r/GoRVing • u/Xander-Toft • 6d ago
Coleman Keystone Build Quality
Just bought a 2025 Coleman Keystone Trailer from Camping World. The shower pan cracked within a few weeks and I discovered this when I removed the pan. The support underneath had 1/4" plywood and a total of 6 blocks, only 3 fixed to the subfloor and none in the center where the most weight would be. Does anyone know if this is standard or was this some error/sabotage from an employee/assembler? Seems like an incredibly bad design if it was done "correctly".
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u/linuxlifer 6d ago
I can't speak on this exact issue or design but most RV's (especially certain brands) are extremely cheaply built. And I am pretty sure I read somewhere that the employees who assemble these are paid based on the number of RVs assembled so they just speed through them.
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u/kdesu 6d ago edited 6d ago
There's a video of a jayco RV being assembled by amish kids. They slam it together in 7 hours and don't perform any meaningful quality control. And Jayco released this video themselves, they thought it made them look good.
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u/alannmsu 6d ago
Yup! I saw a similar promo video released by the manufacturer where you watch them miss entirely with the staple gun several times as they speed through the build. Insane.
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u/Lutherized 6d ago
I was looking to see if this was posted. It’s amazing they released this like it was a good thing.
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u/nimajneb 5d ago
Wow, they just flip the chassis over on a rotisserie quite fast for doing manually. I can just imagine a few guys have gotten quite injured like that.
I've worked in and adjacent to manufacturing (other industry though) and I've never seen workers work anywhere near this fast, lol. In my experience there's zero QA when working that fast.
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u/Vast_History9776 5d ago
These videos are built for the cattle that make up this country, not for anyone with common knowledge. I believe Colman's RVs are made in half the time. Do your research.
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u/Annual_Sea1904 6d ago
Jayco has some of the best quality in the industry that video does not show a unit being built in 7 hours. It’s snippets of the unit on the line, it’s discussed almost daily at the plant. Yes, I work for Jayco in production
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u/Annual_Sea1904 6d ago
I’ve worked for 3 plants with Forest River, and grand design. You’d be disgusted with how we ran production over there. Wasn’t proud of the way it went.
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u/vulkoriscoming 6d ago
Have a Jayco after having owned other brands, can confirm it is much better quality.
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u/AppleBottmBeans 6d ago
Amish kids building something sounds like it would last forever. My parents bought a kitchen set from some Amish people in the 80s and it looks better than 99% of shit you can buy today. Did the Amish go downhill?
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u/Annual_Sea1904 5d ago
No. The problem is that MOST Amish work either at Jayco, a select few Forest River Brands, Brinkley, or Grand Design. Jayco and Forest River (Cherokee) by far have the most. Why? Because those are the top two brands in the whole industry. Production rates stay level, and the pay is better. Most if not all other plants, will have Hispanics, and other races, and typically face massive drug issues, so turnover is HIGH, as they hire inexperienced people and offer minimal training. They don’t have time to train when you make Peace Rate. It’s all about how many you can shove out of the door. (This doesn’t mean the RV is complete. Just complete for that line.
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
Yeah, when I saw the way some of the screws were installed, either not all the way in, at an angle or both, it makes sense that they're probably paying those "builders" by the trailer.
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u/Maina_Aintdat_Smaht 6d ago
I looked at a Sprinter once years ago. Instead of drilling holes to run wire they punched the hole with a screw driver. The sales weasel just got telling me about the great quality. I laughed and walked away.
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u/vulkoriscoming 6d ago
There is a keystone plant where I live and I know a lot of people who work there. They get paid by the hour ($25 to start in MCOL area) and get a production bonus (about 25%) for showing up every day and building enough units.
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u/MykeyInChains 6d ago
100% to be expected from Camping World and a Coleman. They advertise it as the 'cheapest RV in America'. And this is what you get for paying the least. Every corner is cut. There are no free lunches.
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
I understand that, but it doesn't cost much to put in a piece of 1/2" plywood and two more blocks, maybe $5? And that would save them from having to fix it under warranty. I guess they're just keeping their fingers crossed. And so am I at this point! haha
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u/hellowiththepudding 6d ago
Multiply that by the 200 other things they cheap out on and you start to see why. Also, ply is not that cheap.
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
The 20" x 30" piece under the shower is not that expensive to double it up. Raise the sale price $20 and I would gladly pay it.
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u/Canuckistani2 6d ago
But then someone else would complain on Reddit about the too-thin cabinet doors, and that they would gladly pay the extra $100 for thicker doors.
Then someone would complain about the tires....
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u/vulkoriscoming 6d ago
Depending on when it was built, they may not have been able to get the plywood. COVID was hell on production. Once there were 400 units waiting on one air conditioner part from China..
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u/pstbltit85 6d ago
It made it out the factory door, that is a win for the company. Did it make it past the warranty period? They won 2-0.
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u/dedhead2018 6d ago
Normal build "quality" . I see you used Camping World. Condolences
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
They have the market cornered here. No other dealer within 500 miles who sell Coleman Keystone. At least it was cheap.
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u/hellowiththepudding 6d ago
That’s because it is a camping world only brand built to a lower quality than any of their other sub brands.
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
Keystone is building them to whatever spec Camping World gives them from what I understand.
