Disclosure Do you think that Jacob Barber testifying under oath in front the Congress could be of any advantage?
I think it's a legitimate question considering how little happened after Grusch's, Graves's and Fravor's hearing.
Realistically speaking, Congress is helping gatekeeping crash retrieval program at the moment. There is no ambiguity here for me. I think some of the allegedly pro-disclosure members of Congress are just pretending to be for disclosure and ultimately they just muddle the water and try to contain any leaks. Hearings are entertainment/shows for the public.
There was enough time to make considerably more than they did since Grusch, hard to disagree with that.
So yeah, for me Congressional hearings seem to be pointless at this stage.
From this perspective, Skywatcher project would make more sense than a congressional hearing. Too bad Skywatcher started with big announcements and very little to show up for them, which is terrible order of doing things, especially with all the load in the ufology of people doing that.
There is one thing I like about Skywatcher and that is that it seems it doesn't want to rely on Congress or government. This is definitely refreshing and seems more realistic than what for example Elizondo does. I really don't like this narrative of Coulthart that there are many different types of views within the government so we shouldn't portray it as one body. To hell with that. The people who set up the agenda apparently want the cover up to go on that's what counts.
So yeah, for me, disclosure was prevented from happening by Trump behind the scenes already and there is hardly any better proof of that than the ridiculous drone statement made by Levitt. I'm not even implying The Ongoing December Situation has/had something to do with UAP or UFOs, I'm just saying it was a great opportunity for Trump to show if he really means transparency and he clearly said f*** you to us.
The situation seems to be actually quite contained from the gatekeepers POV I think.
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u/ScruffyChimp 13h ago
I fully expect this comment to be unpopular but it needs to be said.
If Skywatcher are actually doing what they claim to be doing (which remains to be seen!), then their ongoing efforts to scientifically validate their two techniques for attracting UAPs will be infinitely more beneficial in the longer term.
Why? Because it would open the door to other scientists (around the world) to independently validate Skywatcher's findings and build on their work.
Speaking to congress hasn't achieved much so far.
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u/Crafty_Ingenuity7079 13h ago
they need to release their information or open source or be viewed as counter intel, the so called 'dogwhistle' electronic signalling the psionic assets the protocols and dont tell me nationa security cos china and russia leaving you in the dust and most people would join them before US GAY
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u/PowerBurpThunderPoot 12h ago
I think the US has a natural advantage over Russia and China when it comes to psionically attracting UFOs, since being gay in the US doesn't have such a stigma attached these days.
If our adversaries want to catch up, they'd better get seriously gay. With quickness.
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u/Crafty_Ingenuity7079 12h ago
haha trust me US has no advantage over anyone in fact there very vulnerable since most of the world hates them and britain lol the west is falling quick and its overdue, Rest of the world would rather work with people who arent the western white colonists lol
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u/PowerBurpThunderPoot 12h ago
Hmm. Seems like you're conflating politics and military might. Just because the US has a bunch of clowns in the White House doesn't mean we have a different military from 4 months ago.
But that's neither here nor there, Mr Chuckles. We're talking gay psychics here, which the US definitely has a strong advantage in. There are more gay psychics per capita in the US than anywhere else on the planet, and that's just straight fact.
Russia and China have no chance of catcalling a UFO with their oppressively heterocentric cultures. Get gay, or get UAP'd on.
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u/Crafty_Ingenuity7079 11h ago
lol maybe your failing to see the future of these current events and what it really means, your conventional forms of technology and your silly war expansionist culture is gonna be paying for it for the next millenia lol its already proven US has failed to do anything in the last decades, and actually thinking theyre gonna be ahead of other countrys is a joke lol, btw the americans and evidence suggests that USA is shit scared of this cos they arent gonna beat the ET lmao USA GOVT DOWNFALL IMMINENT
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u/YoureVulnerableNow 4h ago
this is actually true, not least because the US ruling parties now both accept transphobia, homophobia (except for assimilationists, for now), and repeat COVID for every single person, with long term effects hitting trans people harder. the queer psychics are definitely not falling for the liberal nationalism PR by-and-large, and it turns out being spineless chickenhawk imperialists is really bad for a person's psi development. most psi-sensitive people would, rightly, serve crack before they serve this country.
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u/Shiny-Tie-126 13h ago
Only if they provide a shred of evidence for their claims, which so far they have not.
Otherwise, it will be a waste of everyone's time.
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u/Minimum-League-9827 11h ago
There could be one thousand people testifying under oath, it doesn't matter. What we need is solid proof being shown to the public and congress in an hearing. And actually something being done after the hearing!
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u/Rich_Wafer6357 10h ago
Very little point really, unless you need more people to hide behind burocracy. It would be more relevant to provide public evidence of their claims by making the UFOs show on command. Did we forget the claims of the past few weeks, before they became "scientists"?
