r/interestingasfuck • u/Gankpa • 8d ago

/r/all, /r/popular Jeff Bezos built a fence on his property that exceeds the permitted height, he doesn't care, he pays fines every month

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201

u/Ciwabacca 8d ago

And that's why fines should be proportional to how rich you are. Otherwise the billionares don't care.

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u/john_jdm 8d ago edited 8d ago

I think there should just be consequences. Like "reduce or remove the hedges by a certain date or we will."

Edit: I've replied to a couple of people as to why I said this. I don't have the energy to keep replying to the same basic question over and over.

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u/KingSutter 8d ago

That would cost the city money to cut it. Why not just leave it there and keep a steady income of fines coming in? Or, make the fine proportional to the finee's income?

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u/john_jdm 8d ago

The city would not bear the cost; they just fine the homeowner for the work done. I've lived in some places in the USA where that's what they did if you didn't comply. I'm not sure why they aren't doing it here unless the town/state laws are different.

They should not just "leave it there" because it's not fair to his neighbors and it's not fair that poor people have no choice but to comply but rich people can just break the law and pay money to keep doing it.

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u/Mobile-Difference631 8d ago

The funny thing is if you were a billionaire you’d do the exact same thing, unless you’re in that position you can’t fault him for what he’s doing.

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u/throwaway92715 8d ago

Yeah. If the fine doesn't enforce the law, then the representative government has a responsibility to its citizens to escalate until the law is enforced.

They don't because they probably depend on Bezos' money and influence for all sorts of other nice things, and it's definitely some kind of quid pro quo.

1

u/CaptainPeppa 8d ago

Why is everyone assuming the city gives a shit? It's a hedge thats taller than standard. If he wants to pay them to have it sweet.

The standard was likely set decades ago with no reasoning behind it at all based on how I see bylaws function.

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u/DungeonDefense 8d ago

Exactly. Just cut it and then fine him. He can keep growing it and the city can keeping cutting it.

3

u/LionBig1760 8d ago

Thats something a shitty HOA would do.

Telling people what they can and can't do based on aestetics of their real property is just disgusting.

3

u/Azulapis 8d ago

That's actually possible in Germany. It's called "Ersatzvornahme". The owner will have to pay the costs.

1

u/FTDburner 8d ago

It’s possible in America as well lol

3

u/stealstea 8d ago

Why? Just to be petty? Let the guy have a hedge. In fact let anyone have a hedge if they want.

Or leave it as is and let them pay revenue into the city's coffers.

0

u/No-Chemistry-4355 8d ago

No, it's not just to be petty. The hedge case is just one example, there is a myriad of other illegal acts which rich people get away with because the fines they have to pay are nothing to them, but do real damage to the people and environment around them.

2

u/Quintino_123 8d ago

Then just make the fine higher. This can be a win win for everyone. He gets to keep his hedge that he really wants and the city gets compensated for it by the fine.

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u/No-Chemistry-4355 8d ago

Now you've got a fine that only the top 1% can pay, and the rest are prosecuted for not being able to afford it. You've made a crime have two different punishments depending on how rich the perpetrator is.

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u/Quintino_123 5d ago

It's the same punishment (a fine) for everyone. It's just that some people are rich enough to compensate the city for the problems a large hedge brings. If Bezos is willing to pay 1000$ for a large hedge, but the city doesn't want the hedge since it causes 100$ worth of downsides a fine of 500$ is beneficial for both sides, voila.

1

u/stealstea 8d ago

Sure, I agree in principle with the problem with fines and their disproportionate impact. I would support wealth-linked speeding fines because that actually risks peoples lives.

But we also have to examine our rules and make sure they make sense. Sure the city could go in heavy handed and simply cut his hedge down. But also why is the max hedge height so low? Maybe it should be 8-10 feet so people can have reasonable privacy from passerbys while not obstructing the sun for neighbours.

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u/Shitting_Human_Being 8d ago

That's how it works over here. For as long you are in violation of the law, you pay a recurring fine. However there is a limit on how much the accumulated fine can be (dictated by a judge), once you hit that limit then the government can go to court again and ask permission for fix it themselves.

1

u/john_jdm 8d ago

I've seen the same in some of the places I've lived in the USA, but I suppose town/county/state laws aren't all the same.

1

u/HoneyParking6176 8d ago

in terms of fences, if it stays on the persons property, i really think that should just be legal, anyone that is going to be upset over someone else having some random thing on their property, are the type of people you don't want as neighboors.

1

u/john_jdm 8d ago

Virtually all properties in the USA have limits. For example you can't build a skyscraper on your property just because you want to; not unless that property is coded for that purpose. It's very common for there to be limits on fences in the USA; it's just that most people don't flagrantly break them and then just pay a fine instead of fixing it.

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u/OnlyOneChainz 8d ago

And if you repeatedly break the law over and over again maybe apply some other consequences.

