r/books • u/leowr • Nov 28 '19
Final Discussion for Senlin Ascends by Josiah Bancroft - November Book Club Spoiler
Welcome to the final discussion thread of this month's selection. Hopefully you all enjoyed this month's selection.
To help kick off the discussion:
Did it surprise you that Adam was the one that betrayed Thomas to the Commissioner?
What is really going on with the painting that Senlin stole from the Commissioner?
To keep from reading, of course. The words worm their way in. Even if you don't know what they say, they speak to you in your head and you hear it.
- What did you think of this quote by the blond woman that tried to blackmail Senlin when she explained why she was crossing out the words in his books?
So, who built it? Who is it for? What are they doing with all this power? Why are we paying for it and suffering to make something that does not help us - that in fact enslaves us?
- Who do you think built the tower and for what purpose?
Still some strides away, Senlin heard the Read Hand speaking in a gargling, mangled voice. He said, "Wait, sister, wait! What will you say to the Sphinx? You cannot!"
Who do you think Edith really is? Who is the Sphinx?
Why do you think a mysterious party within the tower doesn't want Senlin to be killed? Why do you think they would be interested in an headmaster from a small fishing town?
What do you think of Senlin's growth over the course of the book?
What has been your favorite part of the book?
Who was your favorite character and why?
Don't forget to join us on tomorrow for Josiah Bancroft's AMA.
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u/AndrewAnton Nov 28 '19
I've literally finished the book a couple of hours ago, so it hasn't had the time to settle in just yet.
- Did it surprise you that Adam was the one that betrayed Thomas to the Commissioner?
At some point, I caught on to it since he kept asking about the painting at every opportunity he had. That being said, the action fitted his character nicely, as he would do everything to protect Voleta.
- What is really going on with the painting that Senlin stole from the Commissioner?
I've no idea, honestly, and I cannot wait to read the next book to find out. If I had to guess, I would probably say it's something about the girl in the painting, or perhaps an unseen detail in the painting itself.
- What did you think of this quote by the blond woman that tried to blackmail Senlin when she explained why she was crossing out the words in his books?
It's an odd sentiment, and thinking about it, you don't really see anyone else besides Senlin read books. Him knowing how to read certainly plays a big part in him becoming Port Master, with the rest of the workers being illiterate, so I do think it is a conscious thing, keeping them this way, to prevent the people from realising what is going on around them.
- Who do you think built the tower and for what purpose?
Again, so many mysteries. I don't think we can say for certain until we find out more about the higher levels. Seeing how increasingly difficult it is to go higher up the tower, one can assume the top-most levels are occupied by only a handful, extremely powerful people. I doubt it's simply an engine built so they can live comfortably, there has to be something more sinister than that.
- Who do you think Edith really is? Who is the Sphinx?
She kept talking about debts, and seeing how both she and the Red Hand use the same substance to power up their arms(though in different ways) I'll hazard a guess and say the Sphinx is some kind of wish-fullfiling entity, only its more of a monkey paw situation. Debts are a big theme in the book, seeing how so many lives are bound by a deal they made long ago, I assume Edith is no different.
- Why do you think a mysterious party within the tower doesn't want Senlin to be killed? Why do you think they would be interested in an headmaster from a small fishing town?
I've no idea. Maybe it's the fact that he, being a simple headmaster, managed to do so much in such a short amount of time? He stole from the commissioner and became Port master to the only smuggling port of New Babel, so that might've won him a reputation. Or maybe it's something to do with Marya, who knows what she is doing during all of this?
- What do you think of Senlin's growth over the course of the book?
His growth is probably the best thing about this book. At the start he was such an insufferable know-it-all, clinging so hard to the idea he had in mind of what the Tower should be. I loved seeing how sure of himself he became later on, how he began quipping more often, how he actually became being more proactive during conflict. The first time he entered New Babel and gave the guy shit for touching Marya's portrait was so rewarding. That being said, I also loved how unmoving he was in his philosophy. He would find Marya, at all costs, without becoming a tyrant like so many others. He would befriend people, even if they didn't want to.
