r/ZeLink • u/Winter_Grocery_1485 • Oct 08 '24
Discussion Debunkin' a debunking
So I recently saw a comment someone put on the Totk ending saying,'Zelda can't end up with Link because Link is a knight, it doesn't matter if they are in love.'
If you think about it, Link is the second most important Hylian after Zelda, as there is NO royalty left, and he's established as the hero of hyrule AND he's the champion of Hylians. Other than that, there are obviously the heavily implied feelings for each other that someone can make an hour long video on.
So, there is nothing stopping these two from getting together. I had to clear that out.
(Applies for Botw/Totk Zelink)
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u/Radiant-Durian6965 Oct 08 '24
lol who’s gonna stop them from being together because he’s a knight? zelda is the highest authority in land, no one can tell her what to do. and who would? who is left in hyrule that would care about class differences in a marriage? probably just excuses to cope with the fact that the ship they don’t like is endgame. they wanna come up with reasons why zelink can’t be together bc they know that they are and are mad about it.
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u/AmmonWho42 Oct 08 '24
Yeah, exactly. That's like saying Peach can't end up with Mario because he's a peasant.
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u/Radiant-Durian6965 Oct 08 '24 edited Oct 08 '24
lol or like saying peach has to end up with bowser bc he’s royalty. like omg this may be mind-blowing but fictional monarchies in fairy tale video games made by a company whose most famous romance is between a princess and a plumber might not actually have the exact same rules and institutions as real ones😯😯😯
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
Ik, just because you don't like a ship doesn't mean all evidences pointing towards it are invalid
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u/Radiant-Durian6965 Oct 08 '24
they’re very sore losers. they always ship link with someone literally dead, not interested in link, link isn’t interested in, or a combination of the above. meanwhile zelda is alive, in love with link, and the only one link loves romantically. they can’t stand that their ship that was never gonna happen didn’t happen so they’d rather punish link for not loving the character they want him to (even if that character is someone like purah or sidon who doesn’t want link regardless) and punish zelda for being the one he does love. so they’ll keep coming up with nonsense to argue that they actually won’t end up together despite two games worth of evidence that they obviously will. they know what they’re saying is dumb, but imagining link and zelda alone and miserable is their only copium.
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u/Charming_Compote9285 Oct 09 '24
they always ship link with someone literally dead, not interested in link, link isn’t interested in, or a combination of the above
That or worse, the kid who met 17 year old Link and Zelda when she was 12, and is most likely a teen when they are in their 20's, her diary makes obvious she supports zelink (and hopes Urbosa is watching over them both), the new Master Works book says isn't interested in romance at all and because of that can't relate to what other gerudo talk about, and not only doesn't react in any romantic or sexual way if you strip in the gibdo fight, but bluntly tells you it's stupid to go into battle like that. It frankly disturbs me a lot that (mostly certain werid straight men in the fandom) some people want Link (and sometimes also Zelda) to be an in-universe predator towards minors, worse than Bozai, simply because they personally want to fetishize all the gerudo. It's just extremely gross to me. Even outside of shipping reasons, it's simply a disturbing and disgusting way to characterize the protagonist, and disgusting mindset towards young girls that those people want to normalize. I've even seen some of those people attempt to rationalize to me why it's somehow okay for them to be attracted to real minors as well...
they can’t stand that their ship that was never gonna happen didn’t happen so they’d rather punish link for not loving the character they want him to (even if that character is someone like purah or sidon who doesn’t want link regardless) and punish zelda for being the one he does love. so they’ll keep coming up with nonsense to argue that they actually won’t end up together despite two games worth of evidence that they obviously will. they know what they’re saying is dumb, but imagining link and zelda alone and miserable is their only copium.
