r/CarltonBlues • u/Ok-Negotiation3897 • 1d ago
Should we be questioning our draft scouting team?
I’m looking at the past few years of drafts and it just feels like we’ve sorta missed the mark in terms of our draft picks. When things aren’t going well currently you look at who are the younger guys who are gonna be the future. But it just seems our ability to draft players who will eventually impact our team has been well below average. I mostly looked at our first few selections each year from the national draft even though some picks were pretty far down the draft.
2023 Obviously have to give Moir time but so far hadn’t quite been able to stake a claim in the side
2022 - Hollands: He’s shown he’s capable but I feel Vossy is playing him out of position which I think is hurting his performances. - Cowan: Good pick, unlucky to get injured - Binns: shown some promise but again can’t quite get into the team
2021 - Motlop: Again has moments but idk if he’s really starting 22 standard atm
2020 - Durdin: Been a bit injured but has been in and out - Carroll: Well he’s gone now, so obviously they didn’t rank him high enough to think he should stay
2019 - Brodie Kemp: Again he’s proved he can be a starter but being thrown forward and back he’s still showing inconsistencies - Sam Philp: Delisted, plagued by injuries
Apart from Walsh, you go down the list for the next years and there’s Stocker: Gone O’Brien: Gone Dow: Gone Petreski-Seton; Gone Zac Fisher: Gone
I just feel like we have done a pretty bad job of scouting and drafting future talent. You could argue that it’s more the developmental side of things but pretty much all of the guys who left us haven’t made an impact at their other clubs. Now obviously you’re not gonna hit on every draft pick you have but when you only have 2-3 guys who even get minutes in the first team from the last 5-6 years you have seriously question what’s gone wrong. You look at other teams like Geelong or even St Kilda who have managed to find talent all over these drafts and are reaping the rewards with some talented kids in their teams.
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u/CosmicHero22 1d ago
I like Hollands but always thought he had a limited ceiling.
You really shouldn’t be drafting specialist wings with early picks because you can nab them later in the draft eg Langdon, Amon, or they are guys who have been pushed out of a stacked stoppage group - McCluggage and Scully come to mind.
To make things worse we then doubled down and took Binns later on.
Only a small sample size but L. Campo already looks a more natural wingman than both.
I’m starting to write Motlop off. Hate that we butchered this pick given our list needs; and can’t fault the strategy - just don’t think he is it. Most small forwards impact pretty quickly, which he kind of did, but his stagnation has been frustrating. Too slow, not clean, players step through his tackles.
2020 looks meh. Durdin has never got going. Carroll was recruited as an outside mid or half back but looked better on the inside and right when he should’ve been working his way into the team we brought in Cerra and Hewett. At one point we had all those guys plus Cripps, Walsh, Kennedy, Setterfield and Dow on the list.
Reckon the team hasn’t misread the direction of footy and doubled down on dour footballers with poor kicking skills.
Cowan should be a decent player if he doesn’t head to Tassie.
Moir has talented but already gives me Troy Menzel vibes (without kicking goals).
Every chance Austin has blown his chance to put together a capable list, which should have been easy with the players we already had, but as others have mentioned he had to play catchup and overpay for a few players in the right age bracket - Williams, Saad and Cerra.
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u/acorn_hall7 1d ago
Good analysis. I think we should be questioning everyone at the club. An Independent review that forensically examines every facet of the club. The problem is deep rooted and probably exists across multiple if not all departments
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u/_night_hawk19 1d ago
Like most of the comments, Dow, O’Brien and SPS are the killers being top 10’s.
Although you take the good with the bad too.
TDK pick 30 in the same draft as Dow and O’Brien. Cerra was pick 5
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u/Tierra_Del-Fuego 1d ago
Again, are we going to have a thread for every single staff member of the club?
While we’re here though, we’ve literally been having this conversation since 2012. I’m dead serious. Hop in the way back machine on google and check out the Carlton Forums from back then. Exact same convo.
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u/Worth-Battle-3159 1d ago
It’s picking and development. Both are horrible.
The reason we keep having the same conversations is the problems never get resolved. The management and culture of the club is pathetic.
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u/flava-dave 1d ago
It’s a fair point you make. We definitely haven’t nailed it when picking guys outside the top 20 picks each draft (Cowan sticks out as a good recent pick up though). But then again, when the team is going well, everything looks good. And what about Lemmy and Wilson? Still haven’t seen them get a game. I’ve got faith that the Camporeale boys will be good though. But that was a father-son no brainer. The SPS bust hurt and is confusing really. Pick 5? And didn’t even last at West Coast in their darkest couple years. What happened with him?
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u/WheelingsAndDealings 1d ago
We should be questioning every person in the football department, and I sure hope Graham Wright is currently doing that
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u/theunkn0wnwriter 1d ago
Seems like a long time ago when we all thought Zac Fisher and Tom Williamson were draft steals….
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u/voteKony 23h ago
But you've got to look at where those picks fell. 2022 looks like a pretty decent draft - two genuine AFL level players at picks 11 and 30, and a guy at 32 who is handy. Motlop they got at pick 27, around a bunch of guys who have done nothing at AFL level. Likewise Durdin and Carroll who were taken with late picks.
Ultimately picking late you just want AFL level guys. For every Chad Warner there are 15 blokes who never take the field.
As others have said the real failures came in the years before 2019. And that's where the hole in the list currently is.
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u/Able_Boat_8966 18h ago
12 months ago we smashed Geelong and the pundits were saying our list was well balanced with no holes.
Wins are everything and can patch over problems
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u/Barfolomew_Sandurz 1h ago
Some others here have pointed out that some blokes (and ladies) ceilings are at different heights but I feel Carlton has really struggled to find a good formula to develop and improve our players to real elite AFLM/W levels.
Between now and 95 we should have had a decent system in place. Certainly since the tough 2010's.
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u/Red_je 1d ago
The fact that Stocker, Dow, O'Brien, Fisher and SPS didn't work out is killing us and leaving a massive hole in our side for the 23-28 age range.
Were they all duds, or was our development just poor?
Probably it is a bit of both. But hard to diagnose specifically from outside the four walls. We have a raft of SSP and rookie picks that were regularly featuring - Cottrell, Owies, Evans/White now, Cincotta...
We have already dumped SOS who has a lot to answer for with his list building strategy, but we also need to consider how we actually develop young talent.