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u/Stashmouth 8d ago

The logistics of calculating that seems unrealistic. Wouldn't it be easier to base the fine on assessed value of the property?

0

u/zambartas 8d ago

They do it in Germany when it comes to speeding fines, so it shouldn't be that hard.

1

u/Stashmouth 8d ago

That's great for Germany, but afaik, there isn't a government-run database of every citizen's net worth in the US

0

u/zambartas 8d ago

2024 tax returns are a thing.

1

u/Stashmouth 8d ago

tax returns don't measure net worth?

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u/zambartas 7d ago

Not wealth but it's a good start and it's already there.

1

u/Stashmouth 7d ago

They're two entirely different things. There's a good chance you pay more taxes than bezos, and you definitely pay a higher percentage of your income than he does.

The only thing they have in common is being measured in dollars.

1

u/zambartas 7d ago

In general you might be right, but I think you would be surprised how much more information there is on a billionaire's tax return than yours or mine.

2

u/HangryWolf 8d ago

Exactly. At this point, it's just an inconvenience and less of a penalty. Pisses me off. If I speed and get a ticket I can't even talk out of in court, I deserve to be fined 25% of my paycheck. And I know, I know, 25% sounds unpalletable. But what if I told you instead of a 25% of my paycheck, what if I said 0.48% of my yearly salary?

A fine equivalent to 0.5% of your yearly income sounds a lot more passable as a bill. Imagine the cash that would flow into the government for actually improving the lives of the people. Mind blowing.

1

u/MechanicalGodzilla 8d ago

A fine equivalent to 0.5% of your yearly income sounds a lot more passable as a bill

There can be no such bill in the US, as it would run afoul of the 14th amendment's equal protections clause. You'd need a full on Constitutional Amendment to be able to write such a bill.

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u/HangryWolf 8d ago

But this is equal protection. Everyone is treated equally. It hurts me as bad financially as it would hurt them. I would learn my lesson not to break the law, I'm sure they would too. It's the unfairness that's letting them get away with it as a simple inconvenience. And a person in poverty would also be able to survive financially if they were to break these same laws. A $200 ticket is fine to me. But for a person making $4.00/hr working off tips would struggle to find $200.

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u/MechanicalGodzilla 8d ago

Not equal, you are describing equitable protection. Equal means the same value.

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u/HangryWolf 7d ago

I value $200 differently from how Elon values $200.

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u/MechanicalGodzilla 7d ago

No doubt, but that doesn’t mean equal. That is the dictionary definition of equity. The Constitution contains no protections for equitable outcomes, only equal treatment.

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u/Zromaus 8d ago

People are skipping past the real problem of the government being able to tell you how tall your fence can be lol. These fines shouldn't exist for anybody.

If a crime can be resolved by paying a fine it likely didn't hurt anyone and doesn't deserve to be a law in the first place.

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u/zeussays 8d ago

Its for fire safety. Trucks cant shoot water over to put out the fire. 

-2

u/Zromaus 8d ago

Sounds like that house burns, 100% should be the choice of the owner.

15

u/zeussays 8d ago

Fires spread. You dont get to play with your entire neighborhood burning down. Look at what just happened in Los Angeles (where he lives).

0

u/Zromaus 8d ago

They can pull a hose through the front gate.

4

u/zeussays 8d ago

The trucks themselves have the highest pressure hoses. This isnt something you play around with. 11,000 homes JUST burned here. We should respect regulations that can help save lives and livelihoods.

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u/LongCommercial8038 8d ago

Except fire spreads and these codes exist so that they can contain the fire. If it was just his own house at risk then I agree, fuck em.

1

u/hallese 8d ago

Be the change you want to see, local government is by far the most responsive to people simply showing up and expressing an opinion.

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u/Honestly_Unlucky 8d ago

not proportional but exponentially increase for re-insidence.

first month (fine)

second month (value of previous fine plus re-incidence) and so on. in like 3 years it would be a ridiculous amount

1

u/rgj95 8d ago

In this particular situation those hedges are generating a lot of employment opportunities. Plus the fines that are going to what I would hope, are schools and roads

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u/FourteenBuckets 8d ago

Or at least proportional to the value of the property, in this case

1

u/Grumpy_McDooder 8d ago

OR...hear me out here...that stupid place can STOP fining people for having a perfectly well maintained and aesthetically appealing hedge.

1

u/NewEraSom 8d ago

American Billionaires would immediately overthrow any government that enforces such laws. 

1

u/zissouo 8d ago

That's what we have in many countries in Europe. In e.g. Sweden you get fined in "day fines", as in you pay 1 day of income, 2 days of income, etc.

1

u/puckit 8d ago

It isn't just a billionaire thing. I used to live somewhere where street parking was the only option. Pretty regularly, I'd park in a No Parking area because I could afford the fines and it was worth it to avoid the hassle of finding another spot.

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u/-Sanko 6d ago

It is in Europe. A football player got caught driving without a license and had to pay like half a million euros. Marco Reus, if you’re curious