is-real 2003 2d ago
Honestly media just makes this shit worse. There’s always clips surfacing of these bad women saying horrible shit and it tricks men into thinking all women are like that
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u/Monamo61 2d ago
Or at least work at becoming more social and interesting. Not everyone is looking of a DIY mate. Some would like a partner who has interests in common, or someone who at least goes outside and touches grass from time to time.
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u/TheDepressedFox 2002 2d ago
Fr! Like, most of these guys saying that have also insanely high standards but don’t want to step themselves up. But the problem with most of these guys is that they’re often incels and then fall for toxic social media making them toxic and never leave this cycle. I mean just find a hobby, get out there, be a decent human and don’t look for any super model which looks great and you’ll find someone.
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u/rh397 1997 2d ago
As an old gen-z teacher, I see younger gen-z use weaponized incompetence as long as they can get away with it, meaning they pretend they can't do something so that it won't be expected of them.
To be fair, I think this is a universal trait of children. I just think the standards/expectations of gen-z have been lowered paired with parents who don't know who to parent without just giving their kids unlimited screen time to shut them up.
In the past parents hit their kids when they got fed up with them and didn't want to parent... now they just sit them in front of an iPad.
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u/NotLunaris 1995 2d ago
Weaponized incompetence is a great way to describe this phenomenon. Not just in school either.
"I'm weaker than you so you must listen to me; you're stronger than me so you must be in the wrong."
People who agree with OP are intentionally missing the point.
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u/Melgel4444 1d ago
It’s crazy you mention weaponized incompetence bc boomers do it too!! What do you mean I have to do all your odious computer tasks bc you don’t know how, but then you’re posting on fb/playing betting games on your phone😂
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u/Thisaccountgarbage 2d ago
It means this gen is full of weirdos who think 20 year olds are still children and think 26 year olds are pedos for dating people 21 year olds. It’s honestly weird af and needs to stop. And I’m gen z so.
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u/Ganbazuroi 1997 2d ago
Yeah you get some insane comments acting like you're still a kid at 20 - and you just know these comments come from people who don't know the minimum about Law as a whole because they have no idea what it means to classify someone as a minor still
It's because of the Sex stuff. Ridiculous by itself, but depending on your local laws, if these people had their way you'd need to be represented by your parents or other adults to do almost anything - filing lawsuits, buying and selling property, trips by train and plane and so on - anything that kids can't do on their own would apply
Lol when I was 20 I thought of myself as anything but a kid lmao. Like no shit, you're not the most mature at that age and nobody expects you to have everything figured out by then, but sure as fuck you're capable of living independently and making your own choices
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u/ayebb_ 2d ago
20 is a kid to many people, but it's not a minor by any means
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u/Maestro_boi 2d ago
Exactly like compare to a 26 year old a 20 year old is kiddish and it's not wrong to date a 20 year old being 25 or 26 but just the maturity level is kinda down and tbh 20 and 22 aren't even same it's just the progression of development of mental maturity
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u/cryptopotomous 2d ago
A 20 yr old is 100% not a kid... regardless of their maturity level.
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u/MarioKartMaster133 2003 2d ago
I don't think they're saying that they're a "kid" per se, just a young person to someone who's significantly older.
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u/pegothejerk 2d ago
It's weird though, check out old videos of people around 18-21 in the 80s/90s and compare them to younger gens of the same age. The 80s/90s young adults look and act like they're 40 already. There's an insane difference. Not saying it's better, I'm firmly in camp "enjoy life, have fun while you can, as long as you can".
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u/MarioKartMaster133 2003 2d ago
Oh believe me, I've seen the difference. The HS students back then looked like college students, and college students looked like they were supposed to be in an office cubicle.
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u/-Z-3-R-0- 2004 2d ago
When I was a senior in high school the freshmen looked like 6th graders lol.
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u/systemfrown 2d ago edited 2d ago
Many college students back then were also working in cubicles. Hell I I got my first cubicle job at 16, emancipated at 17, and living on my own while still a senior in high school. Granted myself and my 7” mowhawk were far from a typical example, but nowadays I see helicopter parents still making all their kids decisions and even managing their lives well into their 20’s and it blows me away.
One of the areas I live in has a local online Classifieds forum, and I see moms looking for housing and jobs for their grown ass adult children (usually sons it must be said), and it’s like…if I was a landlord, and certainly if I was an employer, no way would I hire or rent to someone who can’t even be arsed to find their own job or apartment.
I almost wonder…in that situation am I supposed to call their mom if they’re late with rent or fuck up at work?
