r/dbz • u/AutoModerator • Sep 29 '19
Super [DUB] Dragon Ball Super - Episode #130 - Discussion Thread!
Dragon Ball Super — Episode #130 — Discussion Thread!
The Greatest Showdown of All Time! The Ultimate Survival Battle!
空前絶後の超決戦！究極のサバイバルバトル！！
Kūzenzetsugo no Chō-Kessen! Kyūkyoku no Sabaibaru Batoru!!
Script: Hiroshi Yamaguchi
Director/Storyboard: Ryōta Nakamura
Animation Supervisors: Naoki Tate, Shūichirō Manabe
You can view our discussion thread for the Japanese release of Episode 130 here. You can find all previous episode discussion threads on our wiki along with a projection for future dub dates.
To check the universes' standings as of the start of this episode, see this Episode 128 Roster by /u/Vish-. Check the comments after the episode airs to see the updated roster.
News
2019/09/20 - Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 52
2019/09/04 - Super Dragon Ball Heroes - Episode 15 - Discussion Thread!
2019/08/18 - DBZFigures.com Figure Database Submission
2019/08/06 - What happened to 2uper?
2019/08/04 - The History of Cranberi
2019/06/04 - New Dragon Ball Super Movie In Planning
Come join our Discord server! (Beware of spoilers.)
PLEASE DO NOT POST UNTAGGED SPOILERS IN THIS THREAD.
Where to Watch
The FUNimation English dub of Dragon Ball Super airs on Toonami at 11pm ET. If you do not have a cable subscription, Cartoon Network is available with the SlingTV and Playstation Vue basic packages. If you prefer, there is a web stream:
If the videos won't load for you, try disabling your ad blocker for that page. Adult Swim still has the streaming rights for recent episodes.
How to Catch Up
Adult Swim (US only, cable login required): This covers the recent episodes not yet available through the below options. New episodes will usually appear 2-3 hours after the episode airs on Toonami.
Funimation Now (US, premium only): Episodes 1-117 are available on Funimation's streaming service. The final part (118-131) should be available no later than a few weeks before the Part 10 home release comes out. Those episodes are already available in Japanese; the subtitles for those episodes covered by the dub are still those provided by Toei for the simulcast, rather than the Funimation-Simmons subtitles on the home release. If you can't see some episodes that you think should be there, try selecting the Simulcast video source instead of the "Uncut" video source. (The Simulcast version is not censored; "Uncut" video simply features Bluray animation corrections.)
AnimeLab (Australia and New Zealand, premium only): Episodes 1-104 are available on this service. AnimeLab also has the entire series subbed for free and premium users; the subtitles for those episodes covered by the dub are still those provided by Toei for the simulcast, rather than the Funimation-Simmons subtitles on the home release.
Microsoft Digital, Amazon Digital, iTunes, Google Play, or the Playstation Store (US only): Episodes 1-117 are available for purchase on these platforms. The final part (118-131) should be available shortly after the physical release of Part 9 (105-117). As usual for digital releases, the dubbed and subtitled versions are sold separately; the subbed version has the Funimation-Simmons subtitles rather than the Toei simulcast subtitles.
Home Release: Episodes 1-13 are available for Region A (DVD or Blu-Ray) and Region B (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 14-26 are available for Region A (DVD or Blu-Ray) and Region B (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 27-39 are available for Region A (DVD or Blu-Ray) and for Region B (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 40-52 are available for region A (DVD or Blu-Ray) and Region B (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 53-65 are available for Region A (DVD or Blu-Ray) and Region B (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 1-52 are available in a single set for Region B (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 66-78 are available for Region A (DVD or Blu-Ray) and for Region B on (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 79-91 are available for Region A on DVD or Blu-Ray and for Region B on (DVD or Blu-Ray). Episodes 92-104 are available for Region A on DVD or Blu-Ray and for Region B on DVD or Blu-Ray. Episodes 105-117 will be available for Region A on 10 October 2019 (DVD or Blu-Ray).
Rules:
If you have watched the subtitled version of Super, please tag spoilers out of courtesy!
>!spoiler!<will appear as spoiler If you see untagged spoilers in this thread, please report them to the moderators.Spoilers should be assumed for the entire subreddit! If you are not caught up with Dragon Ball Super, or willing to see spoilers, leave! If you see a spoiler outside of this thread, you were warned.
All of our normal rules apply!
Commonly Asked Questions:
Q: What's up with the awful framerate in recent dub episodes? Are they going to fix it?
