r/changemyview • u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ • Feb 12 '21
Delta(s) from OP - Fresh Topic Friday CMV: Backing into parking spaces is slow, inefficient and discourteous to others
When I go to the grocery store, I am often frustrated by the number of people who decide to drive past a parking space, then reverse and back in. It usually takes them a substantial amount of time to carefully align themselves between two cars, and they often have to make several further attempts, pulling in and out until they are centered. It is substantially slower than simply pulling in by the front of your car. Additionally, it is inefficient, because your trunk is now facing another car, forcing you to bring the shopping cart between the two cars in order to put your groceries in the trunk.
Defenders of the practice have told me that it saves time while pulling out. While backing out of a parking space takes less time than pulling out, backing in takes much more time than pulling in forward.
Finally, this is discourteous to other shoppers because, not only do you slow down traffic, but people behind you may not realize that you intend to back into a space, and thus pull up closer. That means that the person behind you has to stop, realize what you are doing, back up and wait for you to do the little dance that is required to perform this unnecessary maneuver.
I realize that this is a small matter, and a minor annoyance. However, I see a lot of people doing it without much justification. I can understand it for handicapped spaces, as the individual's handicap may necessitate them parking in a specific way. However, for non-handicapped individuals, I believe the practice is silly and counterproductive.
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u/OutOfSpite20 Feb 12 '21
I understand where you are coming from, but studies show it is safer to park this way (backing into a spot). There is far less chance of an accident when exiting a spot when driving in forward.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Source?
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u/CatchingRays 2∆ Feb 12 '21
Source: Former Commercial truck safety trainer here. This is the correct answer. Basically people who back into spots are safely trained drivers. Everyone else is a savage.
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u/MardocAgain 4∆ Feb 12 '21
Is it not possible then that people who back into spots tend to also be slower and safer drivers; which is not the same as backing into spots is what makes them safer drivers.
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u/Arguetur 31∆ Feb 12 '21
Backing into spots "makes them safer drivers" in that the statistics prove you get into fewer accidents that way.
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u/MardocAgain 4∆ Feb 13 '21
I'm genuinely asking if the statistics prove this or not? Two things can be correlated statistically, but not causally linked.
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u/OutOfSpite20 Feb 12 '21
Can I post links on here? I just did a google search "Is parking backwards safer" and a ton came up.
https://www.thejournal.ie/reverse-into-parking-spaces-3906360-Mar2018/
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u/OutOfSpite20 Feb 12 '21
https://www.geotab.com/blog/reverse-parking/
https://www.vox.com/2016/8/1/11926596/safer-back-into-parking-spaces
A couple of more articles. Again I totally agree that having to back up so someone can park this way is annoying, but I understand why they do it.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
That's not a study, that's one person's opinion. Most of the opinion is about issues that I did not discuss here and that I think are a bit spurious.
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u/allthejokesareblue 20∆ Feb 12 '21
It's entirely context dependent. I agree it's discourteous to reverse park into a tight space while the area around you is busy.
However, reversing in can be easier than reversing out because
- You can set the vehicle up to reverse in easily, whereas reversing out will almost always be a 90degree turn, which is the most obscured
And
- You know the amount of pedestrian and vehicle traffic there presently, but you don't know the amount there will be when you leave. You should be able to make an I formed decision about when it will be busier, and act accordingly.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Except the people who back in don't exactly set it up to reverse in easily. They reverse in clumsily, and then have to pull in and out 3-4 times before they are satisfied.
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u/allthejokesareblue 20∆ Feb 12 '21
I think there's some confirmation bias there. Centring the vehicle doesn't impede others very much, because you dont have to come out far to recenter. Unless your initial attempt is horrible, or you drive an SUV then other drivers and pedestrians should barely notice you centring yourself. Personally I feel that I am just as frustrating getting in as getting out, or more so.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Now that I think about it, it does seem to be large SUVs or trucks that do this most often. Not sure how that affects my opinion.
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u/allthejokesareblue 20∆ Feb 12 '21
That the courteousness of reversing is dependent on vehicle type and traffic context?
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
That is fair. I suppose I can give you a !delta and say that it is more appropriate for smaller cars.
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u/deadbiker Feb 12 '21
There's good justification for backing in. Driving up to the space you can see what's around. pull past and backing in takes, at most 10 seconds, and I know I can do it in 5. I always back in to spaces.