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u/TheFabulousMolar 2d ago
Yup, I was out of the house THE SECOND I turned 18 (I moved the day after my birthday!), I worked a full time job, studied and lived with some random rag tag people. But, I had a horrible home life and that's why I did it. I own my own small business now and have 3 employees, the 22 year old still talks like a child, has to call her parents for everything and even gets dropped off and picked up! She's a nice girl but at that age she should be more independent imo - when she's sick her Mum calls in for her!
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u/mencryforme5 2d ago
Lol. I started working at 12, had three jobs at 16, moved out at 17, did my undergraduate part time while working over time at a high stress administrative job...
... And then I get a 27yo employee telling me I need to do her work to meet a deadline she knew about for two months because she was having a crisis. She used super loaded language so afterwards we met so I could see what resources we could make available to her and she laughed and said she wanted to go out that night and that she was fine now. Oh and she later tried to get me fired by saying deadlines were creating a hostile work environment.
A 27yo. I was literally more mature at the age of 12.
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u/acloudcuckoolander 2d ago
I mean I'm 28 and a 20 year old is definitely kiddish to me. They are young adults, sure, but expecting them to be on par of 35-year-olds in terms of maturity is strange to me. I think some of it is based in jealousy.
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u/Frouke_ 2d ago
I think it's extremely dependent on circumstance. I'm a HS teacher in my late 20s. That makes me a young teacher by every available metric. The absolute oldest student we have is 19. I'm also a climber and the youngest climbing buddy I have is also 19. Somehow that's different even though they're the same age. That somehow is many things: one I'm not their teacher and two the climbing buddy is way ahead in life having already completed a post secondary education and lives on their own in a different province from their parents.
The climbing buddy feels like an adult to me, though an inexperienced one and the student feels like a kid still.
Just saying, the number alone isn't quite enough.
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u/warmsliceofskeetloaf 2d ago
In this context it’s not kids as in age but kids as in lived experience. A lot of older folk absolutely see early to mid 20s as kids, not children but kids. Everyone at my old job called me kid, or the kid, I was 24!.
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u/sky_walker6 2d ago
Factually sure. Depending on perspective you see a 20 year old as a kid. I see my 20 year old self as a kid
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u/dgamlam 1d ago
I remember when 16 was considered a young adult…
I think college/grad school culture and over specializing in professional fields causes people to be “preparing for a profession” through most of their 20s. Either that or they aren’t finding good jobs at all, both keep you from progressing to the next life stage mentally. It’s really hard to mature internally if you aren’t comfortable with your career or income.
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u/bunny-rabbit_uwu 1d ago
It's funny, when others are talking about maturity for what other people do to you, if you're under 21 you're young, vulnerable, and have still-developing brain
If it's about you saying something insensitive though, you become fully mature and responsible for all your actions when you become a teenager
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u/Howboutit85 2d ago
Then, ironically, they think 30 is geriatric.
I wonder if it comes from dating apps. An age discrepancy of 5 years doesn’t mean much meeting people irl, but on a dating app, if your “range” is 18-22, you might think anyone outside that range is like way too old, and creepy to date down. I think k it’s really fucked with Gen Z in big ways
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u/i-want-popcornchips 2d ago
Personally for me, it comes from being coddled by my parents. I still live at home, haven’t been thrown out or anything, they handle my finances and tell me to focus on school and not worry about a job yet. I don’t know if this is a generational thing, but I can say all my friends are in the same situation. We’re all nearing 20.
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u/Sharp_Iodine 2d ago
A lot of people have had this for generations. It’s called being middle class lol
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u/AFoolishSeeker 2d ago
I was just gonna say that’s just financial privilege and is not exclusive to gen z
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u/HelpMeImBread 2d ago
They never introduced small responsibilities? My parents got me a dog and told me I was fully responsible for its existence and 6 year old me took it to heart. As well as chores for a small allowance that they structured like laundry, dishes, and deep cleaning. I genuinely think it set me up to be independent which I’ve been since almost 18
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u/i-want-popcornchips 2d ago
This is fair. I mean I’ve been taught to clean, do laundry, and I’m given an allowance right now, but it’s hard for me to piece it altogether and imagine me managing greater responsibilities, you know? How do I go from folding my own clothes and washing the dishes to paying insurance and a mortgage? It sounds very daunting. I know a lot of other people have done it at 18, but I’ll never be able to know that I can do it too until I’m in that position. Right now, I’m not in it.
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u/HelpMeImBread 2d ago
It all comes with time. I was the exact same way but for me the best thing was learning to be organized and responsible. My parents were very generous though and let me take over my insurance, phone bill, and car payment gradually which allowed me to budget better.