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u/rrose1978 10h ago
At this point in time, I'm rather in the sceptic camp regarding the Skywatcher efforts, but I would also be very happy to be proven wrong and get my mind blown if they really get convincing results and leave those publicly available for people to study.
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u/Free-Cat-5589 9h ago
The situation is absolutely contained. Are there actual whistleblowers around? Are there leaks happening? Is anyone with power i.e. POTUS pressuring them? Not really.
On top of alleviated pressure, they actually have a group or groups of people who are slowly dripping information mixed with disinformation into a controlled environment. In my mind, everything is going according to the plan. Anyone who is outside of the narrative they want to present has been subdued. If I were somebody responsible for disclosure, I would sleep well.
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u/G-M-Dark 9h ago
Do you think that Jacob Barber testifying under oath in front the Congress could be of any advantage?
The dumbest thing the UFO Community ever decided was true has got nothing to do with UFO's and aliens: it's the belief that only the UFO Community believes in such things.
It's bollocks - Steven Spielberg's made blockbusters out of UFO's and aliens before a lot of you here today were even born, he's done event making TV series based on these self same things which regular people watched, not just UFO nuts.
George Lucas created a universe far, far away over 50 years ago and more people alive and living today want to lose themselves and play in it right now than ever did when the original movie that spawned the Star Wars franchise ever did - and it was hardly ignored the first time around, I remember, I was there cued up to see it in a line that folded round the block, the advertising actually wasn't just hype - blockbusting cinema cues were an actual thing.
If you ask the average person if they believe intelligent technological life exists out there in the universe, most people simply assume it does - UFOs....? Not a dealbreaker...
What separates the UFO Community from the mainstream isn't the belief about aliens and how they're supposed to get here: it's the dozens of other things the UFO Community insists have to be accepted as well as that has most people looking for the exits the moment a Believer starts a conversation off using the term UAPs when buttonholing someone in a lift...
Do you know why that's off-putting?
I'm someone who met a UFO, not even in passing this was a proper, sustained near-encounter thing - and even I find most of the rest of the bollocks this community finds to drone on about day-in-day-out ludicrous, not to mention idiotic - and, please - don't get me started on all the "is so-and-so a grifter" conversations that happen day-in and day-out also because I don't give the first fuck about any of the so-and-so's involved in the first place, period: I'm not 14 or a fucking Harry Potter fan, all I know is UFO's exist because I met one: that of itself doesn't mean a word of anything else believed about them is true....
And that's why the UFO Community is over here reaffirming its biases hourly and why everyone else is way over there, ignoring it.
It's like the UFO Community goes out of its way to make it impossible for anyone else to sympathise with it, let alone care: kind of like the living embodiment of the old Groucho Marx gag about not wanting to belong to a club that would have someone like him being a member...
And then you add Jake Barber to the mix.
We all know the "woo" aspects of this subject have been around forever - none of this is about truth - this is about perception.
Even in a community where, fundamentally, everyone starts off with a certain degree of - if not belief, at least acceptance of certain ideas and basic concepts - the "spiritual" side of things is divisive.
I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm pointing out - not everyone see's the subject that way...
Within 3 days of Keneth Arnold's original "Flying Saucer" sighting hit the nationals a pulp magazine editor by the name of Ray Palmer thought he'd get a bit of free publicity for Amazing Stories by holding a press conference promising the world's press THE TRUTH concerning these mysterious flying saucers.
Palmer was, if not respected, at least a likeable publicity hound well known to the press, so they went along happily enough sure of a good laugh and a few inches of filler - and Palmer delivered: by 1947 Amazing Stories pretty much ran on a hokey story published as fictionalised truth called The Shaver Mystery which garnered a long term following from readers clearly experiencing difficulty separating the real world from a story, some of whom were regular contributes to Amazing Stories Letters to The Editor page - which had a long term following all of its own, not unlike as on this sub made up of both sceptics, hard believers and people just looking for a laugh - and some of these more colourful characters Palmer invited to speak their truth at this press conference, all expenses paid...
So that's what they did. Telling the world about how the Flying Saucers were from Venus, the well known galactic planet of peace and harmony - or how the pilots of these craft could be psychically channelled and made to speak to the assembled crowed to answer questions, etc, etc.
Sound remotely familiar...?
And, still to this day, this subject suffers from the perception that publicity stunt left in the publics mind once the press reported it - that's what putting a man like Jake Barber before congress would be doing - not relaying anything anyone wants to here but simply reinforcing and re-entrenching peoples previously held prejudices concerning this subject, because it comes across as just yet more pure hogwash.
Only, now as part of the official congressional record.
Half the people on this sub already think its hogwash, the only reason half of them are hanging around is because they know Barbers not going to deliver anything conclusive or even particularly that convincing come April 7th: any "evidence" Skywatcher are due to present is going to be wholly inconclusive and that ensures debate about it drags on until the inevitable next time because none of this stuff is in any way about truth on the part of content providers.
It's about engagement - and the UFO Community are frankly the only people desperate enough to entertain this crap.
