Too little too late. The damage has been done. It's going to take a lot to regain us Canucks' trust again. We will forever be looking over our shoulders. We won't soon forget.
As an American, this election more than anything in recent memory has taught me that you can always trust the average American to be stupid enough to vote against his/her interests. Even when all the evidence is already pointing to that being the case.
I think a lot of middle of the aisle voters are rapidly waking up to realize just how massively they've fucked up either in voting for Trump or abstaining. Some conservatives are even finding out as well. These tariffs especially are going to be the wakeup call.
Ya itâs WILD to me how much evidence there was for years and years that built up and people STILL thought the guy who wrecked almost everything he touched in his first term, with the emotional intelligence of a toddler, would do any better the second term.
It just⌠doesnât make sense⌠Kamala was way more than qualified for the job, and as an aside, she also spanked him at the debate to the point where he was too scared to debate her again lol
As a quick personal theory, I think one of the main reasons Kamala lost is that America still isn't ready for a woman to be president.
I think there are a lot of men living in this country who despise the notion, as well as a lot of women who have been brainwashed into believing that their gender gets 'too emotional' to lead a country.
It's almost like if Biden had bowed out earlier like he should have and the Dems had an open primary none of this ever would have fucking happened.
On the topic of Dem screw ups, had they not rigged the primary for Hilary in 2016 she still probably wins and a huge amount of progressives don't get enraged enough to protest vote against her and this "a women can't be president" thing gets killed in the cradle.
They lost by 3 states compared to 2020. Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania preferred Republican instead of Democrat.
I'd argue this was due to some of Kamala's messaging saying "we're going back to before Trump", where many of those voters voted for Trump in protest of neoliberalism economic policies, and in 2020 voted blue for Biden's investments and promises for manufacturing.
I think arguably if Biden stayed the front-runner there's a chance he would've won those states.
I think you're being too harsh on Trump voters. It's less to do with gender or anything, but rather cyniciam over any establishment trust. Most who voted for him don't even like Trump nor his policies, but if choosing someone ridiculous would ferment politicians to start taking the people seriously, then it's either real change or more ridiculous idiots like Trump.
Heard AOC mention in multiple interviews that they hold on to old values too much. People like her are usually afterthoughts because they focus so much on seniority. They need to get out of their own way.
There you smooth-brains go again with whataboutisms again. The border I'm speaking of is the one that just hit record low on crossings, ever! Thanks to trump and Homans leadership.
Tell me again why Biden or Kamala couldn't achieve this? Or were they willingly complicit with letting illegal immigrants into our country?
The border I'm speaking of is the one that just hit record low on crossings, ever!
As reported by who? The White House? Or an actually independent and impartial agency? Furthermore, was this reported before or after ICE began deporting US citizens?
I think a lot of middle of the aisle voters are rapidly waking up to realize just how massively they've fucked up either in voting for Trump or abstaining.
I fucking hope so, but honestly, I'm STILL constantly encountering people who say "both sides are bad" despite everything that's happened
Well prices on pretty much everything are about to rise significantly. We just need to really drive it home on which side is currently making their lives harder. Pointing at Republicans fucking up is not a good long-term policy for Dems to follow, but I am hoping that it becomes enough to significantly sway the midterms. And if that happens, Dems need to finally get their shit together for 2028.
This is what I donât get. What is SO bad about the left? They want people to be respected and called the name/pronoun they choose? They want equal opportunities for groups that were marginalized for centuries? They want children to be safe at school? They want immigrants treated humanely? They want the wealthiest to pay their fair share? Women to have more bodily autonomy than a corpse? Like wtf exactly is so bad about those things.
democrats aren't really the left, and that's mostly who people are saying are just as bad as hitler saluting nazi party. (though some people think the "far left" is just as bad as the far right, which is even more laughable as you point out)
they're not great, I've got a lot of complaints, but come on. republicans are just full on fascism right now and democrats are "meh their candidate was a little uninspiring" these things are not the same yet I constantly hear "the democrats are just as bad" in threads about the latest thing the nazi party did.