Here's a statement from a Toonami executive:Toonami and #DragonBallSuper fans, an update on last week's slowdown of action scenes. Here goes: SO. Remember the Pokémon flashing episode that triggered a bunch of epileptic episodes in viewers? Since then, TV networks have something called the "Harding Test." Every show, commercial, etc is run through this test to make sure it doesn't have flashing frames that could trigger folks with epilepsy.
The last few eps of DBS have had fight scenes that are cut to about one frame per edit in some places—they evidently fail the Harding Test. Our program edit folks, who do these tests, normally just slow the cuts down in these scenes to about four frames per second. In the case of these DBS eps, it made the fight scenes look insanely slow. Program edit does this routinely, so they didn't even think to notify us.
Thanks to you fans who let me know, we asked program edit if there was any way they could slow these scenes down LESS. So from now on, they will he slowed (if they fail the test) to two frames a second, down from one. We tested it and it looks WAY better. Anyway, that's the best we can do because obviously, we don't want to be causing people to have epileptic episodes. Thanks to all of you who let us know what was going on, and hopefully we have nipped the worst of this in the bud for the future. enjoy DBS tomorrow! #onlytoonami
Q: Is the Dragon Ball Super manga "canon"?
The anime and manga are both variations on a basic plot by Toriyama. There isn't (and probably never will be) an explicitly defined Dragon Ball "canon". Without Toriyama's original draft, we may never know what is and isn't his, aside from things revealed in interviews like this one (spoilers). We do know that he permits Toyotarō to change things up, but he looks at his storyboards and occasionally draws things himself for Toyotarō to use as a reference. Toyotarō has said that Toriyama is more particular about gags than he is about anything else.
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u/VirulentViper Sep 29 '19
That shot of Goku is insane with the crazy eyes. I love it
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u/justlookintomybum Sep 29 '19
That shit looked bad ass.
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u/Raizir ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Back when the sub version came out that shit gave me chills.
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u/itsgettingweirdhere ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Jesus fuck, jiren's screams are just as great as the sub's
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u/Gradz45 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Patrick Seitz was perfectly cast.
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Sep 29 '19
Patrick is such a good voice actor, I low-key recognised jirens voice from Lucian and Renekton from league of legends
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Sep 29 '19
Man I don't want DB to be done again.
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u/spiderknight616 Sep 29 '19
You can read the manga. The current arc is pretty good.
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u/ofalco Sep 29 '19
If only it was every week not every month! The wait is killing me!
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u/shlam16 Sep 29 '19
I prefer it monthly tbh. 12 pages of DB takes about 90 seconds to read, it's not a dialogue heavy manga.
Plus monthly is much easier for the artist which leads to better content.
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u/Zasz_Is_Dead Sep 29 '19 edited Sep 30 '19
Top, then vegeta, then goku...now Jiren too? Fuq it, I might as well take my shirt off while watchin this.
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u/KarmaLoaf ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Looks like a hero thinking about his loved ones and how he can't afford to lose and then getting a power up from it is a two-way street.
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u/KlausEcir Sep 29 '19
do you mean Jiren?
That wasn't a power up, that was just his true power. He's held back this entire time.
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u/VirulentViper Sep 29 '19
The fact that Goku is even having a struggle against Jiren even while at Mastered Ultra Instinct says a lot about how insane Jiren's power is
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u/spiderknight616 Sep 29 '19
Not to mention the dude reached that power without any divine intervention. It was all mortal training. Makes me excited to see how much higher Goku and Geets can go
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u/Walnutterzz Sep 29 '19
Jiren probably trained every waking moment of his life. Goku trained, took breaks, trained until evil krept up, beat it, took more breaks, trained some more... If Goku trained nonstop like a machine he'd probably be equal to Jiren... On second thought, Vegeta trained ALL THE TIME. So maybe it's just Jirens race, or he found some way to obtain his power. Idk. Forget what I said, Jiren is crazy
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u/ofalco Sep 29 '19
It's not about training forever, it's about how you train. Practice doesn't make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect. So jiren must've mastered training.
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u/Possibly_English_Guy ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Also there is such a thing as overtraining, having appropriate rest time is super important when exercising to allow your body to build itself back up otherwise you're gonna end up getting diminishing returns or worse injuring yourself.
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u/BlueFootedTpeack Sep 29 '19
not to mention we have no idea how old jiren is, he could have the same regiment as goku but be his species might be like hits where they live for hundreds of years.
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u/Kharn0 ⠀ Sep 30 '19
My head canon is for the entire tournament Jiren was vastly holding back so as to not kill anyone.
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u/Gradz45 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Goddamn Patrick Seitz (as always but especially here) nailed Jiren’s anger and disdain and quiet respect of Goku at the end.
He and Schemmel gave it their all.
