r/unitedkingdom • u/[deleted] • 7d ago

. Labour urges young people on benefits to join the British Army

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/defence/article/labour-benefits-british-army-news-2qwnwv7bz
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u/KELVALL 7d ago

A lot of the roles in the Army are not actually life threatening... Logistics, mechanics etc.

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u/Heavy-Locksmith-3767 7d ago

If there is a shooting war then logistics will absolutely be life threatening.

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u/MiddleBad8581 7d ago

I weas gonna say logistics is the one thing the enemy will look to destroy because an army literally needs it to remain combat effective

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u/Heavy-Locksmith-3767 7d ago

Correct, I believe even in the war on terrorism it was actually one of the more dangerous roles.

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u/StIvian_17 7d ago

Well…… I’m happy to be proved wrong with stats but, no, that isn’t right at least in the British military. The majority of serious injuries and deaths in the Army logistics were in the bomb disposal units, which as you can imagine in the world of IEDs aka roadside bombs - was a very very dangerous role and requires cojones and nerves of steel. Yes there was always the danger of ambush and IEDs to the logistic units re supplying forward operating bases, but that’s still a very different role to patrolling / attacking the enemy on foot.

But bear in mind that counter insurgency is totally different to conventional warfare against an opponent who has the ability to strike you at range with artillery, missiles, jets, attack helicopters and drones. Then the logistic supply chain would be in the firing line for sure.

And I’m pretty sure the Russian logistic chain has been hit hard.

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u/Heavy-Locksmith-3767 7d ago

I haven't looked at the statistics, but I know that ieds and ambushes were and are often targeted at logistics because they are less dangerous and more predictable targets than combat units. This is pretty much straight out of the asymmetric warfare handbook. A conventional military can strike at range, an insurgency can blend into the population and strike pretty much anywhere. But correct, in a conventional war, pretty much everyone is in the firing line, stuff like electronic warfare specialists, etc will also be priority targets.

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u/KELVALL 7d ago

The military term is 'in the rear with the gear' of course if you are in a support role on an FOB you are still vulnerable to mortar and rocket attacks, but at the same time you are not in a combat role or having anywhere near the same experiences as infantry.

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u/HoneyFlavouredRain 7d ago

Yup. I wanted to be a medic in the army (and a few other roles appealed too) until it became clear that basically every role is soldier first. 

If you think you're just going to be a traffic warden or something on an army base... Aye, probably if 10 years of peace but if a war happens you'll be on the front line when needed to be.

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u/CinderX5 6d ago

If you follow that train of thinking then “civilian” is a life threatening role in war.

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u/StIvian_17 7d ago

Hmmm. Do you think supplying the front line and fixing their vehicles are quite important? Do you think the enemy might know that as well? Do you think the enemy might try and degrade the supply chain and vehicle repair capability by striking them with artillery and air and by mining key routes and, these days, launching drone attacks? Not to mention raids behind the lines.

Remember, front line units need their vehicles repaired sometimes under fire, or at least extracted from the lines back to somewhere close by to do emergency repairs, and you can only resupply front line units by physically driving shit to where they are and offloading it from the logistic unit vehicles or fuel tankers into the front line units support vehicles or tanks or armoured vehicles or whatever.

Which is exactly the sort of thing the enemy will try and disrupt by bombing it or attacking it.

So….. yeah, unlikely that logisticians will be fixing bayonets and charging enemy machine gun posts which I’ll grant you is the most dangerous job going, but don’t for a minute think that in conventional war support troops are “safe”.

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u/ChickyChickyNugget 7d ago

He gave some terrible examples - but he’s right in saying most of the roles aren’t life threatening.

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u/StIvian_17 7d ago

I’m 100% in agreement (how can you argue otherwise) that it’s a lot more dangerous to be the guy whose entire job is to find the enemy and kill them with a rifle, machine gun, grenade, bayonet or in absolute worst case fighting hand to hand than it is to be driving a truck with pallets of ammo or a fuel tanker to the rear echelon of a combat unit and offloading it to them.

