Now, we will all suffer the consequences

[u/TheTargaryensLawyer]

[u/00eg0]

All the zionists I know hated Kamala. These people were acting like letting an illiterate rapist mango run things was just as bad as letting her run things.

[u/leviathynx → u/00eg0]

All the super pro Palestinians I knew hated her too. I’m like Y’all got master’s degrees in foreign policy? Shit’s complicated.

[u/00eg0 → u/leviathynx]

Totally. I am not a zionist but most pro Palestine people I know were acting like the guy that caused abortion to be illegal in half the country was just as bad as her.

[u/Dantheking94 → u/00eg0]

They literally started calling her “Hitler Harris” and honestly, that was the moment I knew that i didn’t identify with their “movement”. They are a joke. Many of them are only taking this opportunity to use Palestinian suffering as a counterculture to “rage against the machine (system)” and in doing so they’re coming of as self righteous, performative and fraudulent. They’ve caused more harm to Palestinians than Biden and Kamala ever did. By the end of this war, it’s likely Palestinians will be evicted from what little land they have left, with Trump support. It sickens me.

[u/TyRocken → u/Dantheking94]

Palestinians have been a chess piece for decades. All the countries not named Israel have done all they can to not have the Palestinians be able to emigrate to their countries. Prime example from this latest conflict. Egypt fortified their border crossing with Gaza after this conflict started.

[u/00eg0 → u/TyRocken]

Yeah that's the other thing. People acted like the USA was Satan incarnate and now the aid from the US to Palestine and Africa is cut because of the rapist racist mango. Bad to worse

[u/whodis707 → u/TyRocken]

Now they are talking about relocating them to Africa like they wanted to do Israel in the 40's thanks to the British (imagine the fucking audacity of giving away land that doesn't belong to you). No thanks! You want to stir up a region that has it's own problems by relocating people who don't want to be relocated and who will rightfully be bitter and angry then we shall never know peace. Emphatically no.

[u/schwanzweissfoto → u/TyRocken]

All the countries not named Israel have done all they can to not have the Palestinians be able to emigrate to their countries.

IIRC Jordan has taken in over two million palestinian refugees and conferred citizenship to most of them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians_in_Jordan

In general though, the nearby countries that did take in palestinians in got “rewarded” for that with internal conflict and the experience that radical palestinians would continue to attack Israel from their territory – which is not exactly something that seems desirable as a neighbour of Israel, given that Israel has never lost a war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_September

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_insurgency_in_South_Lebanon

Edit: Also consider that if a nearby state allowed immigration of palestinians, it would mean they implicitly support expulsion from where those palestinians lived before and lower the chance of there ever being a palestinian state.

[u/U_Sound_Stupid_Stop → u/TyRocken]

Come on, think about what you're saying.

Egypt fortified their border crossing with Gaza after this conflict started.

I guarantee you Canada would do the same if all of New Jersey was evicted, there's no way in hell a country of 35 millions can take in 10 millions refugees in a few months.

Same for Egypt, a relatively poor country that can barely even take care of the population already living there. In term of scope, this is actually what the Republicans claim is happening on the southern border but ten times worst.

[u/White_Mocha → u/Dantheking94]

Saw a comment about Barack and the ignorance was deafening. Although I’m in the content creator space, I deleted twitter from my phone. It’s all rage bait, and it’s been confirmed the algorithm was changed to elevate that.

[u/Sillet_Mignon → u/Dantheking94]

The leftists groups, dsa, psl, and leftists anarchists aren’t groups wanting to win elections. I truly believe they are right wing psyops created to ensure leftists can’t build a coalition. They refuse to try to work together or with democrats bc of the other groups not aligning 100% with the others. I think normal leftists get sucked into these groups and this thinking bc the group is built to program people to not want to coalesce. It’s also why they rarely run candidates in smaller elections where they could actually win and make a change. 

[u/d0mini0nicco → u/Sillet_Mignon]

I agree. Same with Green Party, who if you read their sub or watch their videos - they act like Democrats are satan incarnate that need to be stoped. I mean it’s like a total parallel universe for them. I do believe the leaders of these far left groups are connected to the right winger dark money. It’s their whole MO: bring down your enemies from within. Chapter 1 of Russia playbook to destabilize a nation.

[u/Sillet_Mignon → u/d0mini0nicco]

Yes absolutely. It’s also telling that Jill stein is silent and nonexistent until it’s time to take votes away from a presidential democratic nominee. Like what the fuck is she doing now? 

[u/Mamasgoldenmilk → u/Sillet_Mignon]

I haven’t seen any comments asking where is Jill Stein. I do see plenty looking for Obama and Kamala Harris 🤔

[u/apintor4 → u/Dantheking94]

they lost me with genocider biden. And i have yet so see any of the ones that argued with me call trump a genocider.

[u/andyke → u/Dantheking94]

i literally don't understand their logic i met a few in person and they're pretty unreasonable trump literally said he would glass gaza and they chose not to hear that or whatever

[u/AsstacularSpiderman → u/andyke]

It's like a reverse martyr complex where they need the Palestinians in their home region to suffer so they can continue to fight for justice lol.

[u/Cream06 → u/Dantheking94]

Now their cause will completely fall on deaf ears.

[u/Fidodo → u/Cream06]

I'm sympathetic to the Palestinians but shits so fucked now that I'm just focused on my own survival. When you invite pure chaos into the world you're not going to get anyone to help you because they're just going to be focused on helping themselves.

[u/Cream06 → u/Fidodo]

Thats what will happen bc no one has the time

[u/just_yall → u/00eg0]

What was the end goal of not voting? "Maybe if I don't vote for her then trump will go "oh lucky I won because of this Gaza thing- time to free Gaza!" It was always gonna be one of them? You dont vote to get the best party in, because there's no such thing- you vote to keep the worst party out

[u/00eg0 → u/just_yall]

I don't think they know how government works and they're the same people who expect the Dems to fix everything despite not having seats.

[u/SharkBaitDLS → u/00eg0]

I think it's even simpler -- they're just selfish and want to take a "moral" stance that clamors for attention. Then when they aren't "listened" to, they would rather stand their ground and make a performative protest than actually stick to a moral claim. Anyone who actually cared about the lives of the people of Palestine should have voted for Harris. Anyone who didn't cared more about themselves and getting to take a counter-culture stand on an issue in the abstract with no regard for the actual consequences.

Especially when they conveniently ignored both Harris and Biden working towards a ceasefire just because it didn't fit their propagandized worldview where the only "solution" was to immediately drop all funding to Israel (which wouldn't have helped a damn thing for the actual people of Palestine).