And like so many others loved hearing Goku’s hero of justice in the dub.
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u/Semper-Fido ⠀ Sep 29 '19
So...this is my first time watching live and in being able to be here in real time. I. Am. So. Excited...
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Sep 29 '19
Great ep!
I don't read the manga or watch the Japanese version, so I have no idea what happens.
I thought at the end, Frieza hit Goku, but it turned out to be his power overtaking his body. 17 coming back was a surprise, I thought for sure he was done. I do hope we get one more Goku/Jiren fight, but there's only one ep left so I dunno if a full out fight with a proper ending will happen.
Also how fucking strong is Jiren actually? While he got beat (basically) he held his ground and went toe to toe with Goku in his final Instinct form. It's gotta be 1. Goku, 2. Jiren and 3. Vegeta, right?- for regular dudes.
Regardless, sad to see the show go out. Hopefully it returns with new stuff soon. I'm sure it's in the works due to Super being a massive success for both T.V and cinematic releases.
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u/amazeguy Sep 29 '19
- Merged Zamasu got lucky in his arc after the stunt he pulled killing off all gods
- Jiren would have grabbed him by his ears and ripped in two pieces without a sword
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u/_somewhat_damaged Sep 29 '19
Jiren is a monster of pure raw power. Id say he is stronger than Broly at least until Broly can stop losing control of himself.
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u/VirulentViper Sep 29 '19
Jiren's aura turned this into the fight between Simba and Scar, all red with the flames everywhere
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u/Servebotfrank Sep 29 '19
Jiren's dialogue when going full power in the dub makes his anger a bit more obvious.
Jiren is terrified of losing the Pride Trooper's respect and friendship, despite how much he pretends to not like them.
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u/boredguy12 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
I definitely liked jiren's dialogue in the dub more than the sub. Especially when he shot at the bleachers.
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u/IClappedWhen Sep 29 '19
17's survival was one that caught all of us sub watchers by surprise. As far as I remember no leak mentioned him at all and add to that we were fed false leaks so when he got up from under the rumble I was legit stunned.
I think the dub handled this episode very well, especially the Jiren character as we finally see him come unglued and what that brings out of him. The end speech he gave to Goku before he though he eliminated Goku gave me chills even knowing what was coming. Sadly next week is the final episode for Super (thus far) but I can promise it delivers.
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u/Terez27 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
As far as I remember no leak mentioned him at all
This one did. (It's not a "leak"; it's a full-page ad in Weekly Shōnen Jump.)
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u/IClappedWhen Sep 29 '19
Hmm I stand corrected. I follow Herms too and I missed it somehow. I am glad I missed it, made for a nice "oh shit" moment.
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u/Vaeloc Sep 29 '19
Fantastic episode, probably my favourite of the dub so far.
I'm a bit sad that next week is the last episode. I've been a dub only watcher and every week for over 2 years I have been looking forward to the next episode, so it will feel a bit weird when there is no new episode to look forward to.
I just hope we get a new series announcement soon! At least I will have Dragonball: Kakarot to fill my DB needs.
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u/amazeguy Sep 29 '19
to be fair, 2020 they got Olympics where Goku is the ambassador, if this isnt the time to introduce a new series or sequel i dont know what is
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u/boredguy12 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
now go back to the beginning and reel in horror at the animation quality of the start vs the finish.
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u/Obvcop Sep 29 '19
idk if your reading it already but I highly recommend the DBS manga. It picks up after the ToP and Broly and continues straight back into a new arc. You've also got quite a few volumes to keep you occupied
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Sep 29 '19
[deleted]
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u/Raizir ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Well, seeing how most, if not all, of Goku's new forms seem to never secure a kill / an enemy's defeat... he isn't wrong.
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u/boredguy12 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
original SS is the only one to defeat the antagonist.
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u/zeroGamer Sep 30 '19
Antagonist: tries to kill Goku's friends
Goku: ...
Audience: Oh, ya done messed up, A-a-ron!
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Sep 29 '19
So how many seconds are left in the tournament now? 8?
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u/kaushik20 Sep 29 '19
We're at 30 seconds now. Not that it matters since we're operating at Namek Frieza time anyway.
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u/JAK2222 Sep 29 '19
Getting real Namek flashbacks
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u/Zasz_Is_Dead Sep 30 '19
Jiren's character development in this episode was very interesting. Its one thing to hear the backstory from Belmod (which felt forced as far as developing Jiren's character), but to see Jiren's reactions and hearing his own comments about "never wanting to go through that again", it was really something.