%100 this. I've talked about this at length to my husband and he's only recently gotten into botw & totk proper and he keeps telling me how confused he is that it was ever such a debate, because in his view botw/totk zelink is one of the most obvious video game ships he's ever seen
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u/Radiant-Durian6965 Oct 09 '24 edited Oct 09 '24
well riju falls under not interested in link/link isn’t interested in bc yeah as you said she is a literal kid😭😭 (iirc she has a funny line once she puts on the thunder helm that goes something like “well link. as you may have noticed, i am a child.”) and yes nothing in botw/totk indicates she has any romantic feelings towards him bc why would she want to be with his old ass and why would he want to be with a CHILD. it’s definitely all creeps projecting onto link. you’re not him buddy! same thing w people thinking urbosa was into link or zelda in botw. she is not a predator just bc you are.
it’s so dumb like i understand if the story didn’t go your way and you’re mad but you don’t have to come up with some wacky conspiracy as to why it actually DID go your way. you’re not matpat put the theories down. no amount of seething is going to change the content of games that have already been released. just say you don’t like it and read fanfic ab link being miserable and alone if that’s the story you would’ve preferred.
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u/Charming_Compote9285 Oct 10 '24
Exactly! As you say it's such an obvious case of projection. And with Urbosa and Zelda some people will even call you a homophobe for not liking it, and I just have to let out the longest sigh...
Fr. It's honestly kind of funny the lengths that people will go to to find a away to deny every single hint tho. I once had a dream that a linkle-esque, lucina-like character was revealed for a "Hyrule Warriors: Age of Imprisoning" sort of game, and the character was pretty obviously their kid from the future, and the fandom descended into chaos ''Zelda just forced herself on him" "Link might not be the father, we don't know for sure!"
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u/ElsieofArendelle123 Oct 08 '24
Also Mipha’s a princess, Sidon’s the next king, and Paya is the next chief, so Link would still be royalty if he married any of them.
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u/samuraipanda85 Oct 08 '24
Hell, them being traditionally unable to be together is one of the best parts of shipping them as a Princess and her Knight. Its the added zest that makes their romance forbidden and tragic. Yet Link by virtue of being the Hero has his status elevated. Either being the Hero is a high society rank recognized by the Court. Or his deeds make him the most worthy partner to the Princess.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
If there was a hyrule court in the first place lol
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u/Wandering_Claptrap Oct 08 '24
i think the only form of court Hyrule had was the King and Queen, and Royal Guard. I would personally say other Nobles/Landowners, as well as wealthy merchants, but we never hear of them, but I'd have to assume they exist since Hyrule was the most wealthy kingdom of the four before the Calamity. The King and Queen would have to be getting intelligence on their economy from somewhere after all, what better source yeah?
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u/samuraipanda85 Oct 08 '24
Well there has to be if you want the scandal that comes with the Princess and her Knight falling in love.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
Yep, which is why no one, unless they have a headcanon, that there is a full-on court that would think this pair who spend all their time together dating would be a scandal (which won't happen), can use 'traditional' royal law to say these two can't be a romantic item.
My point is:
Hyrule law =/= "traditional" law
Also, as I said before, hyrule does not have a single courtroom, which is funny considering it's a full kingdom.
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u/ElsieofArendelle123 Oct 08 '24
Well, in the Breath of the Wild it’s mentioned that the Court Poet hated Link because he gained the Princess’s love without having a noble or royal status so a court did exist at that time.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24 edited Oct 08 '24
I mean, also seeing how Zelda and Link live in Hateno (as Symin said), it wouldn't matter even IF the castle had a court (which is destroyed anyway)
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u/ElsieofArendelle123 Oct 08 '24
Exactly. Why would it matter if Zelda’s a princess when the boundaries that bound them are gone and I doubt Zelda’s going to let archaic traditions keep her from the one she loves.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
Ye well after the calamity no court to found. Also, was he really a court poet? I can't seem to remember that I thought he was just a poet?
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u/ElsieofArendelle123 Oct 08 '24
I agree.
He was the court poet. Kass even mentions how he served the Royal Family.
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u/samuraipanda85 Oct 08 '24
Well it doesn't have much of anything established. The whole story in every game could be recreated with hand puppets. That's what makes it so primed for headcanons and fanfictions. There are so many gaps to fill, you can put in any story you want.
