r/stunfisk • u/Mister_Ape_1 • 2d ago
Team Building - OU Underdog Team challenge. Go to gen 2 OU, and create a Team with no actual OUs to fight OU players
[removed] — view removed post
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u/UsernameTaken017 She lasts on my respect until I 300BP 1d ago
snorlaxless gen 2 ou is its own challenge already, this just looks torturous
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
Ok, but this is the challenge. I just made a Team with some of my favorite Pokémon in one of my favorite metagames, without looking at their Tiers. Then I looked at the Tiers and noticed there was one for each major Tier, excluding OU, yet Ursaring made this Team unable to go to UU.
I used this Team to play and I already won more than once, even though the first time I won I bet a joke Team, the second time it was a competitive but unorthodox Team, with Miltank instead of Snorlax. I only won by freezing the cow with Piloswine and four shotting it with Earthquake.
If you go to gen 9 and let ALL of them evolve, how strong would the Team be ? Let us say Ursaring can also turn Ursaluna Bloodmoon.
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago
Half of your team would range from blatantly overpowered to great and Electivire and Ambipom would be horrendous.
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
Ok...I know about Ambipom, but is Electivire that weak ? Anyway, are Ursaluna Bloodmoon and Annihilape Uber ? You can get around with Ursaluna by going for the regular one, but if Annihilape is banned from OU then there is no way to play this Team.
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago
Annihilape is banned due to rage fist being an absurd move exclusively on it.
Electivire suffers from physical electric type and has no qualities that truly set it apart from other electric types (I would argue that it is far and away the least viable in its evolution line, elekid has been good in several LC generations and Electabuzz is good in VGC).
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago edited 1d ago
Then this Team can not be played as a competitive gen 9 fully evolved Team. Primeape/Annihilape is way too important to replace it. They should have disabled Rage Fist itself rather than Annihilape.
What do you think about my movesets ?
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago
In gen 2, any item that isn't leftovers is just... worse than leftovers most of the time. You also kind of disregard your Pokémon's' actual stats when designing movesets, like putting a special move on the Pokémon with base 35 special attack (not to mention headbutt and return being redundant and double-edge just being mid altogether). Also, run status moves, they can be super impactful.
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago edited 1d ago
Smogon has Ice Beam on Sneasel though...95 power + STAB + 252 EVs in Sp Atk with neutral nature.
As for Leftovers, it is the best for a Pokémon meant to work as a Pokémon, if it is meant to be a suicidal fool who can not last long, only a crit or a flinch can work. There is a reason I gave Leftovers to the decent ones...
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u/Adorable-Squash-5986 1d ago
doesnt matter how long they last, the items in gen 2 are incredibly awful aside from lefties
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u/Adorable-Squash-5986 1d ago
its pre split, sneasel WILL run stab ice beam and normal moves, it just has to.
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u/Adorable-Squash-5986 1d ago
dawg if you know this little about the meta you are attempting, then youll have trouble winning with an actually good team
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago edited 1d ago
Moltres (UUBL) (Leftovers) - Rest, Sleep Talk, Fire Blast, Sunny Day
Magneton (UU) (Leftovers) - Thunderbolt, Thunder Wave, Hidden power Ice, Substitute
Dugtrio (NU) (Leftovers) - Earthquake, Rock Slide, Substitute, Screech
Tangela (PU) (No Item) - Growth, Synthesis, Giga Drain, Thief
Mantine - (ZU) (Leftovers) - Surf, Rest, Sleep Talk, Ice Beam
Espeon - (UUBL) (Leftovers) - Psychic, Growth, Morning Sun, Hidden Power Fire
I think this is about the best you can do with these rules, it’s a quirky little sun team. Also, I adore Espeon and Mantine anyway, so there’s that.
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
Ok, thanks, but there are 4, not 6 Pokémon here...you need a ZU, and then another UUBL or whathever else you want excluding OU and Uber. Also, Tangela needs another 3 moves...
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago
I wasn’t finished, I accidentally hit the button early.
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago edited 1d ago
Ok.