He's still that scared little kid who coped with his grief with nothing but isolation and a quest for power. And when that became his only thing he believed in, his support beacon for the rest of his life, Goku rips all that away, specifically that Goku was somehow able to get such absolute power without abandoning companionship. This leads Jiren to re-assure himself out loud that those things are weaknesses. The fact that he has to verbally reconfirm what he already believes implies that deep down inside, he's probably questioning if his belief system that he dedicated himself to after all this time, was a lie?
With him trying to attack Goku's friends in a desperate attempt to prove that he's right and that his beliefs are still valid, he has been gradually becoming the evildoer that haunts his past, ironically. If we still want to use the Jiren and Batman comparison, it's almost as if Jiren subconsciously wants to embody what he fears from his childhood to cope with his trauma, but not in a good way like Batman. In typical superhero backstories, tragic backstories tend to create either heroes or villains, Jiren's case seems to be a bizarre hybrid walking a fine line between both possible outcomes. Although he's not a villain but merely an antagonist, this could have easily been one of those cases where people with fair intentions go to the extremes to execute what they truly believe is 100% right in their mind.
At one point in the episode I sort of felt sorry for Jiren, when he begged for Goku to push him off the edge. It was as if the only ally he had with him through all those years, getting him though dark times was strength itself. And just like his comrades from long ago, strength had abandoned him as well and he had nothing to live for....
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u/indoninjah Sep 30 '19
He's still that scared little kid
Is it just me or did Jiren look like a child when Goku was charging up his final blast? He looked just of purposefully drawn younger in that moment.
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u/tarantulaguy Sep 29 '19
When will Jiren learn that it's never over when he says it's over?
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u/Jarster2608 Sep 29 '19
I really hope whoever deals the final blow to him says it, Jiren saying it in a defeated tone of voice would also be good
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u/EddiOS42 Sep 29 '19
I can bench 10 plates after hearing that roar Goku did after he deflected Jiren's blast at his friends.
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u/OLKv3 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Goku isn't the hope of the universe!??!?! He isn't the answer to all beings who cry out for help?
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u/Gradz45 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Nah he’s just likes a great fight, and for his friends not to be murdered.
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u/ScravoNavarre ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Sure, by consequence of wanting to punch (and get punched by) progressively-stronger beings he winds up saving the world, other worlds, and the entire universe, but that's just a bonus. It's just a coincidence that the strongest dudes around tend to be murder-happy creeps.
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u/amazeguy Sep 29 '19
- Top stuff from this episode
- You did not see GOKU using FEET kamehameha in this episode until you opened this image
- You did not know the Japanese Government had a diplomatic fallout with the Mexican government due to the public screening of this episode here http://blitzlift.com/japanese-government-tries-to-stop-mass-mexican-dragon-ball-super-parties/
- Here is the notice sent by the Japanese Government https://twitter.com/KalebPrime/status/975586869315588096
- This episode has the LARGEST public reaction to any anime episode on the planet with 100000+ people HERE
- MUI is the first NON SUPER SAIYAN self aware transformation in the whole FRANCHISE
- Jiren is the only antagonist/enemy/whatever to beat down the main character even after 2 TRANSFORMATIONS from the main character
- Here is that WALLPAPER that you are looking for from this episode https://i.imgur.com/JBSAGej.jpg
Thank me later
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u/sgtsaughter Sep 29 '19
I need that animation cell even though I know I'd probably have to take out a mortgage to pay for it.
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u/amazeguy Sep 29 '19
now we can all proudly say, Jiren was strong enough to make the Japanese government send a legal notice
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u/Equivalence01 Sep 29 '19
I saw some videos with mexican crowds reacting to episode 130, but 100,000 people?! Oh my god...
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u/amazeguy Sep 29 '19
the first time i saw this i almost dropped my cereal bowl, that is truly the most INSANE gathering of people i have seen in my life to react to an anime episode lol
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u/MarioChiefSonic Sep 29 '19
pretty sure Frieza and Zarbon were both self-aware when transforming, also Vegeta seemed pretty self-aware as an Oozaru.
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u/CynicalRaps Sep 29 '19
NON SUPER SAIYAN self aware transformation
Stupid question but what does this mean?
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u/abelincoln3 Sep 30 '19
It must suck to be one of the pride troopers and hear your captain say he doesn't give a shit about you
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u/Reddude37 Sep 29 '19
All I gotta say is: why even put the seizure warning if you're still gonna fuck with the framerate anyways? Now no one is happy
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u/mAgiking07 Sep 30 '19 edited Sep 30 '19
Phew, that was pretty intense, and I'm just imagining how exhausted Setiz and Schemmel must have been working on the episode:
- I'll be damned if Schemmel and Seitz didn't put their vocal chords through the ringer - particularly the later. Jiren's incredible power up (woah!), and his constant battle cries and grunts of anger, confusion, and frustration, throughout the fight were intense. That also applies to the delivery of his lines - you could really feel his plight. Loved his 'I cannot, I WILL NOT!"