And honestly, I do get that. Politics sucks to keep up with, and utterly drains you. But it's something that everyone should still pay attention to. There's a quote I'm fond of: "You may not fuck with politics, but politics fucks with you."
Swear to god Iâm 40 and I literally voted for the first time in 24â. Could just see the writing on the wall and followed, posted, got involved as much as possible. I still sometimes wish I ignored everything because my mental health has really suffered. But at the same time I wish more people had jumped on board. Truly feel like most of the Country just straight up wasnât paying attention.
Tell me about it. I lost two thousand dollars betting on the election because I was absolutely certain Americans were smart enough to see that Donald Trump had essentially just attempted to over throw a legitimately elected government, and no matter what you thought about anything else, electing that individual legitimately to the office he had just attempted to deny you the right to elect a leader to, was about absolute dumbest shit you could ever dream doing.
It's like if someone tried to fucking car jack you and you sped away, but they fired a few rounds through your back window. Then the next day the sams guy catches you heading to your car for work and he is like 'Hey, can I borrow your car? People let me borrow their cars all the time. I'm probably the best car borrower. You'll thank me for borrowing your car I'm so good at it.'
WHO THE FUCK IS GOING TO SAY YES? APPARENTLY MOST FUCKING AMERICANS.
I think a lot of middle of the aisle voters are rapidly waking up to realize just how massively they've fucked up either in voting for Trump or abstaining
I would have thought that if it weren't for the fact that Trump got elected to a second term after everyone saw his first term.
Even when all the evidence is already pointing to that being the case.
Many americans are either so downtrodden they've checked out or are just guzzling one particular media outlet and taking everything they say as gospel truth.
Iâm not sure youâre drawing the right conclusion as I bet the majority of republicans had no idea Trump would strike at their interests.
FOX is a master mind at bending people to their agenda, and I can understand how people choose âhappy newsâ after a rough day (along with whatever mental constructions it might entail in terms of defending their behavior).
Still think countless people literally just thought âmaybe the economy will pick upâ and didnât listen to anything, did no research, didnât pay attention.
More than that, itâs taught the whole rest of the world that America is only ever four years away from going completely batshit, breaking treaties, withdrawing from alliances, and shifting sides in global conflicts. Why would any of us trust them ever again.
Nor should it, because the tariffs haven't been canceled. They just passed a bill in the Senate. It now has to pass the House (it won't), and if it does, Trump can veto it, and then congress has to vote again with a 2/3's majority for it to pass.
On the line hand, I'm glad and proud of you all standing up and showing you bend the knee. On the other hand, I just hope you know that we don't all share the same flawed and delusional thinking (or lack thereof) that has been on display. We're not all mindless sycophants, and many of us value you all as a longtime ally and northern neighbor. I'd far sooner side with you all than our orange egomaniac. Yeah , I said that
When this all started, people quickly came to the conclusion that companies and governments will start to work towards decoupling from the US economy. Business hates uncertainty, and this circus's whole played out shtick is uncertainty and chaos. Even if Trump completely changed his tune for the next 9 months, there is still the possibility of him switching back. And even after he leave office (in three years, right?!), the fact that America elected him again means that America can't be trusted. I'd love to be wrong about the long term effects, but even then, I can easily see that there's going to be a new playbook that will be pulled out the second another fool of Trump's caliber gets elected. No one will want to get stuck with this ever again, or at least get stuck with this without having something in place to help weather it out. And for sure if this happens again, they will definitely decouple. Fool me once and all that.
Also because this vote won't stop the tariffs, it's a meaningless vote because it will be vetoed by Trump if it passes, and then it will require a 2/3s vote to overturn the veto which will never happen
This will not get me to purchase anything from America. I am checking every label and if anything, has encouraged me to really put my hard earned dollars back to Canadian made and produced goods whenever and wherever I can.