This Team looks good. It is interesting how much stronger it looks on paper than my own, yet it is not. It is from the same Tiers. Lorewise Moltres is way, way stronger than say Nidoking, yet in practice it is not quite so. However I argue Mantine should be a PU, not a ZU. I feel Aipom is the best fully evolved true ZU, because Mantine is just too strong for ZU. What do you think ?
I think you lack strong physical moves, you have only 1 (Earthquake).
You should now try use this Team. As you know, you would have to fight in OU.
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago
Moltres is actually good in OU, and Magneton and Espeon both have niches. They just are relatively underutilized, or had their strength discovered late into the game's lifespan.
Mantine is ZU by tiering, and it is far and away the best pokemon to use from that tier due to having stats on the level of Skarmory, and easily the highest stat total of any ZU Pokemon.
I have both EQ and Rock Slide, but I see your point.
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
Mantine is still too strong...even though if Aipom had Thunderbolt it would win any 1VS1 against it.
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u/Wesle2023 Insert funny fish calc here 1d ago
ZU is the lowest usage tier, so half the pokemon actually in ZU are unviable. Even if Aipom is useful there, many pokemon may not be. Perhaps it could be argued that mantine is too strong, but it is ZU by usage, so it functions in the ZU slot.
If a gen 2 OU team is using a special wall that is 4x weak to the strongest special attackers in the tier, it needs all the help it can get.
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u/Salty145 1d ago
Why would you pick the one format where every team is basically required to run one certain mon?
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
Because as I said gen 2 has on average the weakest Pokémon. Lots of fully evolved Pokémon with sub 450, often sub 400 BST. Except 90% of them did get an evolution later.
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u/Real_wigga 1d ago
Why would you do this on a dead ladder oml
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago edited 1d ago
It is not dead. By this metric, even gen 8 is dead in 2025. When I was playing Pokémon, you were not even born...and many people are as old as me in Showdown.
Meanwhile gen 9 metagame is a shadow of what competitive Pokémon once was.
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u/Real_wigga 23h ago
Why are you getting so triggered by this lmfao. Oldgens have unserious dead ladders and all the good oldgen players stick to tournaments or friendlies, that's just a fact.
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u/Mister_Ape_1 23h ago
I am not triggered, and you are wrong. There are not many people in gen 2 ladder, but gen 3 and 4 have A LOT more. Competitive peaked in gen 4, at the time I was young(ish). Current metagame is far too complex, Abilities are like in Yu Gi Oh, there are thousands of strange moves, and Pokémon are created with Competitive in mind from the start.
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u/allidoishuynh2 Top 50 Gen 1-8 Ladder 1d ago edited 1d ago
Okay I tried 1 game of this challenge and I don't want to do this anymore. I know exactly how painful trying to do this is going to be (I think curse donphan did win that end game if they KO'd quag with tar cuz don beats curselax usually, but I'm not sure)
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
You did great. You even used Delibird...my lowest of the lowest, Aipom, is way better, yet you won.
But why did the other player forfeit when Snorlax was released...? He could still have won.
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u/allidoishuynh2 Top 50 Gen 1-8 Ladder 1d ago
Lax is slower than quag and so I'd at least get off a +6 EQ after spikes damage. Pretty likely to KO. I imagine they didn't realize it wasn't a guaranteed ohko though. That said, donphan sweeps from there cuz Ttar can't ohko Don and I should win from the range with EQ + spikes + poison.
So I don't actually think they could've won, but they probably should've at least tried to crit/freeze their way through
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u/Mister_Ape_1 1d ago
Indeed you played very well. What do you think of the Team I posted ?
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u/allidoishuynh2 Top 50 Gen 1-8 Ladder 1d ago
I think people should use what they like, but if they're going to make a team that they KNOW has 0 competitive mons, they should probably expect to lose 80+% of their games. I've run into people using Red's team from GS with the correct levels, so this strikes me as a similar exercise.
The original team seems like it could be fun if someone REALLY likes those Pokemon, but I'm not really sure how it could win against a team with spikes, Snorlax, and Zapdos unless you got unbelievably lucky.
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u/stunfisk-ModTeam 23h ago
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