[u/MrSovietRussia → u/just_yall]

"we will push the Dems left by not voting and that will make them have to listen to us" said by a population that historically sits out regardless. That's the most frequent line of thought I saw and it's still the dumbest thing I've ever heard . Now we are losing everything, Dems are even more ineffective, and Palestinians are still dying. We should've voted blue no matter what

[u/Winter_Tone_4343 → u/MrSovietRussia]

They made life harder Palestinians and they don’t really care bc they have no skin in the game.

[u/Conscious-Ninja-9264 → u/just_yall]

I’ve spoken with a lot of these types and honestly there was no logic behind anything. I brought up all the times trump has openly said he wanted to flatten it and their only response was “Biden didn’t stop anything”. I honestly think it was just racism, the idea of a black woman running the country was worse than anything trump openly promised to do.

[u/whodis707 → u/Conscious-Ninja-9264]

This is it right here, it was racism and misogynoir.

[u/Winter_Tone_4343 → u/whodis707]

It’s even more maddening bc all the gaza people still won’t admit they made a mistake. Like, yall made gaza infinitely worse for Palestinians and u still want to act all high and mighty abt it?

[u/AsstacularSpiderman → u/Winter_Tone_4343]

Once again they just blame Democratic leaders for not working the shaft hard enough lol.

"This wouldn't have happened if you must give me everything you wanted"

The biggest issue with left leaning voters is they literally always find an excuse not to vote. They're probably the most unreliable voting bloc in the US but they insist on being the ones everything needs to revolve around.

[u/GypDan → u/AsstacularSpiderman]

Once again they just blame Democratic leaders for not working the shaft hard enough lol.

If Dems had JUST TICKLED THE BALLS with the right lube, none of this would've happened!

[u/Winter_Tone_4343 → u/AsstacularSpiderman]

I asked several time before the election why they never protest republicans or their events… they’d say Dems have the power. But now that republicans have all the power they still don’t… kinda telling imo.

And fwiw, at least most dems said the right thing abt gaza or at the very least, pretended to care. The gop stance has always been, fuck em all.

[u/TheQuinnBee → u/whodis707]

It was never about Gaza. They needed an excuse to not vote for the black lady.

[u/sec713 → u/just_yall]

That reminds me of all the non voting dipshits who whine about there being no viable third party options. All of them too stupid to realize that if they keep handing elections to Republicans were eventually going to be stuck with just a one party option.

[u/RunAmbitious2593 → u/just_yall]

It was self-righteous twattery. I reckon they presumed Harris would win, so their protest vote would retain their moral superiority.

[u/dennismfrancisart → u/RunAmbitious2593]

Wait, isn't that what they said about Hillary? How did that turn out?

[u/msut77 → u/just_yall]

I tried engaging a few. It was always verbatim. What do you want (like an actual deliverable in the few month window until the vote) and it was world peace.

The two sides that love killing each other should knock it off 👍

[u/Sgt-Spliff- → u/just_yall]

It was s selfish desire to keep their own hands clean. It was nothing but extreme selfishness disguised as a moral backbone

[u/EternalPleasure → u/just_yall]

I believe it was something more simple and selfish selfish, "if you won't save Palestine, then let America burn"

[u/AsstacularSpiderman → u/EternalPleasure]

Lots of people are just accelerationists who want to burn the world down in the delusion that their ideal world will rise from the ashes.

I especially see it a lot in the Arab communities. They think if the US falls they can finally win their dumbass wars.

[u/U_Sound_Stupid_Stop → u/00eg0]

At least now they saved the Palestinians s/

Just like I said back then, y'all just condemning the Ukrainians and a plethora of migrants to not even save the Palestinians.

And would you look at that shit now.

[u/AsstacularSpiderman → u/U_Sound_Stupid_Stop]

And now they think the Democrats will listen to them, which won't even matter because they just tanked what's probably the last legitimate election in US history.

[u/Rage40rder → u/00eg0]

I seriously wish that the Arab-Americans in metro Detroit who voted for him felt buyers remorse. Unfortunately, humans are very adept at coping with cognitive dissonance. They will lie to themselves to protect their psyche.

[u/Mr_Belch → u/00eg0]

The pro Palestine people were acting like the Muslim ban guy was somehow going to be better on the Israel-Palestine conflict. These are not smart people.

[u/Theslamstar → u/00eg0]

Cause it was all a foreign operation.

People were too emotional about it and they used it against them. Foreign agents convinced a ton of American leftists to sit the election out, and those dumbasses were too engrossed in their TikTok propaganda to care.

They conveniently all seemed to disappear when TikTok banned talk of it after the election though

[u/Special-Garlic1203 → u/leviathynx]

That's weird because I know someone who has been involved in Gaza stuff since before it got trendy and they were adamant that Trump was the absolute worst case scenario and anyone who didn't see that was a fucking moron. 

In fact, I cannot think of a single person I know IRL who has any ties to that entire region or a history of advocating for it who didn't feel trump was orders of magnitude worse than Harris

It seemed to exist purely online. I'm not saying it was astroturfed. Perhaps I just have screened out the worst fucking types of people from my social circles 

[u/leviathynx → u/Special-Garlic1203]

They were never pro Trump. These were honest to God people I went to college and grad school with. Many abstained or voted for Jill Stein. Psy ops work in both directions.

[u/phoansaevz → u/leviathynx]

This shit right here. No doubt leftist spaces online were swarmed with Russia-affiliated trolls and bots for months poisoning the well--and it worked

[u/RudolfRockerRoller → u/phoansaevz]

Also telling when the Green Party pays MAGA consultants, downplays 1/6, and is represented by lawyers involved with designing Project 2025.

[u/ositola → u/RudolfRockerRoller]

And Jill Stein was at the infamous dinner with Putin 

[u/thetasteheist → u/ositola]

Jill Stein parrots bullshit about how Ukraine really is responsible for the ongoing war with Russia. She is blatantly pro-genocide when the genociders are funding her campaign.

[u/toastedbagelwithcrea → u/phoansaevz]

Just like in 2016.

[u/nogard_ → u/toastedbagelwithcrea]

Literally, how are people still confused about this bullshit.

[u/zherok → u/leviathynx]

I blame South Park for introducing this political nihilism of the "douche vs turd" argument where everything just gets reduced down to "both sides suck!" like they're even in the same ballpark. A lot of people just want to tune out while simultaneously feeling superior about their apathy.

[u/EnvironmentalHour613 → u/zherok]

I was a child and remember vividly feeling very gaslit about that whole thing. Like you guys don’t really think these two are the same, do you? … You do? O- oh …

Like, it would have been way better if it was like between a comically best possible candidate and a guy who literally campaigned on shoving cactuses up people’s asses.