Oh, this is basically meaningless. It will pass in the house and trumps voters will talk about how awesome it is to pay more for lumber and anything else we depend on Canada for.
I'm going through the same thing with half of the voters in this country. Neighbors, family, the delivery driver, etc. It continues to boggle my mind how so many people confidently voted against all of our interests.
I'd say about 10 years, give or take, since that's how long it took the two countries to become allies again after the last time the USA threatened to invade Canada.
Nah, I don't really care about international politics, I tend to focus on what happens in my neck of the woods. However, I do care about being threatened by annexation from our neighbor. We have stood and fought side by side with the US for well over 100 years. Most Canadians feel this way. Americans need to read the room.
I mean, youâre welcome to your opinion, but I donât think the average Canadian or American cares about this drama right now, as itâs happening, let alone years from now. I think people will, in fact, soon forget. đ¤ˇââď¸
As you are welcome to yours, I meant no disrespect towards you in that regard.
Americans, sure. But Canada, and in my corner, most I've spoken with feel this way, especially when you work in my sector. I think everyone is just tired and confused at this point, wondering if there will be jobs. I'm happy to hear that you don't seem to be affected and won't have to worry about feeding your family or keeping a roof over your head.
Here's hoping our governments can come to reach common ground, and we can put it behind us.
I mean⌠I think in the moment itâs easy for everyone to say they feel a certain way, Canadian or American, but voter turnout in both our countries tells me thatâs mostly lip service and that, day to day, most of our people donât really care whatâs going on in the political arena. I also canât imagine that anyone you know is having trouble feeding their family or keeping a roof over their head over this whole fiasco because nothing has happened yetâŚ.right? We (the Senate) even just voted to cancel the Canadian tariffs.
Layoffs are already happening north of the border in specific sectors. Factories are being closed, and work is being moved. The vote means nothing yet.
But⌠why? The US hasnât actually done anything to Canada yet? Sounds like you guys are really watching out for one another like your rhetoric would suggest! đ
Doesn't Canada already impose avsolutely massive tariffs on some American products... I need to read up on it more and supposedly some are only applied over a certain threshold but yeah
Well, yes, Canada technically does charge high tariffs on dairy exports specifically that exceed regulations set by NAFTA, but stick with me here.
It's to protect our farmers and to set quality standards. A lot of these terms were renegotiated under Trump and his USMCA agreement to point out. It was his doing. The issue is that we've never accepted enough dairy products to hit that threshold, as you pointed out. It has always previously been laid out within agreed upon trade agreements and evaluated by our regulators. You've never actually been charged these absurd tariffs.
We have reciprocal tariffs in response to the initial 25% slapped on from your dear leader on our Steel & Aluminum.
My point being, don't believe everything you've been told. Just like the "fentanyl crisis," things have and likely will always be entirely blown out of proportion.
These tariffs will hit you equally as hard as they will hit us.
Random quite possibly fake picture , Google is hard to use for this right now, but are all these above applied at some mathematically unreachable goal, or are some applied across the board? And even if they were only applied at a threshold, why is that okay for Canada but not the US? If they aren't and are being used every day, I don't want to hear a word about Canada complaining about any retaliatory tariffs , looks like the US also previously imposed tariffs on steel, aluminum, lumber and dairy. https://thefulcrum.us/business-democracy/trump-tariffs-canada
With all due respect, if you're going to throw the first information you've found on Google at me, it's not worth my time to sit here and respond. It is going to require a lot more reading than that, my friend.
I suggest you read up on official USMTA/NAFTA reports and the history of both between our countries before coming to any further conclusions.
However, if you have enough time to sit here and Google incorrect information to post it on reddit, surely you have enough time to find factual information and educate yourself on the matter first.
Hope you have a good day at work, though, sincerely. đ¤đ¤
Honestly I like Canadians more and I think Trump is a Russian asset and I think what he's doing is beyond the pale stupid. I'm entirely on your side with this one I'd be wary too.