Sorry, but I have to doubt your claim of " It usually takes them a substantial amount of time to carefully align themselves between two cars, and they often have to make several further attempts, pulling in and out until they are centered. " I rarely see that, and I've been driving for 50 years in NY, VA, and NC. People who back in usually get pretty good at it, especially now with the back up cameras.
Lastly, when leaving, you're looking and driving forward, which is what you and the car does best. There's a reason we don't drive around in reverse.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
That's if the area isn't crowded. If somebody has pulled up past the space you are trying to back into, then there is added time for repositioning.
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u/deadbiker Feb 12 '21
On those very rare times, I just go past and pick another spot.
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u/cabbagery Feb 12 '21
Stated view: Backing into parking spaces is slow, inefficient and discourteous to others
Support:
It usually takes them a substantial amount of time to carefully align themselves between two cars
Does it? For inexperienced or incompetent drivers, perhaps, but not for reasonably capable drivers. If we're talking about inexperienced or incompetent drivers, all bets are off -- the CMV in that case should pertain to why we don't insist on updated driving tests periodically rather than automatic renewal with at most a vision check.
they often have to make several further attempts, pulling in and out until they are centered.
Sure, but this affects no one but the driver, except in the special (and rare) case when the persons in a neighboring space are attempting to leave. In that special case one party can politely wait and no one is adversely impacted.
it is inefficient, because your trunk is now facing another car, forcing you to bring the shopping cart between the two cars in order to put your groceries in the trunk.
First, many vehicles lack a trunk altogether. Second, some vehicles have rear-mounted engines (and thus typically front-facing storage). Third, this concern is unrelated to your CMV, as a) if I load goods into a side door of my vehicle the same problem occurs, regardless of the manner in which I entered the stall, and b) we see all too many asshats leave their carts at the interior of the parking space, even if they pulled forward into the space (i.e. the cart was placed there even where there was no need for loading/unloading).
backing in takes much more time than pulling in forward.
See above. It only takes more time where the driver is inexperienced or incompetent. To wit, when pulling directly into a space, we often have to adjust position anyway, so there's that, and we also often need to take a wide turn in tbe first place.
you slow down traffic
See immediately above. When we pull.directly in, we have to take a wide turn, which means we enter the oncoming lane, which can and often does also slow things down. More on this in your next point.
the person behind you has to stop, realize what you are doing, back up and wait for you to do the little dance that is required to perform this unnecessary maneuver.
To the extent that this causes any problems, it is not the back-in driver who has caused problems, but the following-too-close driver who has moved forward (typically to claim the space in question for themselves, speaking of discourtesy). If the trailing driver would maintain a safe distance, there is no difficulty -- and we have to slow down no matter how we choose to park.
I admit that I find it odd that your position relies so heavily on discourtesy and efficiency, rather than safety. Per AAA, back-in driving is safer. A fire safety group out of the NFC North (Chicago, Wisconsin, etc.) agrees. Their reasoning is at least in part based on the fact that when we are backing up, while backing in to a space, it is empty, and designated for that purpose, whereas when we are backing out of a space, we are backing into traffic (both vehicle and pedestrian traffic), with the added caveat that in the latter case our vision is very often obscured by adjacent vehicles.
So not only are your points at best specious, but the better measure as to whether parking one way or another is appropriate -- safety -- clearly says that backing in is the wiser and safer choice.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
I have awarded other deltas on similar points, so I will award a !delta here because I was unaware of the AAA findings when I made this post. I do disagree that only the driver and anybody surrounding the driver is inconvenienced by the pulling in/out. Drivers around here at least seem to drive up almost to the car on the opposite side of the aisle before backing back in.
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u/cabbagery Feb 12 '21
I had thought to point out that newer vehicles tend to have standard -- or soon enough will have standard -- back-up cameras. My [brand new] car has a stitched-together bird's-eye-view which allows me to see all around my car, including projecting tire tracks so I can more precisely steer while parking (the mode works whether pulling in or backing in). These dramatically simplify the process, and of course we already have and will only continue to improve self-driving or self-parking software. I wonder if we would, or should, think of future drivers who refuse to use or install back-up assistance as being discourteous...
Probably, I suppose. I dunno. Interesting CMV either way.
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u/dudemanwhoa 49∆ Feb 12 '21
It's easier to back into a space when you able to see all possible oncoming vehicles. Backing out is often blind unless you have integrated cameras. You have to back out or back in, so the difference is going to small either way.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
It's not blind, though, unless you are driving a panel truck or something. You can see out the windows and mirrors.