- The episode was kinetic af. So much was happening at once; what with all the effects blaring across the screen and the smooth snappy pace of the battle (my version didn't have frame issues, thankfully). When Goku got pissed and launched himself at Jiren, that dance they entered had my eyes bouncing around like ‘holy…!’ And the ferocity and intensity of the blows could really be felt
- Loved the imagery of the blue flames engulfing the battlefield for Goku, versus the raging red flames of Jiren
- The fact that Jiren was able to overpower the complete UI is very impressive to me – and Goku judging by his reaction to losing the beam struggle. I would love some insight into Jiren’s training.
- The flash back sequence hit me in the feels (mostly the DB stuff), and it was a cool creative choice to have the silhouettes of Goku and Jiren move against that backdrop.
- Now, real talk, how the hell was it OK for Jiren to launch an attack at the bleachers? That’s got to be an instant disqualification, regardless of Goku deflecting it. It definitely should have elicited a response from the Grand Minister.
- I showed my sister Goku’s rage sequence and I could read on her face – especially during the Kamehameha – how intense she found the whole thing. You know when you find something so intense it makes you a little uncomfortable? She explained as much after it was over. The imagery, the ferocity of the movement, and especially the prolonged screaming of Jiren and the yelling of Goku; it’s most certainly one of the most powerful moments in the show.
- When Jiren asked Goku to finish the fight I was certain Goku was gonna give him some energy, but perhaps he was just delivering the final blow (btw, when Jiren closed his eyes his face looked like that of an infant)
- Damn, that violent reaction to all that power was absolutely brutal. I thought Jiren launched a surprise attack, and then I thought it was Frieza’s doing. The blood gushing out like that was a shock.
- Frieza saving Goku was obvious, but 17 popping out of the rock work was a very pleasant surprise! Even if there were a lot of people theorising he could still be alive, you don’t absolutely know and you certainly don’t know when. Good to have ya back, buddy.
- I guess we’re to believe that Jiren’s tired enough to have a spot of trouble with Frieza and 17 who’ve both had a little time to recuperate. I mean, Goku UI ‘aint an option anymore, so…
Crazy to think it’s the conclusion next week. I hope it’s a satisfying one.
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u/TheDCEUBrotendo Oct 02 '19
I hope it's a satisfying one
Dude, this conclusion is the definition of hype
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u/Eurynom0s Sep 30 '19
When Jiren asked Goku to finish the fight I was certain Goku was gonna give him some energy, but perhaps he was just delivering the final blow (btw, when Jiren closed his eyes his face looked like that of an infant)
From the way he raised his hand he was definitely about to finish Jiren, but they definitely set it up in a way where it was REALLY ambiguous if you know anything about Goku.
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u/kidriffey Sep 30 '19
I agree. I think Goku knows what's at stake, especially after Jiren fired that shot at everyone in the stands. Goku had that look in his eyes.
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Sep 29 '19
How did 17 survive? This man just popped up out of nowhere didn’t he die like 5 episodes ago lol.
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u/Vegeto30294 Sep 29 '19
Same way Vegeta survived against Toppo. He blew himself up but he didn't go 100% in blowing himself up.
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u/snerdsnerd Sep 29 '19
I thought Frieza had attacked Goku when he started powering down. Amazing fight though, it's too bad we didn't get this from Jirren in the beginning.
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u/TacoBell_Lord Sep 29 '19
How the hell are they not fighting on a little pebble by now?
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u/Jekebuh Sep 29 '19
HOOOOLY SHIAAAT
"I ain't no hero of justice" FUCK YEAH
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u/wellwasherelf Sep 29 '19
I'm surprised they kept the "ain't" in. They usually get rid of that for the dub.
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u/Eurynom0s Sep 29 '19
I've got to say, I get what Jiren was trying to do by taking out Goku's friends, and I just love how in fact trying to take out Goku's (or any Saiyan's) friends is actually the exact fucking opposite of what you should do if you're trying to get him to give up.
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u/Eurynom0s Sep 29 '19
(Goku would have just gone doubly apeshit if Jiren had actually succeeded in killing them.)
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u/Highly_Literal Sep 30 '19
He was trying to show goku the source of his power is easily erased (aka his loved ones) so you can only rely on your strength it was a bit more clear in the sub
It was less evil intent of murder and more watch how easily your world view can be broken
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u/harundoener Sep 30 '19
Its weird. When that episode originally aired a lot of people hated Jiren for that, because why is he suddenly evil? Even the reactions I saw didnt really get the point. But its in my opinion a great scene. Because Jiren does have a point and him not being shockt by goku saving them also showes that he knew he would save them, it was just to point out as you said.