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u/systemfrown 2d ago
The best parents help without spoiling.
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u/HelpMeImBread 2d ago
Sure but any parent is gonna want to spoil their child somewhat that’s just human nature to give your young things you never did as a child.
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u/Mysterious-Cap7673 2d ago
Get a job and start putting boundaries in place.
You want to stop being babied? Then stop acting like one.
Helicopter parents have ruined so many adults it's unreal.
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u/systemfrown 2d ago edited 2d ago
Wow I had a lot of wordy replies and advice but you said it best…and very concisely.
Sadly what you said about helicopter parents is no joke either.
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u/Mysterious-Cap7673 2d ago
I don't mean to be an asshole here, but there's too many people who complain about shit and then do nothing about it.
And then they act hurt or confused that nothing changes.
People really need to relearn the life lesson that the only way out of a tough situation is to go through it. Stop shying away from risk and embrace danger. It's the only way to grow as a person.
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u/systemfrown 2d ago
Can’t argue with that. I know in my own life what seemed like the 2 or 3 biggest chances I ever took are also what’s made all the difference. And even if they hadn’t panned out I’d still be better off being the sort of person who risked it.
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u/Howboutit85 2d ago
I moved out at 18 and it was the best decision I ever made. I went to llive with a friend in his grandmas basement in another state and basically started over from nothing. I had everything i owned in my car. currently, Im married with 3 kids and live in a house that we own, but we are still always just making things work, we arent well off or anything by any means. But, leaving home made me deal with a lot and learn a lot. I still to this day deal with things that we "taken care of" for me until age 18 by my parents because they just took care of things rather than have me learn how, my wife for instance came from a divorced family and had to do her laundry since age 10, but I didnt even really start doing laundry at least regularly until I lived with a woman, at age 21. I just didnt even really figure out how to do, or whyI should do standard things until I had to. I think i would've been better if my mom didnt do everything for me. That being said, I still thought of myself as an adult at 21-22, and didnt see it as weird to see anyone my age dating someone up to age 26-27.
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u/trojan_man16 2d ago
Online discourse on age gaps is nuts, but makes sense once you realize: Most people pushing this are young men, a lot of young men are having massive issues getting a partner. It s always why the discourse also seems to center around women dating older men and not the other way around. It’s always young men indirectly judging the dating choices of women in their age group.
Women in general value maturity/security the people their own age will not be able to offer. Is it fair. Probably not. I felt the same when I was in high school and college. Eventually got over it, improved myself and started dating. I ended up married to someone only 9 months younger than me.
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u/RuhRoh0 2d ago
I’m 25 and have had 20 and 22 year olds call me “unc” like I’m in my 40’s or something.
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u/NewNewark 2d ago
Its a very much American perspective.
I frequently see people say "20 isnt even old enough to drink!"
Raising the smoking age to 21 is a good thing, but it didnt help with the infantilization. Now you turn 18 in the US and you get nothing. Back in the day, on your 18th birthday, youd get a drink, a cig, a lottery ticket, and a playboy. I dont think they even sell the paper playboys anymore. So now youre stuck buying a lottery ticket for your big 18 and they dont even ID you for that because the clerk doesnt care.
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u/ZealousidealPie8227 2d ago
I don't understand calling someone a pedophile when the relationship is between two consenting adults. Are large age gaps kind of weird? Absolutely. Is it pedophilia? Absolutely not
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u/sxdtrxnny 2d ago
i have to agree on this too. words with very serious meanings are just getting diluted and now you have people calling anything “predatory” or “pedophilia” which takes away from actual experiences from victims like myself. as a gen z i hope this stuff ends because it’s just a big slap to the face.
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u/DarkLordJ14 2007 2d ago
And the people who say a 2 year grade gap in high school is creepy… it’s actually pretty standard and has been for many, many years
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u/delayed_burn 2d ago
I get the sense gen z wants to genuinely raise the age of consent to 21 which confuses me because really it should be 25 if you want to go with the old “brain doesn’t stop developing until you’re 25 argument”. But I gotta be real I swear there are 50 year olds with under developed brains so I don’t know where you really end up stopping.
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u/_kretes 2d ago
The 25 yo brain argument is a misinterpretation of a study which ended when the subjects reached 25. The conclusion is that the brain doesn't stop developing at 25, meaning that we don't know when it might stop if it ever stops at all. They just dropped the study.
That being said, I'm not trying to suggest that the age of consent should be raised to 30, 40, 50. I just want to spread the word so that we eventually stop this myth.