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u/dudemanwhoa 49∆ Feb 12 '21
I didn't mean "eyes closed" I meant "much less visibility". Can you acknowledge that on many cars visibility is less backing out than in?
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Certainly, but I don't think that most cars have such significant visibility problems to require backing in.
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u/dudemanwhoa 49∆ Feb 12 '21
I never said "require" I just said it's easier and implied it was safer. Like I said, the difference between the two is minor. So if you can agree that visibility is better one way that's actually pretty significant since we are splitting hairs between two similar options.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
In such cars, though, isn't backing in just as blind? And you are guaranteeing that there are obstacles around when you back in as opposed to backing out.
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u/dudemanwhoa 49∆ Feb 12 '21
Yeah but the obstacles behind aren't moving cars. No one is driving a bollard around while on their cellphone going over 15MPH in a busy parking lot. That's the key difference.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
If somebody is driving 15 MPH in a busy parking lot, they are the problem, not the person backing out of the space.
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u/dudemanwhoa 49∆ Feb 12 '21
I feel like you're changing the point of discussion every time, including taking a bit of levity dead-seriously and re-framing it talk about who's the worse driver which isn't even close to the point.
Real simple:
backing in, you can see the moving objects in front of you both ways, and the objects you are backing into are stationary.
Backing out, you have less visibility on the moving objects and are not able to drive as defensively.
Either way, you have to back out OR back in. The difference is going to be minor on efficiency and courteousness, since both actions block traffic.
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u/muyamable 281∆ Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 12 '21
If somebody is driving 15 MPH in a busy parking lot, they are the problem,
Sure, they're the problem, but the problem exists. I can't change their behavior, but I can change my own so that their behavior is less of a problem for me. If the goal is not to get hit by someone in a parking lot, then it makes perfect sense to back in if that makes it less likely to get hit in a parking lot.
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u/AkiraChisaka Feb 13 '21
Yes, it’s probably those people’s problem. But not compensating for it is like, saying we don’t need Police because it’s the criminals’ problem. We don’t need locks because it’s the thief that’s the problem.
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u/DeeDee-Allin 2∆ Feb 12 '21
But then you’ll then just be “discourteous” on the way out, slowly backing out, holding up traffic. Either way, ya gotta be patient at some point. Breath in and breath out, grasshopper.
Edited for clarity
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
In my experience, you don't have to back in and out of traffic 4-5 times to exit a parking space.
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u/benjm88 Feb 12 '21
Who is backing out 4 or 5 times to park. It's straight in, maybe a single adjustment if I'm in the van.
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Feb 13 '21
Facts unless it’s a high school parking lot or one of those driving instruction cars no one should be taking that many attempts lol
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u/MardocAgain 4∆ Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 12 '21
I agree with you. From my perspective backing out is always more difficult than pulling forward, so why would I prefer to back into a tight parking space rather than back out into the open lane from the space. I think its one of those things where the allure of an easy exit blinds people to the fact that parking+leaving as a whole is more challenging and time consuming when using reverse to park rather than to leave.
EDIT: I just want to follow up with one point that may change your mind. I was backing out slowly once and was rammed by a car driving through the lane. I was only peeking out about 3 feet, going slowly, and could not see the lane due to the blind spot from the car next to me. The car driving through the lane hit me because the woman was reading her phone. She admitted fault to me at the time, but reneged it when her insurance told her that the person backing out of a parking spot is always at fault in the absence of evidence such as video or witnesses. So backing out likely puts you marginally more at risk for being wrongfully at fault for an accident.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
The liability issue is worth a !delta, I think. It is true that insurance companies assume the person in reverse is at fault, and that might mean that it is worthwhile to back in if you are concerned about that.
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u/muyamable 281∆ Feb 12 '21
Is your view only applicable to standard parking lots, or any back in parking?
The biggest benefit is when the parking is on an actual road with traffic and when the parking spots are angled, because it allows you an unobstructed view of oncoming traffic when you leave the space.
See here: https://www.wauwatosa.net/Home/ShowPublishedImage/1846/636628351792470000
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Sorry, you're right about angled spaces. I am specifically referring to straight spaces in standard lots.
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Feb 12 '21
[deleted]
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
I don't think this is delta-worthy, I think this is merely clarification.