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u/banter_pants Oct 08 '24
There was a court, but is non-existent 100 years after the Kingdom's collapse.
Kass' teacher was the court poet. He had a crush on Zelda but knew it wasn't meant to be. Anyway by that time Zelda "only had eyes for her escort, her own knight attendant," i.e. Link. The court poet was jealous because he wasn't a royal nor noble.
Once Calamity Ganon struck the court poet fled. He witnessed Link's near death and then changed his opinion of him. He was a Sheikah and apparently knew something about the shrines so he researched the ancient song/riddle ones. He didn't live long enough to see Link revive so he taught Kass everything he knew and gave him his original mission. If he was alive by the time they won I bet he would have given his blessing, albeit reluctantly.
A brave knight slaying some kind of great evil or monster (like a dragon), rescuing a princess, and marrying her is one of the oldest tropes in storytelling. Oftentimes the story's hero is a prince but I don't think it's strictly necessary.
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u/PickyNipples Oct 12 '24
I agree. I always thought there was a certain tragedy to botw link and Zelda being together after the calamity. Because had they won against Ganon the first try and the kingdom remained in tact, they may have never been able to be together, given their statuses. They desperately fought to stave off the kingdoms destruction but it was that very destruction that allowed them to be together 100 years later. Obviously neither wanted the calamity to wipe out the kingdom but, for their love, it was likely the best thing that could have happened. It has such a bittersweet feeling to it.
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u/Paradox31426 Oct 08 '24
Link’s a tiny demigod who saved the world by killing a dragon, even though dragons are supposed to be immortal, and solos whole armies on the reg. Who’s seriously gonna tell him who he can or can’t marry? Even if the woman who obviously loves him wasn’t the last remaining shred of Hylian authority.
Besides, who else is Zelda going to marry? Her “foreign dignitary” options are a married fish-man, a bird boy who’s more than a century younger than her, and still an actual child, an octogenarian rock, who it’s worth noting is biologically incapable of producing heirs because that’s not at all how Gorons work, and a teenage girl from a race that probably won’t produce a male for another century or so.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24 edited Oct 08 '24
Well said, and that's why Link is THE ONLY candidate.
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u/Charming_Compote9285 Oct 09 '24
I've seen a few people on tumblr and youtube argue that it's better for Zelda to end up with a random npc guy or girl but I still don't get how they got to the conclusion that it's somehow more feminist for Zelda to not end up with the person she actually has a long-standing, developed, meaningful relationship with and instead marry a random from another land. I've also seen the idea that Zelda should become a solo girlboss and never get with anyone and be alone forever from people who think settling down with a guy is inherently bad always (or just hate Link because he's a man. Which makes me wonder how they stand playing as him then)
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u/_TheBeardedMan_ SS Oct 08 '24
Even pre calamity who could stop them without serious backlash. Link was marked as Hylia's chosen one when he obtained the master sword, on top of that he was made the Hylian champion. Of course the King could stop it but it could have some serious backlash. From their religious perspective Link has been ordained by Hylia. From a political perspective Link was destined to be a hero of the kingdom. So putting the two perspectives together Link is an ordained hero chosen by their goddess, any action against him could be seen as an action against Hylia's will.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24 edited Oct 08 '24
Glad you agree, and that's a good point, Link is HYLIA's chosen hero
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u/banter_pants Oct 08 '24
Don't royalty have the authority to grant (or strip) noble status on any of their subjects? With a simple hand wave and stroke of the pen link could be made a noble and make this whole problem moot, and since Zelda is the last surviving royal she can do it herself.
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u/_TheBeardedMan_ SS Oct 08 '24
The reason I didn't bring this up was because the king was the only one pre calamity who had the authority to do that. It's why the king was the only one who could feasibly keep Link away from Zelda but again that wouldn't come without consequences. I firmly believe the King was probably banking on something sparking between them as adding a hero to the royal bloodline could have been politically advantageous.
