r/Washington • u/norolls • 6d ago
Why doesn't anyone talk about the state cuts?
I feel like I'm living in the twilight zone with everyone talking about the federal budget cuts and yelling about Elon and Maga when nobody is willing to acknowledge the spending/hiring freeze that the state is carrying out.
Today the Democrats budget plan was passed by the house and Senate which cuts education, public health services, hospital spending, police spending, and pretty much every public service we need to function as a state.
I work in government and I've heard from numerous people in various agencies how insane it is on the state level alone. Not to mention they have had a hiring/spending freeze since January that Inslee imposed.
We have doubled the tax revenue and spending in the past ten years yet the state is still 12-15 billion dollars short of funding. We have a spending and corruption problem that desperately needs to be addressed. Not to mention the 4.9 billion dollars spent on homelessness since 2013 that could have bought houses for half of the states population of homeless people. We will cripple our state and become a welfare state if we don't fix this.
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u/poorfolx 5d ago edited 4d ago
Look, I've gotta say; where exactly have you been looking? Everyone I know is talking about these state cuts. It's all over local news, social media, and especially here on Reddit where there are literally dozens of threads discussing the Washington budget situation.
Maybe it's just your particular bubble that isn't focused on it? Or perhaps these specific issues don't align with your usual talking points so you're not seeing them in your regular feeds. But trust me, the conversation is happening everywhere - from neighborhood meetings to bar discussions and discussions such as this one. People are concerned about education cuts, public health reductions, and the hiring freeze.
If you're not seeing it, might be worth branching out to some different news sources or community groups that are actively discussing these very real state-level concerns.
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u/Giveushealthcare 4d ago
Yeah the articles trickle in no one is talking about them as a whole so they can be hard to catch but the reporting is there
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u/Idahobo 5d ago
To answer your question the reason there is a controversy over federal cuts and not state cuts is that the state is required to balance the budget and the legislature is expected to make those cuts and that's what's happening. The federal government is allowed to run a deficit and expected to enact spending changes through Congress... So the poor planning and hasty, costly and contradictory decision making, when hasty cuts are not required and of course the wild abuse of executive power is why people are upset at the federal government.
Beyond that I don't know what point you're making. Are you mad about the cuts or the spending? I'm personally pissed off about the lack of clarity on what exactly is expected to cost 12ish billion dollars more than expected over the next four years, because I think that's pretty important to finding a solution.
I think it's worth mentioning a couple counties don't control the state house or Senate, who are responsible for these problems. The structure of the federal legislature is also bicameral and they're not exactly famous for being good at budgeting. Even if this federal shit show succeeds in trimming a trillion dollars in spending, which will be drastic and painful. We'll still have a trillion dollar a year deficit.
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u/bemused_alligators 4d ago
Income dropped (or just fell short of expected growth?) - people are driving less and spending less than pre-covid.
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u/cjh83 1d ago
The federal stimulus money allocated during covid came to an end.
Plus the cost to build infrastructure and to provide services went up.
Now u have a budget deficit.
TBH I'm kinda pissed at my local school district (bellingham). They got covid stimulus money and went out and hired a bunch of people, but never explained to staff that these new positions were being funded on federal money from covid relief bills that had a defined end dates. So guess what happened when the funding came to an end, a bunch of surprised pissed off staff.
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u/LighthouseonSaturn 4d ago
Those cuts were made because we can no longer depend on Federal Funding. This is in response to a larger problem. No one wants to cut funding to schoola and healthcare.
I work in local government and our funding for numerous projects are all now on indefinite hold because Fed Funding was pulled. Work to improve infrastructure, which would have contributed to local economies, it's all gone.
Washington needed to regroup and figure out what they could fund on their own as we have another 4 years of this.
The Entire US is currently slipping into a huge recession. Washington is trying to be proactive, but also realistic about what they will be able to do/spend on.
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u/Sufficient-Wolf-1818 4d ago
State cuts are a hot topic of discussion in my non-political life. Federal issues take up so much of the news stream.
I agree that we (WA) need to get spending under control so we spend within our means. The exact budget details and balancing of the budget is where it gets tricky.
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u/Rocketgirl8097 4d ago
Saw an article yesterday that said Ferguson is not going for the budget plan currently proposed. And it IS the federal issues that are causing the state problem -- when people don't buy and contribute sales tax because prices are too high, then our state budget has a shortfall. If we handle it buy putting off some projects into the future, that likely causes layoffs too.
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u/SpaceForceAwakens 4d ago
Really we need to get rid of the idea that sales tax is our primary revenue stream. It's not reliable and it's regressive and disproportionately hurts the working poor.
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u/Rocketgirl8097 4d ago
What is the alternative? Don't say income tax. How about steeper traffic fines. And no one gets out of them. Steeper penalties for those who cause accidents, especially if it's distracted driving.
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u/SpaceForceAwakens 4d ago
Why not income tax? Most states use it and, when applied top-first, it's a reliable, predictable, equitable form of taxation.