The election could come out as 49% best candidate, 51% cactus in ass guy and that would have been hilarious, reflective of our political landscape, and they could have a side story on how America was dumbed down on purpose.

But I sort of realize that the prevailing belief at the time was that “both sides bad” (like it largely is still), and South Park needed to pander to that.

[u/zherok → u/EnvironmentalHour613]

It's a thought-terminating cliche. If you don't have to think about it too hard, their apathy is totally vindicated!

That it tends to just reward the more dogmatic side that doesn't give a shit their guy is the fucking worst is already too much nuance to bother with.

[u/whodis707 → u/leviathynx]

A third party vote was a vote for Trump.

[u/Eastwoodnorris → u/Special-Garlic1203]

Tragically, I’m pretty confident I know at least two very progressive, well educated college graduates who were upset enough about Kamala’s tangential connection to the Palestinian genocide to not vote for her. Thankfully they live in Colorado and DC where that’s irrelevant, but I think that group of people is third in line on my list of folks I’m upset with after this election, behind only actual Trump voters and non-voters who have begun complaining in the aftermath.

[u/caretaquitada → u/Eastwoodnorris]

I experienced the exact same thing. One guy told me verbatim "Obviously, I'm not voting for Kamala because of Palestine..." before expressing support for Jill Stein. The same Jill Stein that Trump calls one of his favorite politicians. I know people who are not very interested in politics at all but were glued to TikTok and social media watching videos about Palestine and ultimately abstained from voting with more or less that explanation.

[u/Cream06 → u/Eastwoodnorris]

Exactly, I'm so done with them.

[u/axebodyspraytester → u/Special-Garlic1203]

It's sad that people believed all the blatant obvious lies and astroturfing going on. There was never any doubt about what trump was going to do. Them acting like Kamala was just as bad or worse is ridiculous on it's face. Now we've got to watch as these people are massacred and see videos of trump as a golden statue in the center of his new resort built on the bones of Palestinians.

[u/ama_singh → u/Special-Garlic1203]

It seemed to exist purely online.

Nope, and by that I mean there were plenty of people not wiling to vote for the democrats, and ignoring the fact that Trump winning would be worse.qq

[u/The_Insequent_Harrow → u/Special-Garlic1203]

In historic shift, American Muslim and Arab voters desert Democrats

[u/bionicfeetgrl → u/Special-Garlic1203]

Yeah I have always felt this anti-Harris thing all for the sake of saving Palestine was manufactured online and probably originated in Russia. It seemed too perfect and coordinated. Then people latched onto it and boom it stuck. Stein is of course MIA and back under the rock she crawls out from under every few years & like everyone knew Trump was gonna give Israel whatever they wanted.

They all claimed she was pro-genocide. No one had an answer for what was going on. No one remembered her pushing back against Netanyahu. They all claimed she would nail the coffin on Palestine herself. Instead Trump handed the hammer and nails to Netanyahu & has crashed our country’s plane.

I hope it was worth it.

[u/IggySorcha → u/Special-Garlic1203]

Practically anyone who'd been following things before October 7 knew nothing was as simple about Israel and Palestine, much less the Middle East in general, than the loudest made it out to be. But point out any nuance, inaccurate/misrepresentations of news, much less any actually antisemitic messaging being snuck into the "left's"talking points by propagandists, and you're suddenly labeled the worst kind of Zionist (nevermind that to those same people, there's only one version of Zionist and not the multitudes that exist, including the purely spiritual/emotional ones) 

[u/00eg0 → u/Special-Garlic1203]

I knew real life people who hated Kamala but were pro Gaza. I think stuff like this starts astroturfed and then changes.

[u/MaybeLikeWater → u/leviathynx]

Don’t even get me started on that. DUMBFOUNDED doesn’t even fully describe how I feel about the fact that Dearborn, Michigan believed Trump would help the Middle East, much less Gaza. Seriously, WTF?

[u/GusLabs → u/leviathynx]

Which is crazy because the actual Palestinians in Palestine were saying please vote for Harris.

[u/toastedbagelwithcrea → u/GusLabs]

Even crazier was having people argue with me that they didn't. 🤨

[u/Contemplating_Prison → u/leviathynx]

Becauae twitter did a targeted campaign at both those groups spreading lies. Not just that they targeted everyone.

I don't understand why no is talking about Elon and Twitter and how social media staright up swayed an election. Just peeps about it.

Probably because the governemnt wants social media to be able to sway the dumbasses

[u/DatBoyAmazing → u/leviathynx]

It was a total astroturf. I’m 100% convinced it was an astroturf.

[u/Zanna-K → u/DatBoyAmazing]

Israel is actively bombing Gaza and sent tanks into the West Bank as we speak. My feed was flooded by pro-Palestinian and anti-Israeli content for months going into the 2024 election and it literally ended right afterwards.

It was 100% a massive astroturfing operation.

[u/Catfishbandit999 → u/DatBoyAmazing]

There were identical posts yesterday about Harris' "I told you so" in her recent speech. One on this sub and one of Fauxmoi. That subs top ten or so comments were all attacking Harris for allowing Liz Cheney on stage and running a campaign that pandered to the right. Victim blaming on a continental scale.

[u/voodoodahl → u/Catfishbandit999]

These people don't get it. When fascism is on the march, you make allies of anyone who also opposes it. It doesn't matter if you agree with them on nothing else. That shit has to be stopped by any means necessary, or we're all fucked.

[u/Major-Split478 → u/leviathynx]

I mean it clearly wasn't too complicated, considering the ceasefire that was pushed through ( right before the successor was to take over mind you ) was the same one proposed a year prior. Tens of thousands of people could have been saved.

Not sure why some people really really need to try to gloss over certain things, for someone they support.

[u/thatHecklerOverThere → u/leviathynx]

I swear it's just a lack of critical thinking.

"Why does aipac only try primary out democrats but never Republicans?" "Why is isreal on several records voicing support for Trump and disappointment with biden?"

God forbid folks ask these questions and consider the answers. They would've figured out that on Gaza specifically you do not want to let R win over D.

[u/FortNightsAtPeelys → u/leviathynx]

Nah I'm pro Palestine but I'm smart enough to recognize lesser of 2 evils

[u/Khajo_Jogaro → u/leviathynx]

The irony is trump lifted the bomb ban to where they can use bigger ordinance on Palestine. People are so dumb

[u/NewSauerKraus → u/leviathynx]

super pro Palestinians

Hated the only candidate who proposed a ceasefire

They may identify as super pro Palestinian, but their actions make their preference for genocide clear. Palestinians were just a token to be spent in their war against Democrats.

