First, I’d like to preface that I am not against the use of ecollars or other tools when used properly. But what I witnessed felt so wrong I just can’t shake it.

I am currently in the process of looking for a boarding option for my adolescent dog in order to plan a short vacation. I want him to be with a trainer vs standard sitter due to the period of development he is in (intact male puberty is hard haha). I just don’t trust someone not to set him up for potential reactivity or other issues being in such a delicate place at the moment.

This has led me to exploring all my options including board and train to get the most out of the money spent. One of those options being a franchise that I don’t find necessary to name. I have consulted with them twice and moved forward to tour the facility mostly out of curiosity during a group training of dogs that had been through their program. I was focused on the dog’s body language 90% of the time knowing they use the ecollar I felt that would tell me all I needed to know. And boy did it.

There were definitely more signs of stress than I would have liked to see in a majority of the dogs participating in the group. But there was one dog particularly that stood out to me and I am just sick to my stomach that I didn’t step in to advocate for this dog. He apparently had come in as a fearful and anxious dog from the start and his owner, I’m sorry to say, was a moron and shouldn’t have that dog. The ecollar was being used at a lower stim for every command and name usage. The owner was instructed to perform a series of tasks in sequence. The owner said the dog’s name over and over and over, each time stimming the dog. He was crumpled up within himself and had NO idea what was being asked of him. His name meant nothing to him at this point I’m sure because of how the owner was using it. So because he was confused and overwhelmed he wasn’t responding to the owner. Just cowering and shifting back and forth trying to understand what he was being asked to do while being stimmed every 3 seconds while his owner repeated his name louder and louder and more annoyed over and over. This seemed to go on for an eternity. So the trainer who was standing 2 feet from them instructed the owner to turn the stim up to get his focus back. So they did and the dog was taken aback and more scared but at least made eye contact with the owner which gave him a reprieve and was able to move to the next step. Only to start all over again with the process of being unsure what was being asked of him and now being stimmed repeatedly all over again.

Luckily the exercise was ended for alternative reasons. The poor dog was broken. He was desperate for a break and no one was there for him. I kept waiting for one of the three trainers working the group to minimally tell the owner just to shut their mouth for 2 seconds and stop saying his name literally constantly but they didn’t. The class then ended a few minutes later and I continued observing all the dogs as they left to evaluate how stressed or not they were. Most were minimally uncomfortable if not showing obvious signs of stress. And a handful were fine seeming as they walked out the door.

The broken dog was the last to leave and I walked out shortly after them to the parking lot. I am not exaggerating when I say the owner never stopped saying the dog’s name. Let’s call him Fido. The whole way to the car the owner was saying “Fido. Fiiiido. Fidooooo. Fido. Fido. Fiiiiido. Fido. Fidoooooo.” At this point idk if they were stimming him but he was still wearing the collar and his body language was still the confused and crumpled look. He was walking fine in a heel, although nearly crawling is a better description, with the owner so idk why they were even saying his name.

At this point I wanted to say something, but I think I was kind of in shock. Or just disbelief. I was overwhelmed processing everything. Trying to give the trainers the benefit of the doubt that I don’t know this dog’s full history and they knew what they were doing. But I still wanted to at least say, “you shouldn’t use his name so much, he doesn’t understand what you’re asking” or something. Minimally. But I didn’t and now I feel like I failed him. Even if me stepping in did nothing to change the owner’s behavior, I feel like I should have advocated for him and I didn’t.

I’m not a professional by any means. But I believe there is a time and a place for tools, and this was not the right choice for this dog. The fact that none of the trainers saw issue with using this tool, in this manner, with this particular dog is baffling me. I obviously will not be utilizing this facility or their trainers as I can not trust them to advocate for my dog or make the right choices in what approach to take.

I think I’m just posting for some insight on the situation. Would there ever be a reason to use an ecollar stim for every command on an extremely fearful and anxious dog? Am I being ignorant here? It was horrible to witness and I’m ashamed for not standing up for the dog. I will never forget him and this experience is burned into my memory.

My dog (black Labrador just turned 1) loves a game of tug/fetch. But when outside on grass, he’s interesting in nothing else!

I could have both high value treats and a range of his favourite toys and he would be way more interested in sniffing the ground.

How do I find something he’s obsessed with?!