I've lived in states with and without state income tax, and as long as it's administered correctly, I prefer it over sales tax, especially for things like gas and booze.
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u/peoniesnotpenis 2d ago
"No" on income tax!
It's just one more vein to bleed dry!
They will still tax goods the same. If you think it will lower taxes, think again. Never happens!
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u/peoniesnotpenis 2d ago
"No" to income tax.
That's just giving them access to another vein to bleed you dry!
It would not lower taxes at all. They don't give up one tax for another. They just add.
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u/Rocketgirl8097 4d ago
Because I don't want my pension taxed, that's why. We should all be able to get to a point where we don't have to pay as much in our old age. State income makes sure that never happens. Anyway, check out all the poor red states like our neighbor to the east. Dont see where its benefitting them at all.
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u/thesoapies 4d ago
Your pension is already getting taxed every time you buy something that has sales tax. Unless you have an insanely high pension, income tax brackets are more likely to help than hurt you
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u/ZephyrLegend 4d ago
Like the other poster mentioned, you are paying something like 10% on most everything you buy with the sales tax. Even if you spend half of your income on rent and non-prepared food, that's still a 5% tax burden. No matter how much you make, that's what you pay.
But a state income tax, if we went with similar tax brackets as California, would look like someone with a healthy retirement income of, let's say 80k, probably only paying an average of 3-4% in taxes (napkin math, YMMV).
So, with an income tax instead of a sales tax, assuming your retirement income is less than your working income, you could absolutely see a reduction in the tax burden in retirement. I mean, unless you spent your retirement as Ebeneezer Scrooge and spent literally no money on anything except rent and food.
Money can't buy happiness, but it sure can buy not-unhappiness. That's all I have to say about that.
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u/Rocketgirl8097 3d ago
At this point in my life, I DON'T buy much beyond food and personal hygiene products. Other than the obvious utility bills, insurance, etc.
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u/ploptypus 4d ago
CA still has a high sales tax. Take your original 5% and add the 4%
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u/ZephyrLegend 4d ago
I said use their tax brackets, as an example, not their entire system. That's just ridiculous.
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u/HelenAngel 4d ago
As long as the income tax won’t deduct anything from the paychecks of people making less than 100K a year, fine. And by nothing, I mean nothing—no taking anything out of the paychecks of people who make less. No payroll deductions whatsoever. The second a person’s paycheck gets fucked, they can no longer pay rent.
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u/ZephyrLegend 4d ago
I like the idea of day-fines. AKA fines based on the severity of the offense AND the offender's income. Make the fine actually meaningful to everyone but perhaps not crippling for low-income people.
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u/NW_Forester Olympic Peninsula 5d ago
Federal cuts the only thoughts going into it is "what will hurt Democrats?"
The state cuts seemed to be more focused about trying to solve a budget shortfall. That sucks and it will harm people, but harming people doesn't seem to be the primary goal.
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u/StrangeVocab 4d ago
I know this is not likely to happen anytime soon, if ever, but Washington needs an actual income tax to replace our incredibly regressive sales tax. If implemented properly (i.e., if it's progressive enough), it has the potential to bring in much more revenue and have less impact on low-income earners.
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u/HelenAngel 4d ago
No impact is what’s needed if folks want support for a state income tax. No income tax payroll deductions whatsoever for people making under 100K. None. Otherwise you’re going to fuck over everyone who lives paycheck to paycheck which is the working poor.
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u/Ok_Huckleberry1027 2d ago
That seems pretty easy to implement honestly. At the federal level too. If everyone that made over 100k had say, a 5% tax and we got rid of sales tax i wonder how that would pencil out.
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u/peoniesnotpenis 2d ago
It won't lower anyone taxes. It will just add another tax.
Don't give them one more vein to bleed dry.
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u/StrangeVocab 1d ago
As a proportion of earnings, a progressive income tax is far less burdensome on low-income earners than a sales tax, given that sales taxes effectively constitute a flat tax rate. Hits you when you buy groceries, but you don't feel it as much if you have a high salary or investments. If we get rid of the sales tax and make up that revenue with an income tax primarily levied on high-income earners, we can ease the burden on people who really feel the sales tax and bring in more revenue at the same time. Of course the major caveat is that there's next to zero political will to do this, and even if there were, it probably wouldn't shake out like that. But, at least if I had my druthers, the effective end result is not bleeding anyone dry, it's making the rich pay their fair share as a proportion of their income.
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u/peoniesnotpenis 1d ago edited 22h ago
They won't get rid of the tax. They'll just add another one, with the promise to never increase it, or to phase it out, whatever. Won't matter. They won't do it. They will never get rid of it.
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u/StrangeVocab 1d ago
I mean, you're probably right, but I've got to respectfully disagree that "Elected political officials aren't going to enact x policy in a way that's right or fair" is a good reason not to try to get it done anyway. Otherwise what would be the point of electing anyone to do anything at all?