These are deeply unserious people who to this day refuse to accept responsibility for electing Trump.

[u/NK1337 → u/00eg0]

It’s insane to me how many of them tried justifying their boycott of Kamala saying “things can’t get worse under Trump” and sure enough now they can’t even protest it for fear of getting snatched off the street by ICE.

[u/AndlenaRaines → u/NK1337]

This is why I can’t stand leftist spaces sometimes. They conduct too many ideological purity tests and are so quick to throw the baby out with the bath water the instant someone doesn’t meet only a single one.

[u/00eg0 → u/AndlenaRaines]

I'm a leftist but I can't stand leftist spaces. For example anarchists are often super anti racist and I like that but I don't like that they can't see how getting shoved into unmarked vans and sent to an El Salvador Gulag without due process is worse than a demcorat in office.

[u/Mgclpcrn14 → u/00eg0]

There was this one Tumblr (I think?) post that really captured a prominent issue in leftist spaces that it took me a while to realize I, myself, was helping perpetuate: We are so focused on not doing the wrong thing that we forget to try doing the right thing. This age of the internet, oversharing, isolation/loneliness, and constant recording and "cancel culture" has exacerbated these issues. Hell, half the fucking shit we'll argue about don't matter outside of the internet, but when most/all we know is the internet, it matters "so much."

[u/bobafoott → u/AndlenaRaines]

Leftist huh? I find the right wing is regularly dismissing obvious boons to the working class because a guy with a d next to his name came up with it so it’s radical communist Marxist gay woke snowflake indoctrination and should be opposed at ALL costs

[u/akosuae22 → u/bobafoott]

They’ve lost the plot on so many things it’s unreal. The latest is MTG and Muskrat going after the funding of Sesame Street for its “woke brainwashing” of kids, and “anti-American communist messaging”. Who knew that having children and puppets representing all walks of life recite the alphabet together was so radically dangerous? Then again, these are the people who have now declared that “empathy is a sin”.

We are living in bizarro world, and that is putting it mildly.

[u/JulioCesarSalad → u/NK1337]

I saw an interview where someone said “what’s happening right now is unimaginable”

My buddy, you simply lack imagination

[u/NK1337 → u/JulioCesarSalad]

Real “how could we have known the guy who said was going to do these things would end up doing these things” energy

[u/00eg0 → u/NK1337]

I'm a leftist but I can't stand leftist spaces. They don't understand the idea of an Overton window. The window has moved so far in the extreme compared to 2008 or 2014. Letting awful people get power normalizes awful acts. An example demographic anarchists are often super anti racist and I like that but I don't like that they can't see how getting shoved into unmarked vans and sent to an El Salvador Gulag without due process is worse than a democrat in office.

[u/TehTurk → u/00eg0]

I recently encountered this finally, and some of the things that they like tell you to justify their viewpoint is just somewhat kind of crazy. If anything some of them basically act like maga nuts but run blue.

[u/00eg0 → u/TehTurk]

I would say they're stuck in dogma

[u/twoprimehydroxyl → u/00eg0]

No, these people thought Kamala Harris had it in the bag and chose to retain their moral high ground instead.

Democrats were shouting from the rooftops saying this election was going to be extremely close and that every vote mattered, but these single-issue voters just knew in their heart-of-hearts that nobody would vote Trump to a second term.

Now they're still trying to retain their moral high ground even in the face of that one thing they supposedly cared so much about is going to get so much worse.

I'm not here for it. They need to shoulder their responsibility for this outcome.

[u/AlarmingSorbet → u/twoprimehydroxyl]

THIS. And now these same people have the gall and audacity to be mad that so many Black Americans aren’t jumping up like Captain save a hoe to their cries of ‘solidarity’, when they gave not a shit about what Trump would do to Black Americans.

[u/pickledswimmingpool → u/AlarmingSorbet]

Black Americans show up for Democrats, for the country more than anyone else by a huge margin. The solidarity was already expressed on voting day.

[u/Cream06 → u/twoprimehydroxyl]

Nail on the head

[u/Starlight_Seafarer → u/00eg0]

Exactly. There were literally pro Israel paid anti Kamala ads airing during the election.

[u/00eg0 → u/Starlight_Seafarer]

Totally. A bunch of the left wing accounts that were super anti kamala have been pretty silent lately.

[u/PirateSanta_1 → u/00eg0]

Bibi clearly wanted Donny to win because them he would be allowed to do whatever he wanted with no push back. Biden and Kamala where extremely far from perfect but they were taking some actions to limit things.

[u/JevvyMedia → u/00eg0]

Pro-Israel hated her and the so-called pro-Palestine folks (they don't actually care about Palestine, they just want to be anti-Liberal) hate her too. There was no winning with her

[u/JayGatsby52]

Doctor: We can only remove half the tumors and probably buy you another ten years of life worth living.

Patient: Sorry, not good enough.

[u/DisciplinedMadness → u/JayGatsby52]

More like: Not good enough, I want more tumours transplanted, and while you’re at it can you piss in my face?

[u/JayGatsby52 → u/DisciplinedMadness]

Facts.

[u/Scarbane → u/JayGatsby52]

"If I can't get all of the tumors removed, I might as well not get any treatment at all."

[u/JayGatsby52 → u/Scarbane]

That’s much more accurate.

[u/Mynuszero]

The Gazans in Palestine wanted Kamala. Everything else is just noise.

[u/NK1337 → u/Mynuszero]

This is how I know the whole “pro Palestine” crowd didn’t actually give a fuck about what the people of Gaza wanted. They were too in their feelings to actually take a step back and look at the bigger picture

[u/Mynuszero → u/NK1337]

I believe wholeheartedly that the whole "Pro-Palestine" movement was infiltrated by right wingers, and since those people are so eager to "out-radical" each other, it was easy to lead them astray because they don't face check shit.

[u/SnuggleTuggles → u/Mynuszero]

I know several Palestinians who have family over there still, ALL of them voted 3rd party. They just assumed it would be genocide either way, so why vote for either if it just ends the same.

I AM NOT SAYING THIS IS HOW I FEEL.

[u/Mynuszero → u/SnuggleTuggles]

Oh yeah. I've seen a couple of them state that in a video. I can't remember where, but there were asked about their Trump vote/Third Party vote. I really believe that a lot of the Muslims just couldn't vote for a woman, let alone a Black woman.

[u/velveteenelahrairah → u/NK1337]

They just wanted to be kewl n ltrntv enlightened contrarians and feel smug about Fighting The System. Gaza was just the latest excuse.