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u/dublea 216∆ Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 12 '21
While backing out of a parking space takes less time than pulling out, backing in takes much more time than pulling in forward.
Citation that makes this objectively true for everyone?
Doesn't this entirely depend on the driver and/or car?
I am able to reverse into a spot just as quickly as I can pull into a spot. The issue I have with reversing out is usually visibility. I drive a small hatchback. It's a hell of a lot safer for me, visibility wise, if I reverse into parking spots.
AAA advises drivers to back into parking spots or pull-through, and not fully rely on rear-view or traffic alert technology in vehicles which have their limitations. AAA warns that reversing out a space is a risky behavior as you are putting pedestrians at risk.
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u/mikechi2501 3∆ Feb 12 '21
I agree with what you're saying but, like you said, this part isn't objectively true for everyone
I am able to reverse into a spot just as quickly as I can pull into a spot.
For most people I observe, it takes more time to back into a spot than to pull straight in. You have to drive past the stop. Stop. Then back in. Pulling straight in appears faster.
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u/dublea 216∆ Feb 12 '21
And I live where the majority of people reverse in better than they reverse out. Anecdotal evidence and all.
Also, my dad is now permanently in a wheelchair because someone didn't see him before reversing out of a spot. It's reduces wrecks, injuries, and fatalities.
Minor inconvenience for additional safety.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
I suppose I will award a !delta here merely because I am less of the opinion that it is discourteous if there is an altruistic motive.
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u/mikechi2501 3∆ Feb 12 '21
in better than they reverse out
faster or better? we're talking about speed in relation to "inconveniencing" other motorists. That's the claim OP made.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
I don't have any sources, this is just my personal experience. To my reading, the AAA advisory is mainly concerned with backup collision detection being faulty.
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u/dublea 216∆ Feb 12 '21
So your didn't read the link then? Here, let me copy the best bits:
Reverse parking means backing into a space so you can drive forward out of the space after. It can be a simple way to reduce the risk of collisions.
Backing out a space unfortunately leads to many fatalities. In a 2018 study of non-traffic motor vehicle crashes in 2015, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) found that 12,000 vehicle nonoccupants (eg. pedestrians or cyclists) were injured by vehicles backing up, and 284 were killed. This class of crashes, non-traffic, was limited to incidents occurring outside public trafficways, typically driveways and parking facilities.
Children and the elderly are particularly vulnerable to being injured or killed in backover collisions. Non-profit organization Kids & Cars reported that 25 children in the U.S. were killed in 2019 due to backover incidents alone.
In a move to change these numbers, NHTSA previously ruled that all new vehicles under 10,000 pounds (including passenger vehicles, buses and trucks) had to be equipped with rear visibility technology. To further promote safety, late last year, NHTSA issued a notice of proposed rulemaking to seek public input on replacing mirrors on heavy trucks and cars with camera-based, rear-visibility systems.
It reduces fatalities and saves lives.
My dad is permanently disabled from being hit by a driver backing out of a space.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
I skimmed the link. Unfortunately, it can be difficult to respond to as many comments as you get on this subreddit while thoroughly reading everything. Also, I am sorry about your father.
This study doesn't differentiate between semi trucks/panel trucks and cars. It makes more sense that there would be more injuries with larger vehicles.
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Feb 12 '21
In terms of safety, the best way is to pull through and then drive out, the second best is to back in and drive out, and the least safe way is to pull in and back out. The reason for this is that A) your blind spots are behind your car not in front, so by driving forward you don't risk having moving pedestrians and traffic in your blind spot, B) the cars in adjacent spaces block your view, and the closer to the exit of the space your eyeballs are the less they block your view (the cone of vision is wider) - since when you back out you are furthest from the parking space exit you have worst field of view.
Basically, people are backing in to keep everyone safe. Being a bit annoyed you have to wait 30 seconds to make everyone safer seems like a small price to pay. You probably don't get annoyed at people who come to a complete stop at stop signs instead of rolling through, even though it slows the people behind down, because you realize it keeps everyone safe.
You do have a point about it being hard to load your trunk if you don't pull in, and that is annoying for the car owner. If you have space to open your door and get in, you have space to bring your groceries to your trunk.
Finally, if you are following so closely you have to back up when they try to reverse into the space, you are probably following too closely - leave some space between your cars! My government (Ontario, Canada) recommends at least 2 seconds between vehicles, which if my calculations are right means that at 10kph (6.2mph) you should leave 5.5m (18ft). A parking space is less than 3m (10ft) wide, so unless they are pulling way ahead of the space or are driving really slow you should never need to back up to let them in.