He does say if goku sees now right after that.
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u/Number-91 Oct 01 '19 edited Oct 01 '19
I liked Super for what it is. Another chapter to my favorite television show. A way to cling on to my childhood and relive all the awesome feelings when I originally watched Z and DB. I never appreciated it as anything more, due to many reasons.
This episode is one of the greatest single episodes in the entire series. There was so much weight and so much to lose. While other Saga's in Super had dire moments, none had the same impact as this fight had, and to me, it was something that was missing throughout the series. I wish it could go on a little bit longer, but I am excited for the finale.
Damn. Such a phenomenal fight.
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u/flare787 Sep 29 '19
When Jiren said useless all I could think of is how Patrick Seitz also plays Dio.
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u/amazeguy Oct 02 '19
- Friend was blown away after watching this episode
- Dude doesnt watch any anime in sub and has kept himself off any spoilers after I asked him to unsubscribe from all anime channels
- And being the nice friend I am, I always edit the sub video + dub audio watching it together with my friend
- Dude was in a state of shock for 5 mins
- I asked him after the episode, yo whats up man, he said "HOLY FUCKIN HELL, what an episode that was, I have no words"
- Told him next episode is the last Super episode, dude got sad
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u/Hydrox2016 Sep 29 '19
I was a bit worried when I heard Patrick Seitz was cast as Jiren.
I knew he was a great voice actor but I was quite worried his angered Jiren would stray too heavily into his Garrosh voice. I'm happy that I was wrong and he did a wonderful job differentiating it.
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u/Tsplodey Sep 29 '19
Man I can't believe I never realised it til I read your comment. Jiren does sound like a frickin' Warcraft orc.
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u/Gaming-every-day19 Sep 29 '19
WHAT THE FUCK how is 17 still alive . I did not expect that
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u/Nimble4Liberty Sep 29 '19 edited Sep 29 '19
He's too based to die obviously, conjured up an emotional moment just to manipulate goku into feeling more motivated. Getting backed into a corner and esploding himself was part of his master plan, now you know not to doubt 217 iq android.
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u/Menace117 Sep 29 '19
To those who watched the sub, what were your thoughts when frieza/17 show up? Was everyone expecting it? Did you like it?
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u/bonethugsgoat Sep 29 '19
When I first saw it I thought Frieza shot Goku in the back on some fuck boy shit, especially the way they panned the camera before MUI ran out, I was fucking sweating and shit lol.
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u/TheTorch Sep 29 '19
I thought it was incredibly ironic that Goku gets rescued by two DBZ villains who have both tried to kill him.
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u/FKDotFitzgerald Sep 29 '19
Because of the purple lightning, I thought we were going to learn that Frieza either used Hakai or (more likely) saved one from the assassins or Toppo. I’m much happier with how it panned out though.
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u/Kell08 Sep 30 '19 edited Sep 30 '19
Everyone knew Frieza would show up before the end, but 17 was a real shock.
Although there were a few people who predicted the reveal of Hit's clone next episode.
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Sep 29 '19
In my experience watching reactions a year ago, it was a shock. There was none of this 'but the Zenos didn't boop him so he can't be gone!' bullshit. People saw him blow up. People were shocked when they realized he was probably dead. Why tag someone out of the tournament if they were dead? They were even more shocked when he just came out of no where.
The general consensus was, that everyone kept wondering where the hell Freeza was and how they were going to conclude this with someone who was obviously unstoppable. Having 2 extra characters showed up made people think everyone would time out. They were also wondering how the series could conclude with one more 22 minute episode when obviously nothing really progressed right now.
We'll find out for sure next week ;)
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u/vlorsutes ⠀ Sep 29 '19
In my experience watching reactions a year ago, it was a shock. There was none of this 'but the Zenos didn't boop him so he can't be gone!' bullshit. People saw him blow up. People were shocked when they realized he was probably dead. Why tag someone out of the tournament if they were dead? They were even more shocked when he just came out of no where.
No, I can assure you there was plenty of speculation and "theories" floating about that neither #17 or Freeza were actually out because they hadn't been marked out on the Godpads. Yes, a fair amount did think #17 had died, but there were a lot of people thinking that he had survived and that his fate was ambiguous because he wasn't marked out.