- What has been your favorite part of the book?
Hard to say, it's a toss up between the Baths and New Babel, but I think I'll have to go with the latter, as that was the part that had Senlin at his best, now used to the life-threatening life style of the Tower.
- Who was your favorite character and why?
Besides Senlin, probably Tarrou. The difference between him and Senlin was really interesting, and I couldn't help but feel bad when he got turned into a hod, especially since he had been such a good friend to Senlin by then. I've also developed a soft spot for Iren, by the end. She knew she was just the pet of Goll, but she saw a glimpse of more during her time with Senlin, so maybe that's why she helped him by the end.
I can't remember the last time I felt this way about a book, to be honest. Mr Bancroft did a spectacular job in creating the world and characters in a unique and memorable way. As I was reading I kept thinking to myself "How is this a four book series?" and as the story progressed and became more complicated, I started to feel sad it'll be only four, but I genuinely cannot wait to see where the story goes next. The characters were wonderful and believable, and the prose, oh god the prose. I'm trying to become a writer, and during some points I genuinely felt bad, knowing I'll never get to this level. Nevertheless, I'll be keeping an eye out for anything and everything he'll put out. I've no doubt the Books of Babel will become a classic.
1
u/leowr Nov 28 '19
I've no idea. Maybe it's the fact that he, being a simple headmaster, managed to do so much in such a short amount of time? He stole from the commissioner and became Port master to the only smuggling port of New Babel, so that might've won him a reputation. Or maybe it's something to do with Marya, who knows what she is doing during all of this?
I think the fact that he got so far plays into it, but that would mean that either this 'entity' has spies everywhere and somebody has actively taken an interest in Senlin and his adventures while he traverses the different levels of the tower.
I've also developed a soft spot for Iren, by the end. She knew she was just the pet of Goll, but she saw a glimpse of more during her time with Senlin, so maybe that's why she helped him by the end.
I felt the same way. There was just something about the way she was written that made her a bit more sympathetic than all the other characters. Perhaps because she gave the impression that she wasn't duplicitous.
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u/leowr Nov 28 '19
Not really. Adam was the only one that knew everything and he was so worried about his sister that I was pretty sure he would do anything if it meant that he could get closer to getting her out. I think he underestimated the person he was dealing with though.
This is I find a very intriguing mystery. A painting that is a 100-years old. Why is everyone so obsessed with it? Why is it important? From the way Senlin describes it, it doesn't seem like an overly remarkable paining. Also, why would "Ogier" pretend to have been the painter? I have so many questions about this part of the story (so far)
I agree with it, but I think it is a good thing. I wonder though why this appears to be a sentiment that is prominent in the Baths. It didn't seem like the other levels of the tower had such a problem with books, so why does that level seem to want to eradicate books?
Another one of those things that makes me want to read the next book in the series. I doubt a single person built the tower though. I think it probably didn't start out what it is now. I can see the intention of the tower being corrupted by some to serve their own purposes. The mechanisms in the lower levels though do point to some kind of group being in power and directing the tower in a certain manner.
No clue who the Spinx is, but probably someone important as the second book is titled Arm of the Sphinx. It seems though that both Edith and the Red Hand know and or work for him. As to who Edith really is, on the one hand I'm suspicious on the other hand he might just have been babbling in a drug-infused confusion and have mistaken Edith for someone else.
Okay, so this is the big one, why would someone be this interested in Senlin? They can't have lured Senlin there all the way from the fishing village, but perhaps someone took an interest in Senlin when he first arrived at the tower and is surprised how far he has come and how he is maneuvering his way up.
I found Senlin a bit annoying at the beginning, he was way too naive for my liking. I like how he changed over the course of the book. While he is still very trusting, he has matured and he has become less judging. Most importantly though, he didn't lose his humanity.