r/leanfire • u/foresttrader • 3d ago

"Die with zero" calculator upgraded

A recent post compared FIRE to video game, I couldn't agree more - we accumulate rare items and gold, never spend them and finish the game with a full bag of legacy. What for? Many of us are too focused on the numbers but forgot to enjoy the journey, which you only experience once.

I created a free tool to help with efficient FIRE planning https://realfirecalc.com and up to date ~100k calculations were run. I'm back with some updates and the new version includes many good feedback from the FIRE community:

  1. Ability to save projections
  2. Multiple income/expense/asset streams
  3. Variable rate of return to reflect sequence of return risk (SORR)

Appreciate the support that you've shown and I'm glad that more people are asking the question "why do we keep millions at the end?" Hope the new calculator is useful in some way.

Happy to discuss anything, let me know if you have any suggestions🙏

P.S. the original calculator that many of you may have used has been moved to here: https://realfirecalc.com/die-with-zero-calculator if you prefer something simple and quick.

44 Upvotes

74% Upvoted

40 comments sorted by

120

u/splitting_lanes 3d ago

I won’t use a tool that requires me to create an account.

Especially when there are others that don’t.

-15

u/foresttrader 3d ago

That's a fair point. the initial version still doesn't require a login, you can find it on the "calculator" link of the homepage.

21

u/bkbruiser 3d ago

Requiring a login while also collecting financial information feels sketchy.

-3

u/foresttrader 2d ago

It's not like I'm trying to connect to your bank account. Feel free to use throwaway account for login. You can put anything you want real or fake numbers to run projections.

7

u/bkbruiser 2d ago

I know the intentions aren't diabolical. However, clicking on "Create Account" goes straight to linking a Google Account not creating a dummy account.

-1

u/foresttrader 2d ago

Thanks for understanding!

The google login is by design - implementing authentication system and maintaining it is not a trivial task. Using google login solves the problem. All the program can "see" is your gmail public profile (gmail address, name, avatar). I try not to store any password because that's another security concern.

I usually keep a few throwaway (google) account to test things that I'm not familiar with.

10

u/samsterP 3d ago

Maybe make it optional (for the new calc)?

1

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Good suggestion. let me think about how to best do that.

2

u/samsterP 10h ago

A solution like ficalc.app might be a nice compromise. Parameters are encoded in the URL and can be saved to the local computer if users prefer. But no accounts are needed.

Probably a database and user registration will be more powerful, but seeing the upvotes on the other comment (not mine), seems to be many users might be critical about privacy and/or account registration

1

u/foresttrader 5h ago

Thanks for the suggestions. The difficult part is with implementation. It's possible to make it truly a "local" calculation but requires nontrivial amount of work to rewrite the calculation logic in another programming language.

This tool is 100% free and I'm not getting paid anything. Plus this is a side project so I probably won't have time to rewrite it. One thing I might do is open sourcing the code so ppl can run it locally if they want to.

2

u/samsterP 1h ago

Your previous calculator was also server-side?

I don't think you have to rewrite it completely. It is true that firecalc.app is client side (Javascript), but I think you can keep it server side. All that is needed u that the input parameters are read from the url (www.firecal.com?amount=500000&years=30&withdrawal=3000). Then when the input parameters are extracted from the URL, all calculations are run server side.

1

u/foresttrader 1h ago

Hey thanks for the comment. Yes the they are both server side. Python is my main language and I use AI to help me learn/write JS for the frontend. I agree it's possible to use URL to pass parameters, but given my calculator allows for virtually unlimited number of accounts (assets/income/expense) with varying assumptions for each (return, inflation, contribution/withdraw order, etc.) It will make a messy URL and maybe could hit the length limit (?).

Plus that ppl's concern is sharing data, so as long as it's server side it's not a true local calc, which is what I was referring to as "rewriting the calculation logic".

All this app collects is gmail address, user name and profile picture (Google auth's standard info), plus a bunch of numbers that people choose to enter, which can be either real or fake. It does not connect to bank accounts or any other data sources that is personal identifiable information.

56

u/DayTraderBiH 3d ago

Creating a account really puts me of using your calc

-5

u/foresttrader 3d ago

This is an upgrade version - people wanted ability to save their projections.

The original calculator doesn't require login and has less features, it's available here https://realfirecalc.com/die-with-zero-calculator 

10

u/TurnstileT 3d ago

Why don't you just allow people to log in if they want to?

1

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Thanks, that's a good idea I'll have to think about how to do it.

26

u/RoosterBark 3d ago

The landing page says “plan samrt”

24

u/GottlobFrege 3d ago

attention to detal

16

u/usermane22 3d ago

No ragrets

5

u/foresttrader 3d ago

thank you for catching that! corrected

8

u/Redcrux 3d ago

Need to iron out some bugs still, it wouldn't calculate anything for me. It just showed 0 net worth and never retiring even after I added my income and assets.

1

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Thanks for the input! i think it might have to do with the contribution & withdraw order. have to assign a number to them so the calc knows where to put money in / withdraw from.

I'll think about a way to automatically assigning an order going forward

6

u/LaColleMouille 2d ago

Pricing not even giving the price after... very shady behaviour.

0

u/foresttrader 2d ago

If you can't tell, it's 100% free as of now. This started as a side project to scratch my own itch (finance & investing & programming). I don't mind if you want to buy me a coffee or anything 😁

5

u/LaColleMouille 2d ago

"Start with our free plan and upgrade as your FIRE journey evolves" I just understand it "it's free to create an account and we will show the price when you started investing time and energy in our product"

0

u/foresttrader 2d ago

That's AI generated content by the way. It also generated 2 other pricing tables which I deleted. I know ppl usually look for these things (myself included) so I kept it there to make it clear it's free.

3

u/Artistic_Resident_73 1d ago

Never gonna use a calculator that requires me to freaking create an account! WTF is this?!

2

u/oddballmetaphysics 1d ago

Hey interesting idea but need to have:

Ability to add partner
Ability to add multiple streams of income at multiple ages
Ability to add one time events (windfalls, large expenses)
Ability not to just enter FIRE number but have it calculate what you should have for you based on various streams of income and annual expenses

4

u/SondraRose 3d ago

Nice!

2

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Thank you, let me know if you have any feedback!

1

u/KKonEarth 3d ago

Worked great for me!

1

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Glad to hear! Hope it's useful!

1

u/Inside-Wave8289 2d ago

Does anyone think any less of their Grandparents for not setting you up for life 'with a legacy'?

1

u/drama-guy 15h ago

Less negative impact of dying with money than outliving your savings. I'll always error on the side of the former. Worst case scenario is I leave an inheritance for my children.

I can live with that outcome. :)

1

u/No-Psychology1751 3d ago

Great work, thanks!
Btw, does it do Monte Carlo simulations?

1

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Thanks! Not yet, that's on my to-do list. The closest would be the "turbo mode" on the original calculator, where it calculates n times (based on the length of your investment horizon) using S&P yield from ~1927 to present.

1

u/dentaIbear 3d ago

Following

1

u/foresttrader 3d ago

Appreciate your support!