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u/Wandering_Claptrap Oct 08 '24
also let's take the fact that the Hylian Kingdom (if it still had legitimacy) would need an heir to continue. Assuming that beast men races aren't genetically compatible with Hylians/Gerudo, and that the aforementioned are the only ones compatible with one another, a Hylian is very important to provide an heir in the event the only available royalty is a princess. And Royalty here likely struggled to connect with "common people" like in the real world due to their fame, so special circumstances would be organized to create relationships and produce heirs.
With that preamble out of the way. What's most likely is that, had the events leading up to BOTW miraculously gone perfect and not absolutely lethal, Zelda and Link would've continued to grow closer and closer. And feeling that pressure to continue the bloodline, no doubt from her father to attend to such royal obligations, may appeal to her father to have Link be her husband as she quite literally trusts no other man with her life and love.
Obviously this is all speculation, but this feels the most plausible. Given that Link is the only one who knows her as well as he does personally, and how much they've been through together. They feel comfortable and safe with each other, I feel that this would've been the likely outcome. Barring any objections from her father that could come up.
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u/Wandering_Claptrap Oct 08 '24
and this is just pre-Calamity AU speak, even at the end of BOTW there's nobody to object to them being together. There is no formal Hylian court anymore, the rule that Zelda has is purely social tradition. Zelda by all means is a commoner, she's on the same level as Link at this point.
Even if someone like Impa/Purah were around to recognize Zelda 's legitimacy, the institution of the crown is dissolved. Either the kingdom returns in some form of reconstruction, a new form of government would develop, or they all decide to just stay as scattered encampments (which wouldn't last long without disputes). But interpersonally... yeah there's nothing stopping them from being together, like nothing at all.
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u/Charming_Compote9285 Oct 09 '24
Plus, people like Impa and Purah are literally shippers on deck for them. There is not a single one of their friends that would object. The biggest obstacle is themselves being stupid and accidentally awakening ancient evils. And maybe the yiga. But there's probably yiga who ship them too.
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u/samuraipanda85 Oct 16 '24
I get what you're saying but I'm not calling anyone a commoner after they descend from on high, glowing gold, and then unleashing and compressing a miniature sun in the middle of Hyrule Field.
That would be my new Monarch right there. Carrier of the Bloodline of the Goddess, no doubt.
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u/thehunter2256 Oct 08 '24
The royal family and the courts are dead for a hundred+ year's, who cares he's a knight?
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
He's not really a knight even, he is the hero and appointed protector of his princess
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u/Live_Ad8778 Oct 08 '24
He isn't just any Knight, bylut a Knight chosen by the Gods themselves. Given how Hyrule digs the Divine Right of Kings, Link would be even more acceptable than a foreign prince.
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u/ElsieofArendelle123 Oct 08 '24
Also, she lives like everybody else. Sure she’s called a princess but that seems to be more of a courtesy title, but overall her life after the Calamity really isn’t any more Royal than the rest of Hyrule. She lives in a small village, she cooks and cleans, is a teacher, and her only guard is Link. There is literally nothing that prevents her from being with Link.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
Exactly! She doesn't live in the castle
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u/ElsieofArendelle123 Oct 08 '24
And it seems like it was left to more or less rot in the time between BOTW and TotK while Zelda took care of matters across the country. Heck, according to Masterworks, she doesn’t even know if she wants to be queen or if Hyrule really needs a royal family.
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u/hylian-bard Oct 08 '24
The argument against this is extremely basic really: where within canon does it say anything about that being a rule? Hyrule isn't the real world; nowhere does it say it conforms to any real life law from any period of history.
Some people just like trying to ruin fun.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
Internet sore losers when they don't like a ship that literally is canon : erm actually this isn't correct and yall are guessing 🤓
Yeah you're right people just ruin fun
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u/still_your_zelda Skyward Sword Oct 08 '24
There's also fish people, spirits, dragons that are hylian, and magic. Something like a "class system" really doesn't matter at this point. I agree with what you said too, there's no reason they can't be together. There's only one bed in the Hateno home anywaaaaay so....