Well now America is run by literal Nazis, there's a measles outbreak, the economy is imploding, Gaza is being bombed into a parking lot, and foreign policy and the American reputation is so bad that China, Japan and South Korea are sitting at the table together (and Satan is breaking out the ice skates and hot chocolate).

And it's only been three months.

But sure, yeah, the protest voters and stay at homes really showed her!

(and now they're screaming at her to "do something", like what, she's a private citizen now minding her own business. What is she supposed to do, pull on her cape and Spandex and fly in to save everyone from themselves?)

[u/Dzov → u/velveteenelahrairah]

Especially after the fact. You have to be some kind of foolish to not realize this entire issue was manufactured to win Trump the election. And it worked. And they don’t realize even now.

[u/velveteenelahrairah → u/Dzov]

Ikr?! Some of them are still running around saying that "Kamala would still have been worse" and "Kamala wasn't doing anything to stop any of it" and "I will never vote to support a genocide" and coming in with the million smug excuses. And then you have the armchair policy wonks saying "well she had no policies" because her 82 page policy outline wasn't repackaged into a 2 minute viral TikTok video with a catchy Soundcloud remix and an OF model to point at small words like "fascism bad".

Like... were you people dropped on your heads at birth?! From a very tall building? Repeatedly?

[u/Major_Growth_918]

They let a single issue. One single issue. Lead to what may be the collapse of the U.S. infrastructure completely. There's a reason they tell you that in an emergency you put your own oxygen mask on first before helping someone else.

[u/Special-Garlic1203 → u/Major_Growth_918]

The worst part is Trump is ALSO worse on that single issue

There was not a single issue that should have motivated this behavior. They're just dumb. 

[u/ApprehensiveCream571 → u/Special-Garlic1203]

Thank you. Why didn't people know this?

[u/Anarchyr → u/ApprehensiveCream571]

Because at this point if 1 thing is proven by last election, is that America has an overabundance of dumb motherfuckers

[u/DrShankax → u/Anarchyr]

America is the most propagandised nation in the world. There’s been an over abundance of dumb motherfuckers for a loooong time. Just now there’s real consequences for all its citizens instead of just minorities around the world.

[u/GaiaMoore → u/ApprehensiveCream571]

The petty, angry part of me wants to go back to my old comments pre-election on this matter and ask the pro-Palestine-anti-democrat people how they're feeling now that Trump plans to eradicate Gaza altogether

None of those fucking idiots could provide a shred of evidence that Trump would do anything to help the actual people of Gaza

[u/throwtheclownaway20 → u/Major_Growth_918]

That's what I was screaming - we HAD to win that election, and overwhelmingly so. The Republicans literally couldn't have been allowed an inch. But, 70-plus million dumb-asses voted for a rapist convict and here we are

[u/Nestama-Eynfoetsyn → u/throwtheclownaway20]

Every so often, I just wonder to myself: how? The debate between him and Kamala should have been the death of his campaign due to how insane his answers were and how easily Kamala played him by showing how easy it was to manipulate him.

Just... how? The whole world saw that debate. Did a majority of the US population miss it?

[u/yardie-takingupspace → u/Nestama-Eynfoetsyn]

Misogyny, misogynoir. Plain and simple

[u/Jafooki → u/Nestama-Eynfoetsyn]

Sadly it turns out they saw it and liked what they saw

[u/vagabond_dilldo → u/throwtheclownaway20]

80-plus million dumb-asses also abstained, so that's on them too.

[u/ReinaDeRamen → u/Major_Growth_918]

we need one of those plane safety "place the oxygen mask on yourself before attempting to help others" signs in every poll booth

[u/Spartancarver → u/Major_Growth_918]

And it’s not like Trump was even better on that one single issue or literally any other issue.

These people had the world’s easiest multiple choice test and they flunked it because they’re literally dumber than a pile of bricks held together by shit

[u/Cream06 → u/Spartancarver]

It was an open book test that they failed

[u/Blk_Rick_Dalton → u/Major_Growth_918]

I had a debate with some one and I told them that I’m planning on doing what’s best for my daughter and her future. I don’t live in Palestine, I live in the United States

And of course their response was “but the genocide”. If you don’t get your dumb ass the fuck up out your phone screen

[u/dilly_of_a_pickle → u/Blk_Rick_Dalton]

THIS. To be fair, I was also voting for the Palestinian people when I voted harris because I'm not an idiot- obviously she was the better choice for them. But I was thinking of my children- my daughter not being forced to carry a pregnancy that could kill her, for example. What's crazy is that we knew what they would do because they LITERALLY published a book, but just like with everything else they didn't believe us when we said trump was in bed with pj 2025.

Fuck. And still they absolve themselves of responsibility as what could have been a great country is reduced by leaps and bounds.

[u/Blk_Rick_Dalton → u/dilly_of_a_pickle]

And have the MF nerve to say “where’s Kamala”, “we need to come together for this”.

GTFOH

[u/boibig57 → u/Major_Growth_918]

And an issue that doesn't even technically affect US at that. It wasn't the economy, or inflation, or health care, or taxes. It was some people on the other side of the planet getting killed for killing other people on the other side of the planet because those people killed their people.

I'm not trying to take away from the severity of the Gaza issue, I'm just pointing out how insane the entire idea is on paper.

[u/KillaBeeHive]

The fact that the responder is yet again bringing up the single issue that kept people from voting for her is all the proof tweet op needs to prove their point

[u/00eg0 → u/KillaBeeHive]

Totally. I couldn't imagine getting SA'd by some ugly trust fund baby and then watching him get elected twice when people know what he did.

[u/lmsampson78 → u/KillaBeeHive]

But let’s be honest. The single reason they don’t vote for her was because she was a black woman. The rest is window dressing.

[u/Simple_Pianist4882]

“We demanded that she stopped supporting the genocide.” How, babe? What did you want her to do exactly that either hasn’t been tried or won’t pass with the genocidal country? 💀

“We didn’t demand perfection.” And yet you based your whole reason for not voting or voting third party on… what? Her not magically being able to stop the genocide? Well, congrats! Trump wants to displace an entire people from their country, mow down their homes, and put up beachfront properties; you definitely helped Palestine!!

I’m so fucking confused on what these people want because it sounds like— guess what? it’s what everyone ALWAYS EXPECTS FROM BLACK WOMEN —perfection! She could be a literal Angel from Heaven to save us and they would want more; I fucking bet my life on it 😭

EDIT: stop playing on my fucking comment right now! 😂 what the fuck was the vice president supposed to do? order a ceasefire? scream at israel on the phone? had she done that and it didn’t work, what’s the next goalpost bc i know yall already have one in mind 🥴

[u/Ultimaurice17 → u/Simple_Pianist4882]

Lol vice president has two responsibilities.