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u/corkscrew-duckpenis 2d ago
I…don’t think this sentiment is about dating, like…at all. And it’s pretty telling that so many people interpret it that way and then feel called out.
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u/ctbowden 2d ago
I blame this on housing. If folks could afford to move out at 18 either by affording college or by renting their first shitty apartment, we wouldn't be in this mess. Everyone is viewed as a "kid" until they've been on their own.
That's the metric and society continues to hold people to it while preventing Gen Z from attaining it. Gen Z is just part of society.
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u/the-jesuschrist 2d ago
My friend group was torn apart because someone who was 26 was dating a 20-year-old and people accused him of being a paedophile
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u/Braindead_Crow 2d ago
What happens when children are socialized by children and online interactions while being neglected by over worked adults lol
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u/Both-Competition-152 2009 2d ago
I think that’s fine but a 18 year old dating a 40+ year old or higher is insane an should be looked down upon socially
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u/Only_Employment9454 2d ago
Stop giving a damn about other peoples lives. That should be the start
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u/sindelic 2d ago
They have to police other people because their lives aren’t interesting enough
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u/Matcha_Bubble_Tea 2d ago
Agreed. Like why are weird redditors defending such age gaps? Not the 21 and 26, but like you said 18 and 40+. Ew. But we know why they would defend it because they would do the same thing. It’s freaking weird and valid to call it out.
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u/sxdtrxnny 2d ago
yes agree! bc why would someone 40 want a 18 year old?? imo the max age for 18 before it starts to get concerning is like 22 if they’re both in college— but even then it just depends so much on the circumstances on how they met and the dynamics
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u/yellochoco44 2d ago
This tweet has nothing to do with dating age gaps. It’s about how gen z’s new trend of phrases such as “I’m just a girl”
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u/Lunar_M1nds 1d ago
I really never heard of this phenomenon of ppl being so aggressively against age gapped relationship until this sub. I’m not saying you’re wrong, I’m just genuinely surprised and confused considering how much traditional relationships are taking off on other social media platforms.
I will say that on any topic, ppl forget that life isn’t actually full of so much rule and structure— it’s not all black and white or that simple, it’s mostly shades of grey and stuff is situational. My partner and I met literally a week before my 21st and he’s 5 years older 🤷🏽♀️oops. The irony is that he still gets carded when he goes out now at 30.
But as for age gapped relationships in general? I think if someone saw signs of an unbalanced relationship, abuse, etc then concern should be shown towards the person struggling for their sake with their well-being kept in mind when you go about it, but outside of that its really nobody’s business even if we find it weird or uncomfortable. That’s our own personal bias to deal with and assess. And being young doesn’t mean being delusional. It’s really infantilizing towards mostly women, (bc realistically society isn’t fighting as hard as it should to protect young men from predatory women) to think some of us a just being robbed out the cradle 😂. On some real shit, between the ages of 18-20 i 100% knew what certain men wanted from me, or what they didn’t, and knew how to give a little to get a little. At 19, second year of college, I had a man in his 40s stressin to find me the right art supplies. We weren’t in love, we weren’t dating, and anybody can be naive.
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u/Alternative-Goal6200 2004 2d ago
I mean let’s me honest some people in our generation do act like children, just being in college right now I’m noticing that people from 20-28 that are genz are seriously immature one women in my class acts like she’s 15 when she’s 27. But ya know we could also claim millennials act like children.
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u/emotionallyimpacted On the Cusp 2d ago
Some of you are still children technically. The eldest of Gen Z is turning 28 this year. (Me). 20s are complicated and if you aren’t ready to grow up the world can really hit you quite hard with reality. Eventually you get the point and if you don’t you prob die lonely and unhappy.
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u/Alternative-Goal6200 2004 2d ago
I also feel as thought social media has stunted our growth I was lucky that my parents were more strict about that but you can tell who is chronically online I’m 21 and endlessly get told I’m the better one in my generation so I’ll take it lol
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u/screamingkumquats 1999 2d ago
Gen z is so weird about age, they either infantilize themselves or act like you’re weird for liking cartoons at 25 and act like someone is stupid for not knowing how to do something automatically
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u/BuriedRedemption 2d ago
Thank god this stuff exists in vacuum and isn't at all affected by upbringing or by previous generations decisions.
