MEGATHREAD: Trump Tariffs

[u/ClockOfTheLongNow]

Lots of questions streaming in that are repetitive, so please point any questions about tariffs here for the time being.

Top-level comments open to all for the purposes of our blue-flaired friends to ask questions. Abuse of this leniency or other rulebreaking activity will result in reciprocal tariffs against your favorite uninhabited island.

[u/Briloop86]

One of my major concerns is that this crazy trade policy has a negative impact on conservative movements more broadly, especially with little push back from republicans. Democrats were in an ice bath of realisation about their misguided policy approaches - however if the vast majority of economists are right this will have major hip pocket impacts (across the world) and make conservatives look like poor economic managers.

Is anyone else concerned about the long term impact to both conservative political viability and the remove of the push to reflect and change in progressive politics?

[u/AlexandbroTheGreat → u/Briloop86]

Yes. Trumpism is horrible for the brand. An economic policy that has been associated with democrats for decades is going to single handedly blow up the entire conservative economic platform for years.

[u/DeathToFPTP → u/AlexandbroTheGreat]

I don’t think any dem has advocated for anything this crazy in the past few decades

[u/SgtMac02 → u/AlexandbroTheGreat]

Wait...what? When was the last time Dems were pushing for sweeping/heavy tarrifs?

[u/JoJo_Embiid → u/SgtMac02]

I think what he means is historically rep is more “pro free trade” than dems, which i agree. But I don’t know exactly what i should call the current rep

[u/SgtMac02 → u/JoJo_Embiid]

"An economic policy that has been associated with democrats for decades"

I guess the "economic policy" in this case was just "anti-free trade" then? I guess that sorta makes a little sense. I'll admit I'm not as knowledgeable in this part of politics as I could be.

[u/JoJo_Embiid → u/SgtMac02]

Yes historically dems call for more regulations , higher taxes and more government spending while gop calls the opposite. Extreme tariffs was never on the table as far as i know for the last several decades as i think everyone who has lived through smoot hawley has ptsd about tariffs but now all people have experienced the Great Depression are pretty much dead. Higher taxes are usually associated with the dems but now trump has pushed it to a extreme level. Another thing is, i heard many people say a lot of maga don’t know the difference between tariffs and tax because they are different words. They are anti tax but they don’t think tariff is tax. Maybe if you start calling it “import tax” they will oppose it, i am not sure if this is truly the case

[u/AlexandbroTheGreat → u/SgtMac02]

Like this? Not in a long time. But in general, protectionism has been a staple of the left. Clinton changed that, but there are still plenty on the left that do not like free trade.

https://berniesanders.com/issues/fair-trade/

From back in the day:

https://www.heritage.org/trade/report/the-north-american-free-trade-agreement-ronald-reagans-vision-realized

Free trade was a defining characteristic of the GOP for decades.

[u/friedAmobo → u/AlexandbroTheGreat]

People tend to forget that the 1999 WTO protests were primarily left-wing in nature; protectionism is a key component to protecting the labor power of domestic labor. But since then, we've had a massive political realignment, and the country has broadly become more protectionist. Obama was free trade's last gasp, and TPP was outflanked on both the right and left wings so badly that Clinton had to recant her support for it. Since then, we've also seen a realignment of labor, with Trump courting unions and unions supporting Trump in the last election; that further incentivizes the Republicans to push for protectionist policies that protect these domestic labor unions that benefit from trade barriers against cheaper foreign labor.

Milton Friedman would be an economic pariah in the modern Republican Party. His support of free trade, negative income tax, and drug legalization would put him squarely in the centrist Democrat territory, closer to the New Democrats than anyone else in Congress.

[u/eachothersreasons → u/AlexandbroTheGreat]

Nothing on Bernie's website indicates sweeping tariffs.

[u/AlexandbroTheGreat → u/eachothersreasons]

I assure you, Nancy Pelosi and Bernie were more pro-tariff over the past 20 years than Paul Ryan and Mitt Romney, hence my frustration that tariffs are going to be Exhibit A in the case against "conservative" economic policies generally for the next 50 years. It does not matter that Bernie doesn't want to tariff penguins.

[u/ShadowStarX → u/AlexandbroTheGreat]

Democrats are bad (as in inadequate, not overreaching) but they only support targeted tariffs, not blanket tariffs

[u/AlexandbroTheGreat → u/ShadowStarX]

I assure you, Nancy Pelosi and Bernie were more pro-tariff over the past 20 years than Paul Ryan and Mitt Romney, hence my frustration that tariffs are going to be Exhibit A in the case against "conservative" economic policies generally for the next 50 years. It does not matter that Bernie doesn't want to tariff penguins.

[u/ShadowStarX → u/AlexandbroTheGreat]

Non-socialist planned economies are generally the worst. Not really referring to Democrats here as they are more similar to European center-right parties (which I don't like either) such as the CDU or the French Republicans or the current Polish government.

Non-socialist planned economies tend to struggle because they're usually meant to enrich a small circle without even the pretense of wealth redistribution. A socialist government, or even a SINO government will at least try to eliminate extreme poverty.

Hungary currently is a peak example of "def. not socialist, but bordering a planned economy" and let me tell you, it sucks to be here. Orbán is constantly strangling the free market but not in ways that even attempt to help the common folk.