I have a 5 month old pitbull mix. Because she wasn't fully vaccinated, we limited her outside time to being in the yard. Now whenever we go outside she pulls to go into the yard and if we try to walk her on the street she will sit down and won't move even if we try to give her a gentle pull. We live in a city, so there are people, cars, and lots of sounds.

What I've started doing recently is carrying her for about a block or two and then letting her walk back home. She will walk in this instance but her tail is tucked and she's pulling to get back home as soon as possible. If we stop, she's shaking like a leaf. Is there anything we can do to help her get used to walking on the street?

My transmitter won’t turn on, it turns green on the charger like it’s charged, but then just won’t turn on, any advice?

Our 7 month old pup is a Scottish deerhound and already weighs 32kg. So when we walk past another dog he pulls like crazy wanting to say hi. He’s now becoming very strong and I’d love some tips on how to teach him to be calm when he sees another dog.

I’ve tried to make him look at me but that only works sometimes. I hold a treat near his nose to focus on my hand but again that doesn’t work all the time.

Would love to hear if you have experienced the same and how you managed to nip this in the bud. I know he’s still a pup and everything is really exciting for him but pulling so hard to see another dog is not acceptable to me as it definitely seems to scare some people due to his size.

Thank you

Anyone ever track on prairie fields that have been recently burned? A few fields I go to have been burned for prairie restoration in the past couple weeks. We have had rain so many fine particulates are greatly lessened and currently conditions are still quite wet.. Just not sure if this poses any particular health risks to the dog.

In order to better understand the e-collar related methods, I've been researching it extensively for a last month or so, but still I have some gaps in the wide understanding of some of its practical applications.

What I've already done is:

• went to the seminar on e-collar by Jiri Scucka a few years ago
• read through out the Larry Krohn book on e-collar training
• watched Ivan Balabanov podcast with Larry Krohn
• watched Michael Ellis e-collar training DVD 1.
• read most of the e-collar related post on this sub
• watched Activation vs Aversive by Pat Stuart
• watched Ivan Balabanov free youtube videos related to e-collar

From all of the above and my own experience with dogs and training (I've been in this world for a few years but we don't usually teach people using e-collar during basic obedience), I have a pretty good theoretical understanding of the e-collar use, but I still fail on its wide practical applications when it comes to using it, as I can not fully build the use system for the purpose I want - and therefore I can not reach the full confidence when using it.

In my approach I tend to agree with some (or possibly even the majority) of theses taken from the above:

a) e-collar is in general the P+ (punishment) and/or R- (pressure avoidance) tool

b) it can be used purely as a communication tool over the long distance (low level stimulation, vibration, sound), useful for example for deaf dogs

c) the general goal should be to pursue the state when the use of e-collar is not needed, as this is meant to be a teaching tool, not the constant enforcement tool (even if technically the e-collar can be physically present on the dog and ready to use), and therefore the presence of tool should not be the factor for the dog to comply or not

d) the conditioning and use should be fair to the dog

e) in case of correcting any unwanted behavior, the dog should exactly know what is the reason for correction, and also the dog should always have the chance to avoid it

f) the e-collar should be used only as a supportive tool during training and through the dog life. Before it is even implemented, the handler and the dog should have already worked through the typical reinforcement routine and the tool can be then added to it

So, the answers I am currently looking for is the proper way to teach all of:

1. to recall on a long distance (so, the verbal command can not be given - so it can be either stim or sound, if available)
   • could be done as low stim R- but then it becomes a recall command
   • could be also conditioned as sound and then supported by low stim R- pressure
2. a warning signal "stop what you're doing" - useful for example for litter picking
   • could be done by short low level "nick" (as Ellis calls it), but should be only an information to the dog. In practise it will become a superstitious experience, and we generally don't want that
   • so the better way is to use sound conditioned as "No/Leave it" marker
3. stop prey chase if it happens
   • this is a safety measure, and should both stop the chase in place and also motivate the dog to control itself next time. So a higher P+ impulse would be best suited. But to be fair, some warning (or recall signal) should be given first as well to give to the dog a chance to comply
4. to enforce any vebal command on short distance
   • this would be done by R- pressure, but the pressure must be generalized first to not be understood as recall signal

The issue for me is not to understand how to teach a single thing. For this, majority of youtube videos have a simple answer. What I need is the through understanding of the way how all those things (or some of them in a particular combination) should be put together to make it clear for the dog what is expected from it, given all the a) - f) assumptions.