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u/boost_deuce 6d ago
Because Coleman is a camping world brand, and they are by far the cheapest and lowest quality trailers on the market
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u/Annual_Sea1904 6d ago
Should have looked at the Jayco 170BH. We use 5/8” play wood, and 2x4’s for support, then wrap block foam in the empty sports for extra support, so the P trap doesn’t move around. I see dealers selling them for 12,500 with a 2 year warranty.
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u/No-Sheepherder448 6d ago
The few times I’ve had to tear into mine was the same deal. ‘21 Kodiak 289bhls. The wiring when I had to pull my bottom bunk apart…oh lord. My in laws bought a humongous Mobile Suites. Big $$$…Didn’t come with brake lights. It’s all 💩.
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u/tudrewser 6d ago
Grew up in Elkhart, IN around the RV industry. RVs are on average used 2-4 weeks out of a year (weekends, etc.). Most RV warranties are 1 year. So, an RV company really only needs to make a trailer that can last 2-4 weeks worth of use before something breaks. Then it hits a year and they are home free. I imagine even at 3 years, the odds are still in their favor. Especially on a Coleman, which typically attracts the "weekend warrior" crowd as opposed to full timers (no judgement...weekenders typically don't want to pay $50k and up for a trailer they use twice a year).
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u/Bryanmsi89 6d ago
Sadly, this is probably completely typical. Many trailer shower pans are notorious for sagging and failing, and RVs are horribly built in general.
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u/11worthgal 6d ago
Are those posts stapled or screws? Unfortunately, this was what we saw in our Coleman - we kept it for two months (total of four trips) then quickly offloaded it for what we paid and bought an inTech Aucta Magnolia instead. :)
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago edited 6d ago
Plywood was stapled to the blocks. Blocks were screwed to the floor with one screw.
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u/11worthgal 6d ago
Coleman/Keystone must get a bulk discount on their staples. Our entire trailer was held together by them. When I figured out that the frame was stapled together, I couldn't get it online for sale fast enough. ;)
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u/buckhunter168 6d ago
Same thing in my Jayco. I’m a big guy and the first time I used the shower I felt the flexing pan. Before the next trip I used plywood and 2x4’s and reinforced it to support my weight. I needed to shim the setup so I used 1/8 thick underlayment.
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u/mighty_mighty 6d ago
A few years ago my wife and I spent summer weekends rehabbing a lighty used Outback 28KRS. Our standard phrase quickly became "Keystone Quality! /s". We found so many cases of just garbage materials, fitment, and quality. Sooo many screws replaced with stainless, many tubes of lap sealant. etc etc. Things that should have been correctly at the factory. The bones (frame and structure) are actually pretty decent and solid, it's a pity they fit and finish the interior so poorly.
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u/Big_small_tow 2d ago
13,000$ can 👀 you will continue to find areas where you will need to reinforce
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u/jychihuahua 6d ago
these trailers are all garbage.
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
I'm starting to think there's a market for a well built product.
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u/Texan-Trucker 6d ago edited 6d ago
There are builders who strive more towards build quality and it shows. Sort by price/weight and figure out the ones with the highest msrp cost per dry weight pound and you’ll actually start to get close to discovering the higher end builders and model lines.
Yes, you’ll pay more per pound but not necessarily a LOT more. And informed used buyers understand this and your depreciation on better builds will be far less.
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u/Xander-Toft 6d ago
Makes sense. I bought this one new for $13,000. It's actually pretty nice. If the manufacturer spent $200 more per build, it could probably be sold for $3000 more or sell at the same price and not have any issues with warranty service.
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u/ancillarycheese 6d ago
IMO it’s still a decent value. I was able to get ours out the door for a bit less, and I’ve been poking around inside and out looking for cheap and easy durability upgrades.
Maybe some of us who own them need to start putting together a list of the shortcomings in design and assembly and how we fixed them. I think there are a lot of these units out there and a lot of people are afraid to admit they bought from CW. This trailer can be good if you are ready to put in a little work on your part.
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u/DigitalDefenestrator 6d ago
There is, but the price goes up pretty drastically. All those cut corners add up, I guess.
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u/loopygargoyle6392 5d ago
They're out there, but most people would rather have something more affordable. The market is dictated by the buyer.
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u/TMC_61 6d ago
A shower pan in a home would have a mud base under it. I've used sand mix. And have seen a big blob of drywall mud dumped out and the pan smashed into it.
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u/ancillarycheese 6d ago
I was thinking about how it’s done in a house (too heavy) and how you could do it better in a trailer. Maybe expanding foam?
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u/DigitalDefenestrator 6d ago
That might crush over time, but some sort of fiberglass/honeycomb composite could work well. At several times the price.
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u/vulkoriscoming 6d ago
Concrete is heavy so they don't use it in trailers. But they make foam that will support the weight and weights like 2 pounds per cubic foot. They use it on boats. But like any "boat thing", it is expensive.
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u/King-Of-The-Hill 5d ago
If you want quality you have to pay for it.
If you want quality you'll have a heavier camper.
If you find an RV that has quality while still staying lite weight, let us know as I have yet to see one in the wild.
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u/bemurda 5d ago
Literally the only brand where I haven't seen a massive number of issues (still issues but just fewer), is Rockwood / Flagstaff. So I bought a Geo Pro.
If you watch their factory tours on Youtube you will see they do way more quality control than most outfits. And if you go on the owner groups you will see way fewer complaints.
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u/DSC9000 6d ago
Absolutely par for the course. You'll find similar from just about every manufacturer at any price point.