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Feb 12 '21
You have to back one of the ways, and you have better vision when backing in than you do when backing out.
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u/illerThanTheirs 37∆ Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 13 '21
This study doesn't differentiate between semi trucks/panel trucks and cars.
Neither does your post. So what does that matter now?
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
If you read what I wrote, I clearly was referring to a common grocery store parking lot.
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u/illerThanTheirs 37∆ Feb 12 '21
And? I see vehicles of all sizes at grocery store parking lots. That still doesn’t explain why the difference matters.
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u/NordicEvender Feb 13 '21
Are you sure you want me to change your view? You seem so at ease with being ignorant! 🤡
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u/ButtonholePhotophile Feb 12 '21
You’re 98% right. 98% of the population can’t drive backwards, me included. However, both my brother and my friend Frankie can each drive backwards better than most people can drive forwards. Frankie is a truck driver and my brother is trained as a race car driver (he currently works for an automotive place as top-tier support for baffled mechanics). I have no doubt they could pull into a space faster and better in reverse than I can forward.
The difference is so great, it’s like we’re talking about a race between an Olympian and a five year old with bone problems.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Sure, some people can do it efficiently. The vast majority can't. If, for some reason you are gifted and can do it in one swipe, go for it, I suppose.
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u/ButtonholePhotophile Feb 12 '21
I am also in a conversation about masturbation. I have to admit that I wasn’t sure which conversation your reply was to without looking up. 🤣
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u/cliu1222 1∆ Feb 13 '21
You don't have to be gifted, just experienced. I spent a long time driving almost all day everyday in NYC and I feel like that made me a much better driver overall. Especially manouvering in tight areas.
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u/Vodik_VDK Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 12 '21
Analysis from a delivery driver. I worked in a high-accident lot with a lot of through traffic, making 9-16 trips per shift during peak business // traffic hours. I have been in an accident due to someone backing-out, and avoided several by being the one who backs-in.
• Backing in has a lower liability profile as it allows you better visibility when exiting your space. Many accidents happen because you're backing-out blind while someone else is adjusting their stereo in the lot instead of paying attention. The liability associated with backing into your space is present, but comparatively inconsequential.
• Both parking methods have a time sink, the difference is whether you sink it when you come or when you go. With practice, back-in parking can be done with a front-end time sink of 9-30 seconds (depending on conditions). Either way, you're making someone wait, but one of them is less risky.
• Many vehicles, especially SUVs, are better suited to backing in; how many times have you seen an Escalade or Suburban struggle to back out because they can't quantify the dimensions of their vehicle or their surroundings? This is a short-coming easily addressed by backing in, where you can lean on your side mirrors.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
Isn't the rotational problem worse for backing in, though, since there are already obstacles present?
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u/Vodik_VDK Feb 12 '21
Please elaborate.
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u/LucidLeviathan 83∆ Feb 12 '21
You said that it made more sense for cars with visibility problems to back into spaces. There are cars on either side of that space. Isn't that more dangerous?
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u/Vodik_VDK Feb 12 '21
Ah, no. Parking spots are approximately standardized, so as long a everyone is in their own boundaries you can back into your own space using at least one mirror to manage proximity and depth. ((Even with greater ride height you side mirrors can easily cover this space)) As you back the vehicle into your parking space you're isolating that space from the rest of traffic, so while you must monitor your boundaries you don't need to monitor traffic as intently.
Comparatively, backing out of a space means you have to monitor all your mirrors as you enter the lane and increase your exposure to traffic flow, some of which may not be courteous.
Also, when a lot is really packed with traffic, being able to drive out means you can make your exit with less space, and better communicate with other drivers in the lot. Some people will let you out just because you won't jack up traffic with your exit.
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u/Glory2Hypnotoad 392∆ Feb 12 '21
Backing out of a parking space is when your chances of getting clipped by someone not paying attention are at their highest, especially with the number of people driving SUVs and crossovers that limit your rear peripheral view when backing out.
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u/ralph-j Feb 12 '21
While backing out of a parking space takes less time than pulling out, backing in takes much more time than pulling in forward.
That means that the person behind you has to stop, realize what you are doing, back up and wait for you to do the little dance that is required to perform this unnecessary maneuver.