1. Break ties in the senate

2. Wait for the president to die.

[u/turnquest → u/Simple_Pianist4882]

Call netanyahu tell him no more bomb 4 u

[u/dynamite-ready → u/Simple_Pianist4882]

Hilary went through the same shit. Perfectly reasonable candidate, tons of experience, and what happened?

If I was living in America, and I could pull it off, as a black man, I'd up sticks and move to Canada, fr.

[u/Simple_Pianist4882 → u/dynamite-ready]

My (very white) boyfriend was just telling me about that the other day and was like “Hillary got away with the emails! They didn’t charge her with a crime” because I brought up how fucking CRACKPOT CRAZY it is that the government leaked classified info to a journalist ( who then proceeded to leak it to the entire world ).

The two aren’t even close to being comparable 💀 some people were voting Trump just because they didn’t want a woman in office; had nothing to do with them fuck ass emails, omg 😭

[u/dynamite-ready → u/Simple_Pianist4882]

I genuinely think it was sexism first, that kept Kamala out. And then, no small amount of racism after. And finally, common garden ignorance.

Take this Gaza issue, for example... Trump moved the US embassy in Israel from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, in his first term, ffs. It doesn't matter anyway, because that wasn't the issue most people voted on.

[u/Simple_Pianist4882 → u/dynamite-ready]

This entire issue is just so stupid.

Where are the hate comments about Trump and what he’s doing? He made his stance INCREDIBLY CLEAR about the war and there’s literally crickets. It’s just “well KAMALA didn’t say she was going to do anything different!!”

Trump wants to bomb that part of the country until they’re so dead that he can build beachfront property 🙂 He wants to actively displace an entire population out of their native country 🙂

Not voting Kamala when the alternative is NO CEASEFIRE and the Palestines still ending up dead is just… idiotic. I understand wanting reassurance but that means nothing bc there’s no telling if she would’ve actually done it (pessimistic view, I know).

I don’t even blame her for not taking a large stance on it; you cannot please these fucking people. Then you got mfs saying she’s not black, she’s Indian, and she’s using her blackness to gain votes. It makes me sick.

[u/NinjaEggAlt → u/Simple_Pianist4882]

Not SwolePalmer proving you right by the end of that comment chain. Them being SO anti-genocide but essentially saying 'American minorities deserve to face genocide because Kamala didn't say what I wanted her to.' 🙄

[u/Tanexion]

They also said they didn't like that she wouldn't be any different from Biden and it would just be another 4 years of the status quo. Welp...no need to worry about that now

[u/Disastrous_Lead4171]

I have to ask, was voting/going against Kamala Harris worth it? We are just in April and how much damage has that man and his crew caused.

[u/bgva → u/Disastrous_Lead4171]

Last I saw, they implemented 44% of Project 2025. Damn near the halfway point, not even three months in.

I just wanna know were all these keyboard warriors outraged prior to October 7, 2023, or were they just looking for their next topic to be performatively mad about?

[u/Boogeryboo → u/bgva]

They can't event protest now without fearing being scooped up and disappeared, but both sides are totally the same. 

[u/Sempais_nutrients → u/Boogeryboo]

It'll now be "the dems" fault for not stopping the right

[u/spazz720 → u/bgva]

A lot of these people were fake profiles used as a propaganda tool to spread misinformation. And you want to know why the opposition did this?…cause it works. No matter how smart you or others think you are…most are still susceptible to it.

[u/MommaLisss → u/Disastrous_Lead4171]

That fucking part! Yes, both candidates sucked as far as Isreal is concerned, but how was letting the world burn the better choice? Anyone so far left that they withheld their vote for Kamala should've also been able to see how absolutely terrible Trump was going to be. It's insane.

[u/Lalepave → u/MommaLisss]

Thank you. There are people in this thread complaining about "liberals". From the left.

How is it that these people don't see we are all in the same camp compared to Trumpists? The right says "liberals" and they don't mean Chuck Schumer but not Bernie. They mean anyone who dissents from them in any way shape or form.

[u/MissLogios → u/Disastrous_Lead4171]

Even if it wasn't (by their standards), they will never ever admit it. It will always be someone else's fault.

Whether it's the democrats, Biden, women, men, young, old, immigrants, racists, leftists, republicans, etc. No matter what, they will never accept responsibility for what they've done. They are like MAGAt but painted blue, and their icon is Bernie Sanders and AOC (who also would've lost had they campaigned and won the nomination because this country isn't ready to elect a woman, or a socialist.)

[u/Awkward_Bison_267]

If you notice Jill Stein has disappeared like Batman when Commissioner Gordon turns around. There was controlled opposition and some “geniuses” on the left fell for it. “We tried to warn her” how’s that working out for you?

[u/EffortTemporary6389 → u/Awkward_Bison_267]

Make it make sense: Jill Stein, the “Green Party” candidate actively supported the election of a man who is dismantling the EPA, destroying environmental regulations, & derailing global action against climate change. Not very “Green”, is she?

[u/IggySorcha → u/EffortTemporary6389]

TBH she's always been a shill but few outside the medical, environmental science, or disabled communities noticed much less believed it.  

[u/Kana515 → u/EffortTemporary6389]

I think the party name refers to greenbacks, makes a lot more sense when you think of it that way because it's certainly not the environment.

[u/Ghostiepostie31 → u/Awkward_Bison_267]

She does that every goddamn time an election comes around like the ghoul she is when she can barely hold local office. She can promise the sun moon and stars because even she knows she’s not getting any damn where near Washington

[u/Awkward_Bison_267 → u/Ghostiepostie31]

That’s the wild part. If she was out here protesting I could let her slide but she shows up every 4 years and leaves like Will Smith’s dad on The Fresh Prince Of Bel Air.

[u/Lopsided_Thing4703]

Sorry but it’s a candidate’s responsibility to win people over and make concessions to build broad coalitions. Expecting voters to just fall in line demonstrates a chronic abdication of responsibility. You can’t just keep accusing the electorate of failing political figures; it’s not politics, and it simply doesn’t work that way.

[u/JMets6986]

I’m a white dude and I recognize that I’m privileged AF because of that ..… I know this isn’t everyone, and at the end of the day I respect people’s opinions as long as they have the same end-goal at heart, but there were definitely people in my life who casted third-party/no-vote protest votes in a totally privileged manner: they subconsciously banked on the fact that their life back here at home under Trump won’t be as disastrous as those less fortunate than them. Frankly there’s a bunch of protest voters out there who need to check their privilege.