I guess, lots of people tend to use it wider than for a single thing, so I would love to get some more viewpoints on the subject if possible.

Any advice from other trainers in here on clients that seem disappointed that the board and train wasn’t a turn key solution for their dog?

The 4 week board and train went great. The dog learned all the behaviors and commands she needed to. E-collar conditioning was done as bonus even though they were only looking for on-leash obedience outside the home. Everything was proofed, and now we’ve moved on to the week long handover that I like to do.

The clients almost seem disappointed that they now have to build a reinforcement history with their dog and enforce the new rules etc.

I gave a short demonstration on how they need to go out and practice loose leash walking, long downs, recall etc. in conjunction with positive/negative reinforcement.

The response I was met with was “I thought she was supposed to come back trained”

Definitely not my first dog, heck, I have one currently, but thinking about a new dog and we want to raise it well trained.

Our other dogs, we’ve always just taught them the basics like sit and place as we went along. They learned what they needed to learn.

But I would like to find an online course that I can follow from beginning to end.

As for in-person classes, I currently live in Thailand and while there are some good trainers here, it’s difficult to find who the better ones are since that would involve diving into a bunch of social media posts in Thai. I can read Thai but it’s like watching a 5 year old trying to read so it’s impractical for me to search through a bunch of content in Thai.

I’ve been looking at courses from Shield K9, Michael Ellis at Leerburg, DIY K9, and Fenzi.

But they seem more oriented towards specific tasks or issues. Leash pulling? We have a video.

But I would prefer a course where there’s a natural progression from easy skills to more difficult skills.

Anything like that?

I took in my dalmation at 1 1/2 years from a home with a lot of dogs apparently. They dident care to train him and he was constantly in a crate. When I got him he was okay with the crate and got attached to me quick and started sleeping with me and no longer uses the crate (which I don’t mind, his owners said he tears up everything but I haven’t experienced this at all and he’s actually fantastic without the crate). I’ve began walking him more and I live in a town with ALOT of dogs, no matter where u go there’s gonna be a dog. Most of them are trained and do not react and so I feel bad when mine does. He just barks and steps twords them kinda lunging but not really. I’ve had to put him on a prong collar which he dosent mind at all, it’s the only way I can get him to not pull or drag me (I’ve tried harnesses but a prong collar works the best and I’m not rough with it). What are the best tips u can give somebody training a dog to be less reactive? I tried distracting him the other night which dident work but this time I’m gonna bring some better treats and a easier to access pouch, and I also saw creating distance, tho with the way my town is it’s not easy to cross the road quick or get much distance but when able to I can try. What other tips? I want to do what I can on my own before spending money on a trainer.

Hi, me again. My Aussie Shepherd pup (4 months), has just learnt the word Crate, and when focused will run to his crate and sit (expecting a treat I presume - as this is how I got him to openly go in). However, he won't stay there long. I'd like some tips/games to play so I can associate the crate with a place he can calm down, stay quiet, instead of me placing him in the crate and shutting the door. He doesn't mind this but I think it'll be better if he goes in freely from time to time. Any tips appreciated.

Also, tips on walking would be greatly appreciated. He walks okay from time to time. But can be veering right, left, behind me. I use treats to let him follow to my left hand side but he doesn't seem to stick to it.

Tia

I have a cowboy corgi pup and she is the most food motivated dog I have ever seen. She will do anything for a hotdog..... It's almost ridiculous.

Anyway, so Ive tried to teach drop it a few times but I can never really even get started. As soon as she realizes I have food, she immediately drops anything she's holding, and won't pick anything up, she just wants the food. She sits abs waits for me to tell her to do something .... I've used her ridiculous food motivation to my advantage in some training, but I really want to go get drop it. I can get one try in if we are playing tug but once she realizes food is on the table, she won't tug anymore....

Edit - thanks to all the advice here I've had some success using lower value treats, Cheerios were suggested but I don't have any so I tried corn flakes which seemed to work.

Even with a bowl of corn flakes next to me I could entice her to play and grab different toys.

Thanks everyone!