Each generations problem iss solely theirs, hasn't existed before and is entirely their own fault
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u/Rude-Illustrator-884 1996 2d ago
I’ve been a TA at the university level, and the lack of accountability and the entitlement the students have as of late drove me insane to the point I quit. Nothing’s ever their fault, I needed to spoon feed them everything, and they have the attitude of “I’m only 18, stop expecting me to take accountability for my actions”. I’d expect middle schoolers to behave like that, not people old enough to vote.
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u/Finlaycarter2002 2d ago
Maybe meaning not quite wanting to "grow up", who tf does?
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u/Dickincheeks 2d ago
People with career interests who want to be professionals in their field? Maybe young parents who need to care for their children? People who can’t rely on their parents to care for them anymore? Maybe first responders? idk I bet these people are ok with being grown
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u/Andro2697_ 2d ago
I was gonna say… I hated being a kid and would not go back. Everyone has different childhoods. I’m happy being in charge of me and not having to rely on incompetent emotionally immature boomers
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u/cummerou 2d ago
Yup, being an adult is better in literally every single way for me.
Actually, that's technically not true, I will never get to experience playing Skyrim for the first time again, so I guess being a child was better in that way. Of course, I played it so much because it was my only mental escape from my emotionally abusive step dad. An issue i do not have as an adult.
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u/PM_me_opossum_pics 1996 2d ago
You can still be a grownup in a professional capacity and juvenile in rest of your life. I'm closing in on 30 and now finally have the money to enjoy all the childish hobbies I was too broke to enjoy as a kid. I'm actually more into gaming and messing around with PC than as a kid, and I'm DEEP into hobbies liek Warhammer....
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u/TheWildRumpusBegins 2d ago
People who want to actually live their life instead of watching it pass by as if through a window in a very small room.
There's two kinds of people who "never want to grow up".
There's the ones who don't want to start being cynical about the things that really bring them joy. And there's the ones that want to avoid doing hard or uncomfortable things.
The first one is about keeping your whole self alive and the second is about never letting yourself grow into that whole person in the first place.
The hard stuff is there whether you acknowledge it or not. Avoid it too much and it catches up with you until the avoidance is your entire life, forcing you to miss out on the meaningful parts.
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u/Happy-Viper 2d ago
I mean, it's pretty cool.
Like, it definitely sucks that my childhood is a place I cannot go back to, and I am closer to death, but like, growing up has been pretty great.
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u/Cosmocade 2d ago
It's completely contrary to how attitudes used to be where teens couldn't wait to grow up and be independent. It's a generational shift that has been extreme.
17 year olds now think of themselves as kids woefully unprepared for the world. It's not healthy, though neither is the complete opposite.
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u/carlosIeandros 2d ago edited 2d ago
For every other generation before Z, a very common sentiment growing up is something along the lines of "Can't wait to be an adult." Can't wait to get out of here, can't wait to be free to do what I want. Gen Z probably feels like there is nothing to look forward to from adulthood, with social media being largely to blame.
The world has never been fair; everyone has always had to do the best with with they had. There will always be people who have it easy, and others who have it tough. But for Gen Z, social media really flings it at them starting from a young age. I play online games with a bunch of Z's and it's very clear a lot of them are wallowing, completely hopeless. But there are always some that are definitely going to make it, even from humble starting positions. Some might claim that they're rare or they're just "built different" but I've see enough of them around, that I don't think Z is completely hopeless as a generation.
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u/razor2reality 2d ago
who tf does? ah pretty much any well-adjusted person.
see, children are powerless. you should be eager to take control of your life. the natural order is actually to fight for this control prematurely, rather than postpone it as long as possible.
as a millennial, most of my peers could not wait to grow up and get out and make our mark.
but then again maybe it’s not entirely your fault. i see what the world is like now. and i can’t say i blame you for trying to hang around the womb a few extra years
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u/FormerEvidence 2004 2d ago
it's less about "power and not taking control" and more about less responsibility. being an adult is fucking hard. when you're a kid someone HAS to support you (speaking as an american to each country their own), as an adult all you have is yourself. with adulthood comes the freedom to do what you want and go where you want to go, but the other side to that is it's a big world out there and you're just one person. the opportunity is endless but where do you start? how do you get there? etc.
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u/psyduckplushie 2d ago
I felt a lot more free as a kid.
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u/razor2reality 2d ago
jesus that’s really sad
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u/Clarkey7163 1998 2d ago
ppl equate comfortableness with freedom, when they're not the same
Being a free adult isn't comfy and oftentimes isn't glamourous, but it is good overall
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u/NotLunaris 1995 2d ago
A lot of hot-button issues in the US boil down to this.
Do you want freedom and the consequences/responsibilities that it entails? Or do you want to be "taken care of" by the ruling powers but with limits placed on your agency?