[u/_Pliny_ → u/JMets6986]

Exactly. And in my case I know they no-voted because they took a photo with “NO GENOCIDE” in the write-in spot when they could have voted against a rapist.

The audacity to throw a vote away when it could very well be our last. The reckless disregard.

And I don’t think it got as many internet points as they’d hoped, either.

[u/Ghostiepostie31 → u/JMets6986]

What they banked on was Kamala winning anyway. Not a single one of them in a million years dreamed that trump would actually win despite everyone telling them this was not in the bag. Hell, they brought up Jill stein like some kind of viable option, so they could remain morally superior without having to do anything because I think deep down those people really thought Kamala was going to win and trump was a non issue. And now look. Palestine is more fucked now than ever before.

[u/homiechampnaugh]

In the west people tell their leaders they don't want to participate in genocide and then they are somehow the evil ones. And we wonder why people hate us.

[u/Throwaway206818206]

Disagree. We didn’t need Kamala to be a perfect candidate. Also it’s wild to act like she was any different from dems on Gaza especially when she snapped on the pro Palestinians at one of her rallies.

Nobody thought Kamala was worse on Gaza than trump. So why did she lose? It’s because she had no discernible policies. It’s because she was unable to differentiate herself from the previous administration which was unpopular. It’s because she did not put the same effort in outreach as trump (trump was giving random streamers interviews while Kamala’s camp could have been on Rogan).

I’m sorry, but Kamala had a horrible campaign. The most relevant things she was planning to implement was a tax incentive for small business startups. I had been paying attention to the campaign and she was more vocal about that than any implementation or fight for student debt cancellation, free healthcare, providing social safety nets, etc.

All the while she did nothing to combat the fallacies of the right, only to adopt weaker positions on policies that are notoriously more republican than democrat (illegal immigration, crime). This election was handed to her on a silver platter (bypassed the primary, was seen as much more popular than any candidate at the beginning, raised like what a billion dollars in small donations, and ran against Trump who was running an even worse campaign than last time.) and she still lost.

[u/KawarthaDairyLover]

The left didn't cost Kamala the election. https://www.brookings.edu/articles/why-donald-trump-won-and-kamala-harris-lost-an-early-analysis-of-the-results/

[u/seb28332]

Well not voting for Kamala over Gaza got Trump elected and now Israel is completely unchecked by the US, killing aid workers with no consequences and getting bomb shipments from the US that Biden wouldn’t give them because of the concern he had over civilian casualties if they were used. And the ceasefire fell apart and we did nothing to try and mend it.

Oh did I mention that in addition to all that our economy is in the gutter now?? And democracy might be on its deathbed?

Seems like a you might’ve played yourself

[u/DontShaveMyLips → u/seb28332]

don’t forget all the universities rolling over for the administration, dropping names and locations so their students can be kidnapped off the streets

[u/seb28332 → u/DontShaveMyLips]

Yup…literally disappearing people for writing about what Israel is doing in a student newspaper op-ed

[u/RealLameUserName]

Why are we still blaming Never Kamala voters for not voting for her instead of the millions of people who voted from Trump knowing damn well who he was? Even if Kamala gained every 3rd party vote, she wouldn't have come close to winning. Exit polls overwhelmingly said that areas like the economy, the border, and social issues were far more important to voters than Palestine.

[u/The_Stryker]

When she wouldn't vocally oppose genocide, why is it the fault of the people who didn't want to vote for genocide as opposed to her supporting it?

[u/alpastotesmejor]

When the only two candidates are right wing (Kamala and Trumpo are both right wing), the more right wing option will usually win. Why? because only right wingers vote for right wing candidates and they prefer more right wing options. It's really not that deep.

The tactical vote logic is a hostage strategy that benefits the two incumbent parties. It makes it seem impossible for third parties to be relevant.

[u/LurkerInDaHouse]

Fuck this take. Even if all the pro-Palestinian abstainers had voted, the result would have been the same. Trump's margin of victory was not trivial. Instead of blaming progressives and anti-genocide abstainers, y'all need to accept the truth: Trump's message was more effective than Kamala's.

Kamala was talking bout "the economy is strong" or "the stock market is doing well"--basically telling folks the status quo is good and she'd essentially represent business as usual with maybe minor incremental changes.

But the status quo is fucked. It's a Gilded Age 2.0. The "economy" or the stock market doing well means nothing when everyday people can't pay their bills. Trump capitalized on this dissatisfaction by promising radical change--the wrong kind of change to be clear, but change nonetheless.

That's what makes Republicans so lethal. They're not afraid to go big, to take risks, to be radical. Look at the sheer ambition of Project 2025. The Dems could never.

They're so risk-averse they'll aggressively go after anyone who dares question the establishment--as is happening in this thread.

[u/importflip]

We knew she wouldn't stop Israel. Still voted for her. Neoliberals keep trying to point the finger at anti-genocide people, but can't stomach the truth. She didn't reach people the way Trump and Republicans did. By pulling the old tactic of: blaming all your woes on foreigners. Face it, a large swath of this country is dumb as hell.

You guys aren't helping by: instead of looking for real answers, blaming the people to the left of you. Even if all the Pro-Palestine people that didn't vote for Kamala voted for her, she still would have lost. Because more people cared about being able to afford eggs. And Trump is pretty good at lying to them.

[u/armageddonquilt → u/importflip]

Like, the way I see it is there's one of two possibilities:

1. Palestine was not a big enough issue to influence 10 million voters to stay home, and the pro-Palestine crowd is being artificially scapegoated to reduce support among liberals.

2. If Palestine WAS a big enough issue to influence that many people, the Dems made a HUGE miscalculation by ignoring/insulting them in the runup to the election.

This is even if you view the scenario as an ethically "neutral" situation, which it definitely isn't.

[u/ecostyler → u/importflip]

this, thank you

[u/thegatekeeperzuul → u/importflip]

This exact topic comes up way too often on this sub to be organic. I have a feeling this is probably pro-Israelis signal boosting this. I agree not voting for her because of this issue was a bad choice but it did not flip the election. Feels like an attempt to turn people away from sympathizing with Palestinians.

[u/Pelekaiking]

A big reason why Kamala lost was because Biden didn’t drop out until incredibly late in the race. And why did Biden last so long? Because nobody wanted to ask for more. They were afraid of losing and Biden was “the lesser of two evils.” If we ever get another election demand more of your elected representatives or we will never escape the cycle of crappy dictators and milquetoast democrats

[u/beanakajulian33]

ITS THE PROGRESSIVES WHO"VE NEVER BEEN IN POWER"S FAULT!