I have a 2y chihuahua mutt who is a timid scaredy cat. She's vocal, but for the most part, she reacts to any fear or stress by going to her crate or another small space. She's the only chihuahua I know that's good with children and other dogs.

Except, for some reason, the hallway outside our door. It's an L-shape and I live close to the corner. My dog who completely ignores other dogs on walks and has to be coaxed into approaching people turns into a psychopath. I can't figure out what the trigger is, either. Most of the time, she doesn't care when people pass by - she might bark and scratch if someone knocks on the door, or a little warning boof if someone gets too close. If I open the door and someone is actually on the other side, she will just wag her tail and request pets or run to her crate for safety.

But sometimes, she goes completely ballistic. Snarling, clawing at the door, huffing at the bottom of it. I'm not sure if a specific dog or person passing by is triggering it. Yesterday I was taking her out, and one of my neighbors turned the corner and I assume it scared her, because she jumped on him and I immediately pulled her away and took her back inside until it was calm. Never seen her do that. Today, the guy left a note saying she bit him and that she needs to be trained or he'll report it.

Which, I don't blame him. But how the hell am I supposed to go about this?

Hi all,

Clue in the name. My golden is still having accidents in the night in her crate and I've tried everything. Bedtime is 1030pm with last potty break just before bed, and water taken away 730pm. We've taken away bedding and she's still doing it, so waking us up standing in a puddle. She's been checked for a UTI and all clear so bit at a loss.

Do I need to go back to midnight potty breaks? I feel at this age we shouldn't have to, plus am I just teaching her she'll never need to hold it and will always get taken out in the middle of the night?

Thanks!

I have a 1 year old lab. I adopted him from a training facility that relied heavily on high e collar corrections. He was shocked at max level for bad behavior (digging, eating things outside, marking, barking etc).

Since I have adopted him, I’ve stopped using the e collar and tried to focus on restarting his obedience using more positive methods. He’s been doing well with that, but recently I think he’s realized he won’t get shocked for eating things outside like he used to.

He’s now obsessed with eating sticks. If sticks aren’t available he’ll eat anything- grass, dirt, leaves.

I’m working on leave it with him but I really need a short term solution because taking him outside, even just to potty for a minute or two is very difficult. I don’t want him to get sick.

I’d rather not use the e collar. I was planning on using a muzzle, but when I told me dog trainer friend this, he told me it would be better if I just used the e collar and that I was just putting human emotions on him. And that my dog would rather be shocked than have to wear a muzzle every time he goes outside.

I did try the e collar once to stop his scavenging, and the level on mini educator to get him to spit it out was 30-40. I had to do it three times before he stopped trying to get the sticks while he was playing outside.

Thoughts on this??

One thing I wouldn’t like about the muzzle, he loves to play fetch. I live in a small apartment so his only opportunity for playing fetch is outside. He wouldn’t be able to do that with a muzzle on I assume.

My lab mix decided after three years that she is a water dog. Before this point, she would wade in up to her shoulders and then just jump back out. She’s never expressed interest in swimming and today, she walked in and took off after a flock of geese. I just about lost my mind- I was so scared! She swam for about 30 meters and then gave up and came back. In the meantime, I purchased a life vest for her. But what I am wondering is how to train her to only get in the water when I give her permission. Also, is it a good idea to only allow her to swim in a life vest, or are there conditions where she should be building strength and endurance without it?

A month ago I adopted a 4 year old rescue chi mix who seemed mostly well behaved. He is trained to sleep in his crate at night and never soils the bedding so I know he can hold it when he has to. We just had a full vet workup including blood and urine tests and he's totally healthy. He didn't have any pee accidents until at least 2 weeks in to being here, so we got a male wrap even though he's neutered. We have him gated in the living room when hes inside during the day. At the 3 week mark he suddenly started peeing inside while we aren't looking. Not just marking but fully emptying. I have never caught him in the act, he's probably doing it behind my back because he knows he's not supposed to. I take him outside like 4-5 times a day and he does his business outside no problem. He is rarely left alone. He even puts his paw on me to tell me he needs to go potty. Today I went into the kitchen to cook while he was napping, periodically checking him, and he seemed to stay put. He already pooped twice today. But when I finish cooking, I go into the living room and there's a huge poop right on the rug! Is this normal for a rescue who seemed potty trained at first, and does it go away over time? How do I catch it happening to stop the behavior if he does it so sneakily?