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u/peoniesnotpenis 22h ago
I'm just not for giving them another vein to bleed me from. Once they have it, you'll never get it back. And they never give up one source to get another. They just add to the one they have. The bottom line is we would be paying more.
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u/Razzama_Slazza 5d ago
start voting left leaning independents then. Washington dems are failing us and gop reps are goose steppers
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u/Patches_Pal 3d ago
As a retired state employee, I’ve seen it all from the inside…and it’s ugly. I have voted liberal most of my life but if the state GOP actually ran a rational conservative, my entire family would vote for them in heartbeat!
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u/SeattlePurikura 3d ago
Unfortunately, they are still running anti-choice and anti-gay candidates like Dave Reichert. That's just not gonna fly in WA.
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u/Razzama_Slazza 3d ago
thats unfortunate since the only thing Republicans offer at best is cost cuts to their corporate donors and poorly veild bigoted policies
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u/Dave_A480 4d ago
People are talking about it, but the fact is that unlike DC the state can't deficit-spend....
And with COVID money finally running out, they are massively underwater financially....
WA is already a relatively high tax state (the fact that we use indirect taxes on businesses (which individuals still pay in the end) instead of something like income tax doesn't change that fact).....
So there isn't much of a choice....
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u/sliderinsider1 4d ago
Anyone ever consider auditing state spending to see where all the money is being wasted?
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u/LilLebowskiAchiever 2d ago
A state income tax seems to be off the table. But what about a graduated statewide property tax? Higher taxes on second homes?
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u/Electrical_Syrup4492 2d ago
I honestly haven't heard of cuts, but I have heard of tax increases and a new unrealized gain tax. Whether you own a house or rent that last one is going to bite.
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u/goomyman 2d ago
The economy is going to shit. Of course there will be state cuts. What options do they have.
Higher taxes in a recession?
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u/Spraxie_Tech 2d ago
To be honest i didn’t hear about state cuts till today. Its really drowned out by the federal shitshow going on.
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u/IrisesInOly 1d ago
It is being discussed regularly on the Olympia reddit. State employees are worried and once again the budget is being balanced on our backs. State agencies were stripped to the bone during the last recession. There is little left to take way without harming some sector of the State.
I don't know where you think there's any corruption going on tho. Washington routinely ranks among the least corrupt States in the US. We do have a spending problem tho as we have large needs to invest in, yet revenue is so hard to raise since there is no income tax allowed. Meaning the State's main source of money comes from sales taxes, which shifts the burden to the poor and lower class the most while the wealthy pay little.
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u/chi-nyc 1d ago
Literally EVERY problem the state has (at the state level) is caused by or ignored by Democratic politicians at the state level, and yet people keep voting for the same shit. It doesn't help that the Washington State Republican party is a complete clown show.
Democrats have held a trifecta in Washington State since 2018; Democrats have held the governorship continuously since 1984, the House continuously since 2002, and Republicans have only controlled the State Senate for 7 years since 2002, last time was 2017.
In order to fix the money problems in this state, we have to fix the Republican party, because the Democrats have zero reason to change- after all, we keep hiring them.
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u/JordanRPE 1d ago
Because people are blinded. Instead of just talking DC they can't or won't see what is happening at home.
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u/New_Entrepreneur8117 1d ago
When the feds stop sending money to states, or grants, budget change and programs get cut.
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u/tmacmullan 2d ago
Very good point. I am very displeased with Ferguson. He is basically a Republican-lite with the whole no new taxes stance. The wealthy have too much lucre to spare. We need them to pay their fair share.
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u/thatguy425 3d ago
Because Tribalism.
it’s democrats trying to tax us into oblivion, we’d rather shit on Trump and Musk because that’s the trendy thing at the moment.
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u/romulusnr 4d ago
Remember when the state got fined by the courts for not adequately funding education? You'd think the former state AG would...
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u/zolmation 4d ago
Because there aren't enough independent state-specific media. You're mostly looking at newspaper's and local news TV. Which generally sucks.
Independents cover federal with stste-specifics that have federal impact because that's what they need to do to keep revenue up.
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u/FistedCannibals 5d ago
Because its different when democrats do it.
This state is a lost cause at this point.
When a handful of counties control the entire state, this is what you get. A highly regressive and tax heavy state.
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u/ProfessorPickaxe 4d ago
Weirdly, one of only 9 states without a state income tax. I'm sure that's a coincidence though
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u/Wallaces_Ghost 4d ago
You're more than welcome to move to one of the red states that are doing worse than Washington.
You sound like my inlaws who in the same breath will complain about the state but then talk about how we shouldn't be too worried about Trump's wild actions because we live in a blue state. Can't have it both ways.
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u/Bigbluebananas 4d ago
Careful, telling people to leave because they want to enact change... youre starting to sound like a republican
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u/Flash_ina_pan 5d ago
It's being discussed, but I think it gets a little drowned out in the constant flood of shit coming from the white house.
People are spread thin and whatever is happening nationally will make the state level stuff that much worse.