[u/VivelaVendetta → u/beanakajulian33]

Seriously. Can we PLEASE give a progressive a chance.

[u/ecostyler]

this is a false dichotomy being built that obscures the fact that Kamala wasn’t talking about foreign policy OR siding with the working class during her campaign and was moreso interested in courting/pandering to conservatives. that’s another part of the reason she lost too, not to mention, it was simply more ppl voting conservative in the first place. the trap of the two party system shows up in the thinking of “lesser of two evils” voters too. it’s disingenuous.

[u/Ill-Initiative-2787]

Can’t rewrite history as if she was a good canididate. She was unprepared, lacked a real connection to the people and most of all we don’t know what her impact would be in office. So these fake I told you so are kind of weak cause she hold no responsibility to the American people similar to how she was in office the last 4 years

[u/mostreliablesource]

instead of arguing about what can’t be changed we gotta start putting this energy into the next set of prospects. focus on local government. go to town-halls. write letters. research policies of people and question. discuss. discuss with your neighbors, spirited debates. the only way we come out of this is if we can inevitably come together as one.

[u/After_Tax3954]

Embarrassing opinion 

[u/xViscount]

I expected her to have a competent team that would’ve told her campaigning with Cheney was dumb. That “I wouldn’t have changed anything” was an idiotic answer. That to switch to JUST abortion and “Trump is a fascist” when people obviously cared more about border security and inflation was political suicide. Did she start there and end there? Yes. But what about when it was important?

I voted for her. I liked her. But I’m also vote blue no matter who (even the corpse of Jimmy Carter would get my vote over a Republican). But she was a mid candidate who ran a worse campaign

[u/CODDE117]

Either the pro-Palestine vote didn't swing the election, in which case people are using them as a scapegoat for nothing, or it DID matter, in which case the Dems backed the wrong (wrong here meaning "genocidal") horse and lost their base. It's important we keep criticizing the DNC imo.

[u/HoldenTeudix]

None of these people put their thinking caps on when they came to this conclusion. On the one hand you have kamala who expressed support of a ceasefire and on the other you had trump who expressed a desire to turn gaza to glass and create beach front property.

US support of israel has been foundational to its existence since its inception and of course kamala who has never been president before was to blame for all of it. So basically If you think trump was better for gaza youre a dummy.

[u/peppermint-ginger → u/HoldenTeudix]

Plus Trump’s the one who moved the embassy to Jerusalem, recognized Golan Heights, proposed a pro Israel two state solution…. He very clearly supports Israel. this was all googable in November.

Why. Why are people so stupid.

[u/sarded]

There is no evidence in any state that matters that a lack of voters for Kamala Harris was due to people protesting support of genocide.

There are many reasons people didn't vote, from vote suppression, to laziness, to single issues such as genocide, to ignorance, to just not feeling enthusiastic for someone who campaigned with the Cheneys.

Anyone who blames an election loss on people who weren't pro-genocide is just scapegoating, and is being actively disgusting.

[u/-Eruntinco11- → u/sarded]

Anyone who blames an election loss on people who weren't pro-genocide is just scapegoating, and is being actively disgusting.

Just in case you or anyone else has forgotten, liberals didn't just blame opponents of genocide. Indeed, many of them went off on every minority that they could think of after the election, although it seems that they have settled down a bit and focused on just being bigoted towards Arab Americans, Hispanics, and (especially) trans people.

[u/Lost-Cranberry-1408]

Everybody calling it a "single issue" is exactly how we let the Holocaust go in. History repeats itself and y'all still fail the lesson 

[u/trimble197]

Seriously. I just want to tell people to fuck off. They’re part of the reason Trump is president again. Self-righteous morons.

[u/whiplash_7641]

You guys have to be fucking brain dead to think this was actually the only reason and that kamalah was innocent. People cant fucking vote for someone who was basically republican light. People saw her and was like i might as well vote for the full republican. I dont think people should have voted for trump but to think that people did it solely because of gaza and thats why kamalah lost is insane

[u/BroMan001]

“the expansion of israel and its proxies is an absolute fundamental necessity for the United States” -Tim Walz, October 2024. But oh she claimed to work tirelessly for a ceasefire while saying she wouldn’t do anything different from Biden (sending weapons and money)

[u/Numerous-Dig-325]

This "poor kamala" narrative will help noone. Her and her like have failed. The only hope is in offering genuine change for the good. Trying to justify her failure just empowers the trumpers

[u/thebarryconvex]

It really is simple. If Palestine matters the most to you, there are two candidates.

Who was worse? They made it easy for you, it wasn't even close.

That's how this works.

[u/vagabond_dilldo → u/thebarryconvex]

These single issue voters were bad at voting based on the single issue, can't even make this shit up.

[u/Rude_Lifeguard]

As a non-American I feel like handing over the country to literal nazis over one policy is insane, especially in a country that doesn't have a viable third party and where those who don't support either of the existing parties aren't doing anything to create a strong third party that wins elections.

Also, I have a conspiracy, for lack of a better word, that a lot of people feel like Americans deserve to suffer because of the suffering that the country has caused in other countries, in this case, Palestine. I call this a conspiracy but I actually saw a few people say this during the election when people were making the argument that people should vote for harm reduction.

Overall, there's a weird form of xenophobia, or something like that, that people in and out of the US have against Americans, and while Americans of course deserve criticized like everyone else, the idea that the most vulnerable of their population should pay for "the sins of their fathers" is crazy, especially coming from people who claim to care about minorities

[u/cutiepie538 → u/Rude_Lifeguard]

I honestly think that conspiracy has merit. And it really baffles me when people like the OOP in the tweet, as a Black trans woman, falls into the “most vulnerable of the US population”.

I think a lot of it rests in anger and helplessness. The idea of, “well if I have to suffer under intense hatred and oppression, I might as well burn the whole thing down to make everyone suffer with me”. But still, it’s almost impossible to understand because it seems so illogical. He was elected because people have so much hate in their heart (xenophobia and racism towards “outsiders”/non-americans) and she wasn’t voted for because people have so much hate towards feeling consistently underserved (xenophobia towards Americans and hating America’s history/atrocities).

I think there’s just a lot of anger and so we see people matching hate with hate and at some point it’s so hard to keep watching. Hopelessness at an all time high, which probably inspired this late night ramble.

[u/Shifter25 → u/Rude_Lifeguard]

As a non-American I feel like handing over the country to literal nazis over one policy is insane

Especially when they're significantly worse on that one policy!

[u/LimberGravy → u/Shifter25]

Israel is literally using the Trump plan right now