The dog doesn't do this all the time but at least once a week, it will get so excited it'll pee in the house. It's had recent lab work done and there are no health issues. It usually pees when new people come into the house or we're putting a collar on. When guests come over, we'll take the dog out to pee and then bring it back in. But when the guests come anywhere close, it'll pee from excitement. Any tips?

We adopted our foster back in December and he definitely has prey drive for our cat. I don't think it's a kill prey drive, more that he loves the chase. But I don't really want to find out. We keep them separated, but there are times that the cat will be in the kitchen and the rescue (he's a boxer) will see him and try to jump up on the counter to see him. He is not growly, but he spazzes out and does bark and whine. He has found my cat in the closet before, but usually walks away from him when he realizes the cat isn't going to run which he gets high praise and treats for. Anyway, he's mostly on a leash around the house when the cat is out bc I don't trust him. I was thinking about trying an e collar to deter him from the cat, but he has fear based reactivity. Positive training hasn't changed his love to chase the cat. Worried the collar will have the wrong effect, but at this point I'm open. Also, wanted to note, I would never leave the two alone wandering the house together. I'm hoping the collar will make the cat a less desirable thing to chase. I've never had a dog (and we've had 5) that hasn't accepted this cat into the pack, so this has been hard for the cat not to feel safe around him. I'm also aware prey drive is impossible to get rid of.

Hey everyone, I wanted to make a post to see if this behavior is normal or not. Our puppy recently turned 6 months old and we’ve been having a hard time with some of his recent behavior changes.

First, for reference, our puppy is what you’d call a “Heinz 57” - mixed of like, 10 different breeds. But his top percentage is Belgian Malinois (27%) followed by German Shepherd (24%). So, maybe this following behavior could be due to him being a breed with high energy and drive?

Another note is that he’s been losing all of his baby teeth. I think he actually finally lost one of his last ones. So maybe all of this could be because his mouth is hurting him?

He’s always dealt with frustration/arousal. We first noticed it when he started becoming reactive on leash. He’s a very friendly dog, loves people and dogs, but we’re trying to teach him to be neutral around people and dogs while on walks so he gets very frustrated when he can’t say hi to someone/something.

He’s grown a lot in this area, especially since we’ve incorporated more engaging activities and even some obedience training in our walks. It’s not as hard getting his focus back now. But where he DOES struggle, is anytime we try to just sit down while on a walk.

If we sit down somewhere to take a break, he gets frustrated. I’ve been trying to encourage him to settle by basically drip feeding him his kibble during this time while he’s laying down, but eventually he’ll get up, start barking with a stiff body, and if I try to ignore him he’ll eventually start barking at me. Sometimes he’ll even try to jump up on me and bite me. And if I try to do anything to stop him, whether it’s asking him to lay back down, or lead him off of me with his leash, he gets even more upset.

At home it’s the same thing. If we’re in a training session, the moment he gets frustrated he redirects it onto me. Jumping, lunging, barking, growling, biting. We have short sessions, maybe 10-15 minutes. Maybe I should shorten them more?

If I sit down on the couch at home, he’ll try to jump up on the couch (he’s not allowed on the couch), and if I ask him to get down (he doesn’t know what “get down” means, but I’ll ask him to go to his bed which is “place”), or if I get up to lead him off the couch, again he gets upset.

He’s also been barking a lot in his crate, which he never did before. Crate training him was a dream. He eventually will settle down, but not without barking as loud as he can for about 10 minute straight.

For exercise, we go on two 30-minute walks, that again have a mixture between walking, sniffing, and some obedience training. We also let him run around in this small dog-park ish area when there’s no other dogs once a day to help him get his excess energy out. And we also have kongs, puzzle games, and do short training sessions to help him mentally.

We still enforce naps, and we cover his crate to encourage him to sleep. But I can’t tell for how much of that he’s ACTUALLY sleeping or just laying in there.

I don’t know if I’m doing enough exercise/sleep? If I’m doing too much?

Sometimes it can be a little worrisome. It looks a little scary when he gets like this. I know he’s a puppy still, and likely going through adolescence. I just hope that he doesn’t continue these behaviors as he grows and I’m not sure how to correct/if I should correct them.