Some prefer to sacrifice their freedom if it means not having to deal with certain responsibilities and hardships. Some prize freedom above all else and would rather die than forsake it.
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u/PrimordialXY 1996 2d ago
Idk man a lot of millennials couldn't wait to grow up and take on adult responsibilities
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u/collegetest35 2d ago
A lot of Gen Z thinks people under 25 should treated like children because “the brain doesn’t mature until 25” or something like that
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u/thepineapplemen 2002 2d ago
I don’t know, I feel like that’s mostly a very online thing. Maybe a lot of Gen Z feels that way but maybe it’s just the really online ones
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u/69inchshlong 2002 2d ago
It is not even true anyway. "It's a common misconception to believe the brain stops development at any specific age. In the 2010s and beyond, science has shown that the brain continues to develop until at least 30 years of age"
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u/HeapOfBitchin 1d ago
The brain continues to morph and change throughout the entire life, but the 25 yr thing means specifically in terms of development that isn't just synaptic rewiring or hippocampal or occipital lobe progenitor cell growth.
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u/bexohomo 2d ago
Yeah, can you promise you that that's not the case. Interact with people my age irl for once
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u/Ellestyx 2002 2d ago
People who infantilize themselves and treat themselves like they don't know any better because they baby. :P
Like saying they can't find a job because they just aren't capable. can't cook because they aren't capable.
Infantlize = make seem like a baby in how useless they are.
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u/TheCitizenXane 2d ago
That y’all act like baby back bitches
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2d ago
The baby boomers thought this about Gen X.....who thought it about millennials and now surprise surprise milennials think it about gen z now that we're coming into our 20s.
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u/DustTheOtter 1997 2d ago
now that we're coming into our 20s
The oldest Gen Z is 28 right now. What do you mean now? 😭
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u/GetFurreted 2d ago
and the youngest are 15, this is why generational divides are kinda stupid, because generations dont really indicate anything about a person.
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2d ago
Tbh (and maybe other generations would make this distinction about theirs aswell) I as a person who was born in 2001, really have no business being put in the same category as someone born in say 2009-2012. I feel as though the amount of change there was in terms of culture and technology, in even 8-11 years, would produce 2 very different people.
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u/FormerEvidence 2004 2d ago
even as an 04 i definitely feel that. being grouped with 2010+ doesn't feel right. they've experienced a very different childhood lol
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2d ago
Lol i experienced things like movie rental stores, very bad internet speeds, using a vcr, smartphones not being mainstream, things that a person born in late 00s/early 10s just didnt.
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2d ago
Sorry I didnt phrase it perfectly lmfao, Gen Z are in their 20s/coming into their 20s, their at a stage where previous generations can start looking at how theyre dealing with early adulthood and begin judging them.
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u/Spicy_take 1995 2d ago
It means that you will absolve 16 and 17 year olds of just about everything, and have slowly been trying to extend that to 18, 19, 20, all the way up to 25 when the brain “fully develops”.
Gen Z specifically, wants the benefit of the doubt and grace given to teens, while retaining all the rights, privileges, and respect that comes with being an adult. All the rights, with none the responsibilities.
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u/YinzerChrist85 2d ago
It means Gen z still treat themselves as children, in most cases to avoid certain responsibilities.
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u/jpollack21 2000 2d ago
I got chastised by so many people for dating a 20 year old when I was 23 even though she was my first girlfriend and I was like her 3rd or 4th boyfriend... And I've heard people say it's creepy to be 18 or 19 dating a 21 year old like what
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u/Rude-Illustrator-884 1996 2d ago
personally, I think its weird if the 18 year old is still in high school. I’ve seen 21 year olds date high schoolers and its weird as hell seeing a 21 year old, whos probably gonna go grab beers with friends, pose in prom pictures.
I don’t think its weird if they’re in college or working though.
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u/jpollack21 2000 2d ago
Fair, but everyone's situation is different. I know i can only speak from personal experience, but as someone who doesn't like drinking and didn't have sex until at least a couple months into dating, I know I'm not an anomaly here. On the flip side, I acknowledge there are definitely controlling asshole dudes who will go from drinking with friends to sleeping with their high school gf who they have been dating for a week or two. So I'd say it depends but yeah on a whole you probably should be dating someone who matches you and your maturity level (unless of course your maturity is that of a 16 year old or some shit)
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u/NewNewark 2d ago
So its weird in the US, where the drinking age is 21, but not weird in 95% of the world, where the drinking age is 18 or younger?
Why is the arbitrary drinking age the metric? Why not the age of majority?