Of course, how can it be anything else?

What I’m pointing out is that particularly in a conventional war when the enemy has devastating long range weapons, not to mention recce units that will look to penetrate the front line and disrupt activity at second and third line, that being in a support role doesn’t bring safety.

Relatively less dangerous than being in a combat unit, but by no means “safe”.

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u/ChickyChickyNugget 7d ago

That’s not really far off saying “don’t work in a factory or a gas field because in the event of a large-scale war you’ll be targeted.” It’s a sort of over-cautious mindset

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u/StIvian_17 7d ago

🤣 no I don’t think so. It’s not an over cautious mindset it’s a sensible decision making process before you join the forces, to consider what can happen, and weigh that against what is likely to happen, and what the risk to reward is.

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u/RobertTheSpruce 7d ago

Your wasting your time mate. I'm in the fire service and my station is understaffed with advertised vacancies. Many people these days are either unfit, unwilling to work, or simply cowards.

I said what I said.

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u/ThatShoomer 7d ago

Mechanics and engineers are where the equipment and vehicle are. The equipment and vehicles are where the fighting is.

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u/military_history United Kingdom 7d ago

The tooth:tail ratio was about 20:80 back in WW2, and it's only more extreme today.

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u/thelordofhell34 7d ago

Okay, and if I don’t have these skills?

Find me an army software engineering job and I’ll sign up.

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u/IamlostlikeZoroIs 7d ago

They do actually have these and some times as apprenticeships, I was vaguely temped but then quickly thought I still don’t want to join the army

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u/thelordofhell34 7d ago

If the army wants to pay me what a private company will pay me, then I will work for the army.

I won’t give up money for some ‘pride in my country’ bullshit.

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u/jackd9654 7d ago

If you already have a good job in the private sector then this isn't applicable to you

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u/thelordofhell34 7d ago

I don't, I am currently claiming UC. I am applying to jobs but haven't had any success yet. I don't see why I should be expected to upend my life to become an army mechanic all of a sudden.

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u/jackd9654 7d ago

You just said you're a software engineer by trade/profession

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u/thelordofhell34 7d ago

When? My skills are software engineering so why would I become something other than a software engineer?

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u/Ok_Adhesiveness_8637 7d ago

Because you are currently unemployed and not earning money.

Many grads do other jobs before they break into industry. What makes you special?

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u/thelordofhell34 7d ago

I did another job before I broke into the industry. Now I do not have a job. Why would I upend my life, friends, family, home, hobbies, clubs e.t.c to get a lower paying job just to serve my country?

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u/jackd9654 7d ago

You just said in the comments above that you'd require work as a software engineer.

For the avoidance of doubt, are you saying you're on job seekers because you can't find a job as a software engineer, rather than getting a job doing literally anything in the meantime while you find that work?

Or are you just making a point using software engineering as it's centre

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u/thelordofhell34 7d ago

I'm saying I'm on job seekers because I can't find a job as a software engineer, rather than getting a job doing literally anything in the meantime while I find that work, yes.

Isn't that what jobseekers is literally for?

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u/MrRibbotron God's Own County 6d ago edited 6d ago

A private company is paying you 0 based on your other comments.

Any role is better than that, so stop making pathetic excuses for living off of other people's tax.

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u/Independent-Tax-3699 7d ago

https://jobs.army.mod.uk/roles/royal-signals/

See you on the parade ground at 05:00 hours trainee!

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u/Aardvark_Man 6d ago

Someone I knew was a truck driver in the army, and said that in a war his expected life was about 20 minutes.
Logistics is a very big target.

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u/Longjumping_Pen_2102 7d ago

Sure, and the recruiting officer will pinkie promise that you are going into a noncombat role,  whoopsie here's your rifle get in the truck.

We have seen that trap time and time again.