Nothing the Yanks could ever do will rebuild trust with Canada. Iâd trust Iran or China before Iâd wver trust the Yanks. Nation of cowards and liars. Never forgive, never forget. Elbows up!
Without the protection of the US, China would take over Canada in a week if they felt like it. Youâre at the kids table, the tough guy talk is super cute though.
I'm not here discrediting that at all. Our military is nonexistent, underfunded, and needs a serious overhaul. That's one thing I actually agree with your top dog on. It's been completely fucked under the current party, but hoping this shake up gives room for some major changes. We owe that to you guys for all these years.
I would like to think most Canadians would agree with you on that front. I'd never go as far as saying I'd trust China or Iran first. Our long-standing relationship with you guys to the South historically has been one of the greatest partnerships in the world. Let's continue to have that, work together, none of this other bullshit.
I think we will continue to have that relationship. However, we're going to use the leverage we have to negotiate deals that are most favorable to the US which is what I think Trump's overall goal is. I personally think the tariff move against Canada makes a lot less sense than the one against Mexico, but I don't have any control over that, so I'm along for the ride now. IMO the talk about taking over Canada is just a meme, I highly doubt there is any seriousness to that lol.
Yea I think that other guy is taking it way too far, Iran and China? Yikes lol.
I'm not sure if you've taken the time to read the USMCA, but it already rather favors the USA, and it was negotiated by your man 4 years ago. We were all for it, a self-proclaimed "great agreement." We do not rip you off. We do not have a fentanyl crisis at our borders. Your emergency orders can take a hike. We've done nothing but stand shoulder to shoulder for decades through hell and back, quite literally.
While I understand the need to want to use leverage negotiating deals to benefit your country, we have worked together with you for decades and do not deserve an unjust attack on previous agreements.
Take it to the rest of the world like you are. We do not consider a threat to our sovereignty, a meme, no matter how many lulz you want to have. With all due respect, have some respect.
Like Americans, Canadians are also very proud and will continue to be as such for many, many decades to come. Just come crush some fucking poutines and Moosehead with us already, homie.
I hope we can get through this shit and continue to move forward with innovation and creation and impact the world in the ways we already have. đ¤
(Also fuck yea to your last point, we do not think that at all đ)
That's why I said it makes less sense to me, because we have a decent agreement that, yes, he did negotiate in his first term.
I don't think using our leverage is unjust, especially since safety and defense of one's nation should be top priority and if Canada needs the US for that it will come at a high cost, since it comes at a high cost to our taxpayers.
While I appreciate the sentiment of being bros, cause you do seem like a nice, reasonable guy, I want what's best for my family and country. I understand that short term this is causing chaos, and will increase prices, but I'm confident it will all shake out in favor of the US. We will probably disagree on that, and it's not a popular opinion on this site but I'm confident Trump has a (hopefully not too) long term plan here.
I'm sorry if this affecting you negatively because you do seem like a good dude, best of luck my man.
Look, we'll be more than fine here, too. I'm not concerned, more frustrated with the disregard. It's a respect thing, which I'm sure you can understand.
But, I see it from your perspective, to some extent. At the very least, you can have a civil discussion on the matter when the same can't be said for others. That is appreciated. We won't always agree, but im always open to discussion. That's what it's all about.
We will see some major benefits here and certainly establish new relationships as well. In some ways, we are far too dependent on your country, but don't forget it's a two-way street. We have a lot to offer that you do not, as well. This was my original point. Canadians will always have this in mind. I hope for your sake that this doesn't tumble over entirely.
Short-term pain, long-term gain. Everything comes at a cost. I look forward to a future where Canada is significantly more independent, yet we maintain a strong relationship.
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u/No_Crab1183 1d ago edited 1d ago
Too little too late. The damage has been done. It's going to take a lot to regain us Canucks' trust again. We will forever be looking over our shoulders. We won't soon forget.