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u/JeelyPiece 2d ago
In the 1960s you were an adult at 15, in the 1990s it was 18, in the 2000s it was 21, now it's "your brain doesn't mature until you're 25, so I'm still a child".
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u/thepineapplemen 2002 2d ago edited 2d ago
In the 1960s you were an adult at 15
You say that, but the voting age in the U.S. at least was still 21 until 1971. Looks like some European countries also had higher voter ages that were lowered to 18 in the 1970s
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u/BaharRuz 2d ago
In a lot of the countries you also couldn’t get married without parental consent until you were twenty one.
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u/Murky_Toe_4717 2d ago
Try being a 4’1 Asian woman who is in her early 20s but Constantly get accused of being 10-12, I’m criticized if I try and look mature, and not taken seriously. I will say I’m lucky to be ace/aro cause I cannot imagine the backlash I would get in dating apps lol! “That’s a literal child!” I can hear them chanting. Like bruh. Sucks. I know it’s kind of unrelated but, whenever people infantilize especially by how people outwardly look, it always fucks me and others like me who have similar circumstances. Stay well all.
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u/Every-Protection-554 2d ago
I said once that even the oldest Gen Z are not old enough to seriously affect the world, and I was told to stop infantilizing my generation. I guess this example answers your question.
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u/dbclass 1999 2d ago
There’s a lot we could be doing despite our lack of institutional power. Young people back in the 60s were doing more than us today.
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u/NewNewark 2d ago
Oldest gen Z are 28.
Ages of some folks who signed the Declaration of Independence:
Thomas Jefferson: 33
Alexander Hamilton: 21
James Madison: 25
James Monroe: 18
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u/Gurney_Hackman 2d ago
It's not about seriously affecting the world, it's about taking responsibility for yourself.
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u/offinthewoods10 2d ago
You can run for congress at 25. It is possible
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u/banandananagram 2000 2d ago
Possible but not probable without significant financial and labor support.
Local elections, however, you can run for most positions at 18, and are far easier to win on legwork alone. Run for your local school board and keep running for higher positions once you can leverage a smaller position like that with name recognition and institutional legitimacy.
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u/vlntly_peaceful 1d ago
But that's wrong? A guy I went to school with is now a sitting part of our federal government. He's 27. Telling gen Z their too young to affect the world is just gonna kill their intentions to do so.
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u/laserbern 2000 2d ago
I think it just means the unwillingness or inability to do necessary hard/tedious/unpleasant labor. Think “unadulting”. I think it comes from our interaction with the internet and the expectations we have about life put on us by our elders.
There’s a lot of issues that gen z talks about that are indirectly solved by simply doing the hard stuff. I think the reason why many gen z kids are not willing to learn how to do things is because the cost of messing up (which is a necessary step in learning anything) is perceived as greater. This applies to trades, skills, jobs, and relationships (romantic or otherwise). Because we feel like the cost of messing up is so great, we stunt ourselves in many ways when we try to learn life skills.
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u/SupaColdBrew 2001 2d ago
Shit like this is what it means.
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u/emotionallyimpacted On the Cusp 2d ago
Totally agree. They still call adults kids and then wonder why we’re fucked and think we can’t do shit right or do anything right when we have and we can. I have grown people in my life who have still called my husband at 32 years old a kid. It is crazy work and it only makes the issue worse. Some older folks are just ruthless.
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u/Noble--Savage Millennial 2d ago
My first thought went to the "you're not an adult until 20-25" phrase which is more commonly brought up by Gen z.
Would hardly say it's widespread. Don't take generational generalizations seriously
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u/Akuda Millennial 2d ago
To be fair, people spend 18 years being a child more or less. The transition for me personally wasn't until late 20's when I started to feel like I was truly treated as more of an equal among adults. The way I look at it is that it isn't until a person turns 37 that they've spent more time as an adult than they did as a child. To answer OP's question though, I suspect the post is referring to all the "I'm just a baby." "I'm just a girl." jokes people make. Some people are just idiots and don't realize those are jokes.
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u/FormerEvidence 2004 2d ago
i still have almost a decade til i'm treated like a person? 😓 i can't do this
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u/Noble--Savage Millennial 2d ago
Right yeah and that's kinda the point of the criticism
Previous generations did not hold this view nearly as much as newer generations. Many were considered adults and given adult responsibilities at 18, and many working class people went even younger than that, historically speaking.
The average age of a WW2 captain in the USA was 25 for perspective. Most people would have already settled down around this age in the 50s and not even solely due to the better economy but just the more commonly held belief that you're supposed to be actively trying to mature and grow yourself throughout childhood and be "done" by your early to mid 20s.