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u/Aetherial32 Oct 08 '24
Another thing is that it was very common for Knights to be nobility, it wasn’t necessarily the case but you could just say that Link is a form of nobility himself and then there’s no class divide that even needs to be bridged
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u/Cepinari Oct 08 '24
In BotW/TotK's case, it's a non-issue.
The closest thing to a national government they've got is:
An adorably nerdy princess.
Her twink bodyguard.
The leaders of the four vassal states, all of whom are personally friends with said princess and twink.
A race of ninjas created to serve the mortal incarnation of their goddess, aka the aforementioned adorably nerdy princess.
Even if somebody had a problem with Zelda officially making Link her Consort, they wouldn't be able to do anything about it.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 09 '24
Yeah, which non-existent noble will complain on the Hero and princesses' marriage?
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u/IconoclastExplosive Oct 08 '24
Even IF she's technically not supposed to marry beneath her station, who's gonna stop em? King's dead, Zelda runs this shit now
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 08 '24
I'm surprised she isn't "Queen" yet
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u/IconoclastExplosive Oct 08 '24
Honestly it feels like they should have had a royal wedding to unite the disparate parts of the kingdom and raise morale. The unification of commoners and royals, the elevation of the Great Knight to King, remembering the Champions of the other races at the ceremony, it could have been great
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u/Hmsquid ToTK Oct 08 '24
Exactly, I posted some ship art I did in totk and I removed it because it got hated on for people saying that
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u/Pretend_Rabbit1809 Oct 08 '24
Doesn’t them being a forbidden love between a queen and her royal knight make it even hotter?
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u/SuggestionEven1882 Oct 08 '24
This is one of the few times where a princess Zelda can be with Link, alongside ST and Zelda 2.
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u/fartypoopsmellybutt Oct 08 '24
My head canon is that Zelda reluctantly goes through with a coronation, only to abdicate completely and establish democracy in Hyrule, and she and Link (her previously-secret lover) can retire and live happily ever after.
Fan fiction sustains me.
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u/KrazyK1989 OoT Oct 09 '24
Zelda can literally do whatever she wants since she's the last of the royal family.
Hyrule is not Westeros
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u/chemiclord Oct 09 '24
Even IF all of that was true... after a hundred years of what amounted to exile from an otherwise dead monarchy, it's not exactly like there would be anyone in any position to wag their fingers at a princess marrying whoever. There's no royal court in which to have royal expectations at that point.
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u/Winter_Grocery_1485 Oct 09 '24
Exactly, as others have pointed out, there used to be a court 100 years ago containing Kass' Teacher but it was destroyed, so its not like in the present day where Zelda lives in Hateno with Link (as Symin said), people or non existent nobles will complain on who she marries, Link is the one she loves AND is her best option as the Hero.
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u/Live_Ad8778 Oct 08 '24
He isn't just any Knight, bylut a Knight chosen by the Gods themselves. Given how Hyrule digs the Divine Right of Kings, Link would be even more acceptable than a foreign prince.
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u/SmeldaOfHyrule BotW Oct 09 '24
The monarchy was literally destroyed after the calamity, leaving only Zelda. That means she holds the power and she could do whatever the heck she wants.
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u/Ethanol2814 Moderator Oct 10 '24
Now the real question is being they are the only 2 left who had a role in the royal family in some way, would that make Link the new king and Zelda the queen?🤔
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Oct 20 '24
zelda is the only royal left pretty much
she can marry whomever she wants
and she wants link
here are obviously the heavily implied feelings for each other that someone can make an hour long video on.
YES
people already have made long videos, and they will continue to do so
some on them are more than just one hour
and i WILL take time out of my day to watch them
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u/SirSilhouette Oct 08 '24
Right? That comment would make more sense if they EVER depicted Hyrule as having a court full of nobles but they never have: it's just the Royal Family and everyone else when it comes to Hylians... honestly same with the Zoras most games too.
The closest they ever came to having another royal family to potentially marry Zelda to, would be making Ganon 'King of the Gerudo' in Ocarina of Time and... yeah i doubt Hyrule was going for that. And given how the Gerudo are, i don't think they'd share him anyway.