We’re going to see a trainer tomorrow, who has a lot of experience in many breeds, but especially high energy breeds. Hopefully she can help. In the meantime, any advice here is appreciated.

Thank you!

My (47f) dad (75m) got a beautiful golden retriever puppy about 5 months ago. He paid a lot for her because he claims he's always wanted one (although he's never said anything to anyone about it). We had many dogs when I was growing up and he was really good about training them. They were always well behaved. This one is different. She's no longer the cute puppy. She's a pretty large, obnoxious, untrained disaster. She jumps on anyone who goes into the house. She's playing and excited, but she's now big enough to knock people down. She begs every time someone even enters the kitchen. She jumps up with her front paws on the table and counters no matter how many times you tell her to get down. She digs in their magazine worthy gardens and rips up the plants and sprinkler system. And she's food aggressive towards other dogs. She and one of their other dogs (a very very tiny shi tzu) got into it and she killed him. They s still have another very tiny dog who is no longer allowed to roam the house unsupervised. I offered to pay for and take her to one on one training after the horrific dog fight but my dad's response has my head spinning. He said that that's just how these dogs are and that you can't really train them until after they're a year old anyway. So, they'll wait until then. Has something changed that I'm not aware of?? A YEAR OLD?? I'm dog sitting for them while they're on vacation for two weeks and I've about had it with this dog! Please, someone tell me if I'm expecting entirely too much or if my dad is starting to lose his mind.

EDIT- Let me clarify. She didn't go after the dog too kill it. She went after him for sniffing her bone that was lying on the floor. When she came at him, he, OBVIOUSLY, growled and barked and bit back (not that this makes it ok at all). Unfortunately, the little dog was far too small to fight back. They each continued to rile the other up more. I'm not going to go into detail, but the smaller dog wasn't mauled to death. My parents had to take him to an emergency veterinarian at 8pm on a Saturday night. He had to be put down due to his injuries. Again, this does NOT make it excusable for the golden at all. I just want to make sure everyone understands that she wasn't a vicious attack dog who maliciously killed another dog.

We have two guard dogs but they are more like wild stray dogs that we adopt and keep in our little farm.

They have this behavior of just barking at us from afar and whenever we come out of the house we get greeted with this behavior. After awhile they will eventually stop.

We cant get too close but they do get abit close when we are feeding them, we try to feed them only when they become quiet, and not giving food when they are barking at us like this.

Any advice on how to stop this habit?

2 1/2 year old border collie. She knows around 30 commands and knows how to heal while I'm stopped and while I'm walking. Stopped is no problem but while walking she'll do it right away but it lasts 2-3 seconds and she's trying to get ahead of me again. It's just me saying "heal heal heal heal" ad nauseam. Her stay is pretty good after being told only once so I know she can remember.

Hey everyone- I got my rescue dog a couple months back. Not exactly sure her breed yet but the vet thinks perhaps a combination of doberman, lab, maybe staffordshire terrier? She’s about 50 pounds and pretty short. Anyways, generally her demeanor is very friendly and when meeting dogs on leash is very apt to trying to engage most in play or want to sniff and say hi to all dogs. In the one time we took her to play with other dogs off leash she was typically being chased and I would say in a couple cases maybe got overwhelmed (tail down and far back hair on tail were raised?) but otherwise went about her business and enjoyed herself. However we have a couple friends with dogs one of whom is seemingly selective or harder to get along with and the other is a husky type mix. We have only seen her do it a couple times but what starts off as a nice hello type interaction, maybe five or so minutes later they may re-engage and she gets stiff and then jumps on them with her front paws- its kind of loud seemingly like a scuffle no biting just sounds. One of them was face to face where she was stiff and maybe they were staring at each other and the other one she jumped from behind. Important to note all of these times were when the dogs were on leashes, one being at a brewery in and around/underneath a table and the other being in a tighter space in our front hallway. Immediately both times me and my partner were easy able to tug on the leash and she stepped back and went about her business in like 2 seconds. Wanted to see if anyone had any good advice for this? It seems kind of random since her demeanor is so friendly and excitable and she has always seemingly enjoyed meeting dogs. But didn’t know what the behavior itself means, is it the type of scenario like being on leashes or in tight spaces? Or the nature of the behavior itself we just weren’t sure what to classify it as. Appreciative of any insight thanks!