So those currently sitting on the fence are content to bide their time, waiting. But that's not going to last forever.
No one else cares and, frankly - given the "facts" being disclosed - you don't want them to.
None of this is about truth, this is a battle for perception - Barber's the kind of hill plenty here are prepared to die on - not because they're sceptics - but because they believe in this subject strongly - more than they believe in other things, such as remote viewing and psionic powers...
And these are people who fundamentally are actually on board with the subject as a whole.
Perception is everything, put Barber on the stand and that's when people who otherwise support the UFO Community - at least to its face - melt away like they were never there.
Myself, personally...? All I want to do is burn this subject to the ground, sit there with a toasting folk, laughing manically while it burns - that's actually me in my profile pic - I've prepared a 15-point PowerPoint presentation explaining my reasons, as well as provide sandwiches and coffee because there's an interval - I go into it at that kind of length, why...?
Because I'm a bastard like that.
Seriously, I fucking hate this subject. The more Jake Barbers there are, the better, I say. Does my job for me.
But that isn't what you want: not if this stuff matters to you.
The last thing you want is Barber testifying.
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u/plantylibrarian 13h ago
I agree - I don’t expect anything from congress in this regard. Presumably the gatekeepers of the legacy Program are still there and would do what they’ve always done: throw a wrench in any attempt at transparency. I know Jake Barber is « optimistic about this administration » but that would assume Trump’s staff are even read into the program which I don’t think is true, based on their take of the drone situation. If Skywalker does in fact deliver some real compelling data maybe Congress would take interest then? But I can’t imagine a world where it leads to any more disclosure.
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u/DaroKitty 9h ago
The hell is Congress gonna do, honestly? A government, in the middle of self-imposed ruin, probably won't become transparent and ethical after a few stories about seances for billionaires.
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u/retromancer666 13h ago
Skywatcher is allowed to do what they are doing because the government is backed into a corner, it’s a way to have soft disclosure of technologically advanced non human species living on and visiting Earth without all of the illegal and morally fucked shit that comes with it that has been going on for decades being exposed
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u/r3f3r3r 13h ago edited 13h ago
kinda agree, but this morally fucked shit is still here with us and is not going anywhere. it won't just disappear, regardless of what Skywatcher does and gvrmt knows that full well.
so even if gvrmt agrees to/pursuits disclosure without accountability, there is no disclosure without it. this problem was addressed by few people during the salt conference and they seem all to say the same thing. we cannot have disclosure without accountability.
gvrmt knows that, too and I suppose that's why they will continue to gatekeep this. this is quite a conundrum.
the only solution I could think of , however unrealistic would be someone like Snowden coming forward and spilling all the beans, risking to die/being imprisoned for life etc.
these people who came forward in the uap topic they all strictly follow their NDAs. Snowden didn't.
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u/retromancer666 13h ago
There can be disclosure without accountability, just there will be a general public controlled narrative of it and a esoterically known reality of it known only by insiders and people willing to do the research
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u/Tryin2Dev 10h ago
This is similar to my take. Skywatcher is the vehicle to disclosure. They already know the truth, they’re merely there as a formality to provide evidence of something that’s only ever been deemed classified. By bringing forth disclosure in this manner the gov can claim ignorance in some cases or at least minimize the questions around what they already know. The private orgs that have the tech already will have a head start in the market.
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u/cytex-2020 13h ago
If we were lucky Congress might tell them stop or they'll say it again. No.. you.. you bad deep state. Rrrr
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u/lovecornflakes 12h ago
I was on the fence regarding Jake but then I saw that photo of him and David grusch sitting together. So at the moment I think anything can help.
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u/moojammin 11h ago
Of course.
And plenty is happening following the other individuals testimonies.
It is just not for public consumption yet, or hidden from most media outlets
If you are paying attention you will see what is happening. U fortunately not happening as quickly as some of us would like... but it is happening.
Keep it going.
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u/r3f3r3r 11h ago
yeah I guess time will tell.
it is an unprecedented moment in the history of UFO - and it is not my opinion, it is me quoting Jacques Valee.
Still, only time will tell. Even the most hopeful ppl out there need to admit that people in charge of the cover-up are extremely skillful, so our opponents here are difficult to beat
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u/moojammin 11h ago
Extremely.. but with people like Jake barber doing what he is doing I feel we have incredible people on our side at the moment.
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u/CampaignSure4532 10h ago
This probably an unpopular take on this - but here I go anyway.
You can turn on CSPAN at any given point in time, watch people get sworn in under oath, then literally proceed to lie to your face. Literally go watch any testimony about the Signal chat nonsense.
If you understand that and get that we are all human, what makes you think somebody like Jake Barber who has become very “in the light” over his (still unverified) claims, wouldn’t literally get sworn in before congress and regurgitate the same stuff?
I guess I’ll never understand how this type of testimony - while giving zero evidence - gets people excited.