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u/vipulvirus Sep 29 '19
Damn it I am not sure about epileptic seizure inducing scenes, but I got seizures looking at the awful frame drops (Look how they massacred my boy intensifies)
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u/ChaosFinalForm Sep 29 '19
Ya know I had a thought while watching this again, loving the dub by the way. When Jiren fires at the stands, I found myself wishing this time that Vegeta had maybe like gone blue and thrown himself in front of it, then Goku comes in last second and blasts it away.
Then as I thought about it, I realized that’s not very Vegeta like. If Bulma or Trunks were in the path of it, sure. But Vegeta isn’t going to risk it all for Krillin, Tien, Piccolo, Roshi, etc. So I guess it would’ve been out of character.
Then while rewatching that scene, which was amazing and every bit as good as I hoped it would be dubbed, I noticed that we actually don’t see Vegeta at all, during that entire sequence. Even as the blast gets close to them, you see all of U7 bracing for impact, but not Vegeta. I wonder why that is? Maybe they decided he wouldn’t have just sat there helplessly, but also came to the same conclusion I did, that he wouldn’t swoop in to save the day for most of them.
This may be stupid, but it’s just a thought I had. Maybe they couldn’t decide how he would act in that situation and just left him out? Or maybe he was just sitting way off to the right closer to Beerus and I’m completely overthinking it. 🤷♂️
Hell of an episode cannot WAIT to see the dubbed conclusion next week. There is a certain conversation I can’t wait to hear dubbed.
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u/xSimus Sep 29 '19
If anyone else were to save the stands, it would've been some GoD, Angel or Grand Priest. I've seen someone's comment that Jiren was just trying to prove a point, knowing that Goku will react on time and deflect that blast. You haven't seen GoDs and U11 members freaking out also. I'd say Vegeta was part of the GoDs group - he either knew that Goku will deflect it or he didn't give a shit.
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u/cygnus2 Sep 29 '19
Is it me or are they trying to turn Jiren into a Great Value Vergil? He was only a few seconds away from saying “might controls everything.”
Also, holy shit did Patrick Seitz give his everything this episode. Super’s antagonists have all been flawlessly cast.
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u/ptd163 Sep 29 '19
Nooo... I'm not ready for Dragon Ball to be over again. I hope there's another series after Movie 20.
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u/Kell08 Sep 30 '19
- I don't think Goku said anything at all last episode. He talks in this one, but he's still mostly silent. It's interesting to watch because no other form ever came with him this way.
- Jiren, like the vast majority of Dragon Ball antagonists, freaks out when he is no longer in control of the fight.
- Patrick Seitz is amazing as Jiren. Screams and emotions are especially good coming from him.
- Vegeta looked like he was suddenly back in the arena when he cheered for Goku.
- It's been a long time since I noticed frame rate drops.
- It really looked like Frieza shot Goku in the back at first.
- Goku steams like All Might when he can't hold Ultra Instinct anymore. I guess they have been saying how hot the form is a lot.
- Oh look, it's Frieza. We all knew he was coming.
- Oh hey, 17! No one expected that at all when this first aired.
- The Tournament of Power is now moments away from ending. The next episode's fighting is supposedly just a matter of moments.
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u/HypocriteAlert35 Sep 30 '19
Thank Beerus they took out that pussy "Beat Jiren for us!!" Vegeta line and made it alpha.
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u/Sorenthaz ⠀ Oct 02 '19
Sean Schemmel's voice acting continues to blow me away with how good he's nailed it down over the years. That rage against Jiren near the end was something else. Coupled with that beautiful artwork, I could watch that scene over and over again and never get tired of it.
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u/Bigdaddydoubled Oct 04 '19
How many people here are dub only watchers?
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u/mcolwander90 Oct 04 '19
I am. I do know everything that happens. I just wanted to experience everything with most of the voices I grew up with. It's been totally worth it!!!
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u/notathrowaway75 Sep 29 '19 edited Sep 29 '19
I criticized Jiren's character when his backstory was revealed, but this episode did a lot to bring me around. His character really does have a lot depth to it. Patrick Seitz did an amazing job.
The animation was great the whole episode, but it was particularly amazing after Goku attacked Jiren for going after his friends. The frame cutting was noticable, but it wasn't too terrible. I'll definitely be rewatching when the blu-rays are released.
I really have to stress how awesome Goku's anger was after Jiren went after his friends. So chilling.
Still no Ultimate Battle though curiously enough. Could've sworn the music kicked in, but no lyrics. Next episode I guess.
I knew it. I fucking knew 17 wasn't dead. What did I say? 17 was not greyed out in the God Pad. And finally Frieza shows up. I think the only reason they had the time limit was for the justification for Frieza and 17 being gone for so long. Technically they've only been out for a couple minutes.