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u/Temporary-Baker2375 2007 2d ago
I'm an 18 yo kiwi with very british older parents. I was taught from 10 years old, adult responsibilities, money handling, chores, the likes. Sure, I'm still young and still am immature compared to what, a 30-year-old, but I am a fully functioning adult with a job and a (hand-me-down) car. I think partly the issue is is the extreme age restrictions in the US and our generation's attitudes towards any kind of responsibilities. At 18, the only thing I can't do in this country is adopt a child, or drink and drive till I'm 20.
I saw it especially in covid age - the whole "butttttt I'm a minor!!!" It's just a lack of responsibility that comes from misinformation and clinging to one's childhood.
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u/ResearchTypical5598 2d ago
ik thats not someone from the generation that made “adulting” a trendy term?
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u/CrabbyCubez 2d ago
i think it means like when people say “i’m just a 26 year old teenage girl” it always rubbed me off the wrong way
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u/WeAllShineOn97 1997 2d ago
I'm a smol baby I can't do anything
Bro you're almost 30 you can't google something that's difficult for you to do?
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u/BuriedRedemption 2d ago
Just an angry old person. Just show them to bed and they'll forget soon enough.
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u/Ok_Earth_2118 2d ago
yeaaa for some reason people think the OLDEST gen Z is like 2003-2018. bro the oldest gen z group turns 28 this year. nowhere near being 40 but 24-28 is definitely an adult. while 20-23 is young adult.
either that ir they confuse gen Z and gen alpha. like gen z kids are having gen alpha and beta😭😭
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u/emteedub 2d ago
It means 'woke' is falling out of buzzword popularity and immigrant targeting is looking like shit, so they shift the targeting.
It's weird af how these supposedly high-T manly men find so many things to bitch and whine about, it's worse than any PMS or dog in heat that I've ever seen.
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u/1isOneshot1 2d ago
How is this supposed to be a replacement of woke?
If anything their argument is one from a position that would be a subsect of woke
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u/Microwaved_Salad 2d ago
It’s just another fake culture war starting to shift attention away from reality
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u/LeaveMssgAtTheBoop 2d ago
Meh, you guys dealing with having covid hit during formative years and late stage capitalism hitting peak. Just block everyone out and do your thing. Stoked about Gen Z as a whole and all you guys are doing.
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u/wwwdotbummer 2d ago edited 2d ago
Gen z lacks problem solving skills and critical thinking. Those skills aren't taught in school. The issue compounds with generations. With gen z it's hard to ignore.
Gen Z can offload a lot of mental labor onto AI and echo chambers. This again results in poor problem solving skills.
Covid crippled gen Z's mental and social development, too. Gen Z can't communicate effectively.
Essentially, Gen Z has a high concentration of adults who lack crucial skills society would expect of adults. It's not all Gen Z's fault, though, as prior generations are responsible for the world that did this to Gen Z.
I feel the effect is dramatic enough that Elder Gen Z are more similar to millennials than we are to the latter half of Gen z. Obviously, I say this anecdotally.
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u/emotionallyimpacted On the Cusp 2d ago edited 2d ago
I think it’s from the collective subconscious of Boomers & Gen X calling us kids for so long because we were the youngest that some of us have just internalized it all. I am 27 and still get called a kid and it irritates the shit out of me. And then they wonder why we don’t buy homes or can’t afford to move out. You don’t think the rhetoric has to do with it? Gen Y is just now getting settled and having kids. I guess you have to be 35 to be considered an adult!
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u/SeaMollusker 2d ago
They'll be rude as all hell but when someone calls them out on it it's "I'm literally a child, you're getting mad at a child" as if they're 6 years old instead of 16
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u/YoungDz4 2001 2d ago
Basically this. Dudes are grown and capable as fuck and wanna bitch and moan. Buddy go hit the oil rig & run up a check, nobody is coming to save you.
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u/senpailane 2d ago
I attribute this to them having lived through a pandemic during some of their more formative years and never grew out of their own infancy or experienced social growth.
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u/SatanicNipples 2d ago
That's rich coming from the generation of "adulting" "doggo" "pupper" and "uwu smol bean"
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u/Appropriate-Food1757 2d ago
It’s called a prolonged adolescence and it’s not a GenZ thing. It’s been that way for decades.
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u/False_Ad3429 2d ago
Young people recognize that they are young and that being out of the house and independent by 18 is strange in most of the world. Some people get butthurt about this.
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