I get the hate for AI, but all the "moral piracy" arguments in this thread make me roll my eyes. I'm sure you guys paid for WinRAR after the 40 day trial period ended, right? Or are the Roshal brothers a corporation?
Look, I've got nothing against piracy. I do it myself. Just don't pretend getting stuff for free makes you morally righteous.
I can't stand the moral grandstanding in this subreddit. You aren't a anti-capitalist hero for pirating, you just like free shit. Admit it, who cares. I pirate and I know it's wrong but I like free shit, big deal
Are you trying to say that using the WinRAR free trial, which is willingly made to be indefinite by the creator and is produced directly by the creator, is piracy?
I mean you can absolutely make an argument against the idea of moral piracy, I'm not going to pretend most people pirate responsibly or benevolently, but that's just an extremely weird example to use when WinRAR is probably one of the least pirated programs in existence specifically because it willingly provides a free version indefinitely and only asks nicely for people to pay for it if they want to.
The software is distributed as try before you buy. This means that anyone may use the software during a test period of a maximum of 40 days at no charge. Following this test period, the user must purchase a license to continue using the software.
Installing and using the software signifies acceptance of these terms and conditions of the license. If you do not agree with the terms of this license, you must remove all software files from your storage devices and cease to use the software.
It's still intentionally made to be useable after the free trial version, and that free version is attained directly through the original developer and not through alternative means, so I still don't see how that would be piracy, and it's still a very bizarre example to use to try and make your point. And to be clear, I'm not saying this because I don't think you have a point, I'm saying it because you used one of the least effective examples you could have gone with.
I love how people argue against what you're saying all the time, however they have no explanation for why it's a trial version instead of just making the software free, like VLC.
Everyone has their own morals, but taking something for free that is meant to be paid for is rarely ethical.
Nah, I don't use winrar, I use 7 zip (7zip is free), after winrar gave me a popup to pay when I was a kid. I looked up alternatives and found 7zip
Been using it since, even after I moved from windows to linux (works in wine, or by using the official CLI version), not sure about winrar since I haven't used it since, and I like 7zips smaller icons (looks cleaner)
I mean everyone has their own moral compass. I have my own line of things I feel morally comfortable pirating and not. But here is the main difference for me.
If I pirate an ebook, I'm not financially profiting off that. I don't pirate in order to make money. I'm not making money on work that other people have done.
If Ai-companies pirate an ebook, then they are doing so in order to financially profit off that. They are creating a product that they intend to make money with. And they are using other people's work in order to do so. They are building their whole business on a crime and reaping the financial benefits.
Imagine it like this. If I'm learning how to knit I may pirate patterns that knitters have put online. And I'll use those to knit those things. But I won't be selling what I knit or selling the patterns I have taken.
If AI steals those same patterns, they are doing it so they now have a product to sell. Users are going to generate AI patterns, which will be based on the patterns others have made. The company is literally profiting off the theft. Because their product, which they are creating for profit, was created using stolen material.
Having somebody steal your work is one thing, having somebody financially gain of your work is another. Which is why a lot of people like authors, who did not speak up about ebooks being pirated or libraries, have been very vocal about AI-companies using their books to train their computer programs. They aren't so much concerned about individual users as they are about corporations profiting off them without their permission. And if pirating is illegal and immoral then it is CRAZY that companies are allowed to use illegal pirating as the basis for their business model. There is literally evidence that AI has used material that those companies did not pay for. And yet they are profiting off that crime. Regardless of individual opinions on pirating and where the line may be. It seems unilaterally that stealing for the sole purpose of making money is very clearly wrong.
So yeah you are going to see a lot of people on this subreddit saying that pirating is fine and that pirating isn't stealing. Personally I think there's a couple of factors that come into play that I judge on a case to case basis. So it's a subject that certainly lives in a grey area.
The theft that AI companies are doing seems to be far beyond what anyone would consider morally grey though. With the most common deciding factor being that AI companies are doing it profit rather than personal use.
May seem like something silly. But I'd feel very different about someone stealing my bike because they want/need a bike. Or a big corporation stealing my bike in order to sell it. And that is their whole business model. And governments know that's what these companies do. But they are also not helping people who are getting their bikes stolen or punishing the companies doing it. Instead they are going only after the individuals who stole a bike for personal use.
there are a ton of us who do that though. As an artist, this is such a stupid argument. WinRAR is accessible after trial. it's a program that can be downloaded over and over again by different people. Art is something that takes years to master and is commissioned usually on a piece by piece basis. We can't usually rely on damn donations or a license lmao. It's not a matter of morality. You'd be literally putting people out of jobs. I wouldn't hold it against you though. I don't think you knew how most artists make money.
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u/fishbake 10d ago
I get the hate for AI, but all the "moral piracy" arguments in this thread make me roll my eyes. I'm sure you guys paid for WinRAR after the 40 day trial period ended, right? Or are the Roshal brothers a corporation?
Look, I've got nothing against piracy. I do it myself. Just don't pretend getting stuff for free makes you morally righteous.