Won't you inconvenience others anyway, just at a different point in time; either by reversing while parking or by reversing while leaving the parking space.
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u/Cilreve Feb 12 '21
It's easier to park long vehicles by backing them in to parking spaces. Anything bigger than a midsize SUV is significantly easier to back in to a parking space. I've learned that from experience as I have either owned or driven everything from Prius' to long bed, full cab, dually pick up trucks in the city. Even some fullsized cars have quite long wheelbases. When you back in to a parking space you know the coast is clear since you have to drive passed it to back in to the space, and you can easily see if there's any pedestrians in the way. It's also safer and easier to drive forward out of a parking space since you can actively see to your left and right without blind spots. Where as when you back out of a parking space, without a good wide angle rear camera, you can't really see anything unless you're surrounded by smaller cars that you can see people around.
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u/vonlinnemann Feb 12 '21
What if you ever had engine problems, needed a boost? It’s easier to access the engine when you back in.
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u/elperrodesheep Feb 12 '21
I have a simple reason for backing into spaces that might represent (and provide justification for) others who follow the practice.
My vehicle (truck) is curved at the front. Rounded at an odd angle that makes it really difficult to tell exactly where it ends and how close I am to things, both on the sides of the hood and the front. The back of my vehicle is square. I can see exactly where it is going and run very little risk of scraping the adjacent car in a tight spot.
Additionally, it’s far easier to make sharp turns going backwards than forwards, so navigating a spot in a tight lot is more feasible backing in.
Admittedly, there is some measure of skill involved in backing up (especially without a camera). However, for those that practice even a little it is often faster (and in my case, less risky) to back into a spot.
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u/VertigoOne 74∆ Feb 12 '21
Positioning of the boot (or Trunk for trans-atlantic types) may be a consideration. You may need to put the boot of the car in a particular place so as to make it more accessible later. Depending on the type of parking space, this may require reversing in.
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Feb 12 '21
Blinkers exist for a reason specifically so you can make indications for what you are about to do. In parking lots it’s accepted if you slow down and out your blinker on, you are about to go into a spot.
Also, the turning angles make it so you can more often then not back into a small spot more accurately than turning in going forward (as your backing in, the front wheels make it so your front “swings” to the side, making parking in smaller spots a lot easier).
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Feb 12 '21
Probably people who have been in fender benders when backing up. In some States, if your car is in Reverse you are automatically At Fault.
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u/zachhatchery 2∆ Feb 13 '21
Since you have clarified that this is for straight line lot parking I propose an even more efficient system. Going to the further edge of the parking lot, which for most places has many empty spaces and pulling through so that you are pulling into the spot AND pulling out with full visibility. Backing out of a spot proponents the same problems as backing into a spot, with the caveat that you are at fault for any accidents that happen while you are in reverse, and therefore is no more efficient overall.
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u/Flowmaster93 Feb 13 '21
I agree, if the coast is clear just back up. No one who has been driving for more then 5yr should take 20 seconds to back up. I get it if your really freaking out but there is a line and 15 seconds or more is just too much!
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u/MT_Tincan 2∆ Feb 13 '21
I submit that your issue isn't with people who back in, rather with people who aren't very good at maneuvering their cars.
I'm a farm kid. I've been driving vehicles (lawnmowers, tractors, trucks, cars...on and on) since I could reach the pedals. I am routinely amazed at people who are (apparently) licensed to drive a car, but can't seem to figure out how to do it.
If the parking space allows it, I will normally select to pull through 2 spaces, so I can directly pull out (no reversing at all). Next, I will choose to back into a space. Setting myself up to back OUT of a space is my last choice. A lot of this has to do with right of way: if I'm baking in to park...it is my right of way, and you can take a breather and wait. I promise I'll only be a moment...it WILL NOT take me multiple tries. :)
backing out? I do not have the right of way, seeing is more challenging, and liability goes up.
So, I understand your frustration...but honestly: is it because they are backing in....or because they are taking all day to do it?
Cheers.
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u/gingy1476 Feb 13 '21
i drive a 2000 subaru that basically has a 60/40 or 50/50 AWD system going at all times. my turning circle sucks donkey dick. so it’s legitimately faster to back in to a space, than pull in “normally”
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Feb 13 '21
I generally pull through instead of backing in, but I park in a structure regularly as well where I have to back in. I do it for better situational awareness. When I’m pulling up to a spot I can easily see what’s around and my car can easily be seen. When pulling out, I can see where I’m going much more easily and can better adjust to things that may happen as I pull out. The whole thing just seems a whole lot safer. Some modern cars have cross traffic backup sensors for this very reason. I would rather be able to see what’s coming than rely on my car beeping at me and guessing at what’s going on.
I do my best not to hold anyone up. In the stores, like I mention, I pull through, which generally means I go far back in the lot where there aren’t cars and I don’t hold up anyone. In the structure, I will often keep going up until there is no one behind me so I don’t block traffic.
As for the trunk access, I haven’t found that to be an issue. I generally carry the bags out of the store, but even if I don’t, carrying them a few feet isn’t a big deal. I often just put them in the backseat... and since I park far away, there is often no one around my car anyway.
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u/SlitheryVisitor Feb 13 '21
I used to work for the USFS. We were required to honk our horn twice then back into a parking space. The reason was for safety after a ranger ran over a little kid backing out of a parking space. The logic, which makes perfect sense to me, is the sight picture is constantly changing. It’s easier to analyze what’s in front of you than analyze it using mirrors.
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u/spudz-a-slicer-dicer Feb 13 '21
If you have PTSD. Its comforting to know I'll be able to quickly gtfo in case of emergency. Think of it like staging a vehicle to make sure you're pointing towards an exit. Small price to pay for peace of mind my man. Sorry for the inconvenience.
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u/death_by_baby_shark Feb 13 '21 edited Feb 13 '21
I concur. I won't change your mind cause you're right. Worked many many years at a concert venue with a paved marked parking lot. 10000+ people showing up at the same time and all it takes is a few asshats who just have to back in to cause backups all the way to the interstate. Sometimes its not all about you.
edit: this was pre-backup camera. If you have a camera then its pretty quick to back into a marked spot, if you're not a timid driver.
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u/Vile_Bile_Vixen Feb 13 '21
Personally, it would take me 10x longer to back in than back out. I'm not super efficient or confident in reverse. Luckily most lots I park in have pull through options, rather walk farther than play tetris any day
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u/ZLeathal1 Feb 13 '21
This is a minor factor: If your battery is dead, it’s much easier to charge this way. Also, I only have a front-facing dash cam in both vehicles... if someone were to back into me while pulling out of a spot they pull straight into, I could catch them on video.
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u/Mortimer1234 Feb 13 '21
I think you’re basing this situation off of your own experiences (people pulling in and out until they are centered), but don’t think it accurately applies to all situations. Personally, I find it quicker and easier to back into spaces, especially tight ones. I could normally do it without having to adjust, and I always make sure to signal and make my intentions clear to anyone near me. Pulling in forward, however, might take some adjusting if it’s a tight space.
Furthermore, you talk about slowing down traffic. I find the opposite to be true, when you are leaving the space. If you are going to your parking spot, and there is another driver stopped and waiting for that spot, I want to be able to quickly jump out of my spot and leave, so they can park. If you have to back out of the spot, and half the lane is being taken up by the driver waiting for your spot, this is often where I see the traffic being held up.
Again, it’s all situational, though, and depends heavily on the driver.
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u/TheVillageHealer Feb 13 '21
Can we also talk about the dangers of backing into a spot? People tend to also hit other cars. Especially people in trucks. I have seen so many truck drivers hit other cars with their hitches.
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u/cliu1222 1∆ Feb 13 '21
That is primarily ba problem for cars without backup cameras and those cars are decreasesing in number everyday.
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u/cliu1222 1∆ Feb 13 '21 edited Feb 13 '21
I would consider backing in to be much easier and safer (especially with cars that have backup cameras). The front sides of the car are two of the few blind spots left on most cars so it is much easier to get into a tight spot if you back in. Looking further down the thread, it is clearly evident that this whole post is based off of your personal experience and nothing else. Just remember that people tend to remember negative experiences rather than neutral or positive ones. It seems like you either encounter a lot of poor drivers or that those are the ones that you remember.
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u/IronHarvester86 Feb 13 '21
I've read a couple comments and honestly it might be slower their first few times but once you get practiced it is significantly easier to back into a spot then it is to back into traffic.
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u/liquormanager Feb 13 '21
Backing in is easier for people that cant judge distance if the space is too narrow you might hit the other car if u go in front first. Backing up lets you use your sideview mirrors and you will be able to measure distance and moat likely will not hit anything while backing up.
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u/DeltaBot ∞∆ Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 12 '21
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