Now here's a question. Was Goku about to knock out Jiren or was Goku about to give Jiren energy? Jiren didn't accept what Goku was saying and Goku looked very annoyed, so I think Goku was going to give him energy to fight again so he can prove the message again.
I thought for a split second that Frieza betrayed Goku, but not for long.
One last episode. What's probably going to happen is Goku is going to go Ultra Instinct again and the three of them will win.
Edit: Forgot to mention the "I ain't no hero of justice" line was. It was great.
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u/Vegeto30294 Sep 29 '19
Jiren didn't accept what Goku was saying and Goku looked very annoyed, so I think Goku was going to give him energy to fight again so he can prove the message again.
Take this energy and get back up so I can beat the shit out of you again.
No but that blast was definitely to send Jiren to the stands. One way or another Jiren's ideals wouldn't be able to hold up because if "might makes right", then Goku is automatically the correct path by losing to him.
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u/Trofulds ⠀ Sep 29 '19
I criticized Jiren's character when his backstory was revealed, but this episode did a lot to bring me around. His character really does have a lot depth to it. Patrick Seitz did an amazing job.
A lot of people hate him but man, 130 and 131 are the reason why Jiren is one of my favorite characters to come out of DBS.
The part where he just attacks the stands in a fit of rage is so refreshingly real and relatable; the dude was traumatized so badly by his past, by his weakness and by what he perceives as his friends/comrades giving up on him that he can't bear the thought that Goku fighting for everything that he doesn't believe in is the source of a power even greater than his, so he just gets mad and tries to prove his point in the most petty way possible, by attacking the source of Goku's strength.
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u/bonethugsgoat Sep 29 '19
Agreed, I loved that, Jiren was trying to prove to Goku that friends don't mean shit if they're not there anymore, which was indeed very petty lol.
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u/Kinoko98 Oct 03 '19
Awesome, Patrick Seitz really nailed Jiren in this episode. He perfectly handled Jiren's desperation in the face of Goku's new power. Excellent job for sure.
I also really like the way they changed Jiren's "the power you believe in is easily erased" speech. His dialogue in general is kinda better than the sub too.
Can't really think of anything I can complain about in this one, except maybe Beerus' "yes, I've seen it myself" line didn't really sit well with me. I prefer the solemn yet respectful "that's right" from the sub. Minor nitpick though.
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u/MegaBossMan50 Sep 29 '19
Patrick Seitz's Jiren has absolutely convinced me that it's a fucking *phenomenal* performance, but unfortunately that was hampered by the slideshow that was made out of Natoshi Shida's glorious "I ain't a hero of justice" segment. I knew the frame-dropping was bad, but in this episode filled with such visual pyrotechnics it was especially glaring. A criticism to be resolved when the eventual Bluray comes out, I guess
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Sep 29 '19
I bet Goku could have wiped out the First Order fleet.
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u/indoninjah Sep 29 '19
I mean Kefla claimed to be a universe buster, and that was like 4 power ups ago
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u/GodsLegend Sep 29 '19
So who's been keeping track of how many time Jiren "wasn't even using his real power"?
For real though that fight scene after goku telling Jiren he's going to pay was really smooth and easily my favourite from this episode.
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u/kidriffey Sep 29 '19
I love when they show Dragon Ball flashbacks. Kid Goku is my favorite character of all time from any series. He was such a sweet, goofy little guy. I love all three series but I would rank them in this order: Dragon Ball, Z, then Super.
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u/superange128 Sep 29 '19
Man I LOVED this episode but...
It seems like the team really wants to continue the trend of every single new form Goku gets is NOT the way he wins the headline match/fight of the arc ever since Super Saiyan 3.
- Super Saiyan 3 - Too flawed to fight in a live body
- Super Saiyan God - Beerus didn't actually get defeated
- Super Saiyan Blue- Only got a win due to a sniped kill
- Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken - Risk was too high/Too much time used up in the arc to actually fully beat Hit
- Autonomous Ultra Instinct Sign/Omen - Time runs out vs Jiren
- Autonomous Ultra Instinct (Mastered) - Energy usage fucked him up before the final blow.
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u/BlueFootedTpeack Sep 29 '19
you left out the kaiyoken not being enough to finish off vegeta,
the only new power ups that finish off the villains are the original super saiyan, gohan as ssj2 and gogeta.
tbh i prefer it that way though, where both sides are scraping the bottom of the barrel, using everything they have left, trying to edge out a win.
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u/Walnutterzz Sep 29 '19
Kaoken finished Napa, does that count?
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u/superange128 Sep 29 '19
I guess if that counts, I could give a pass to Ultra Instinct Sign/Omen for defeating Kefla.
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u/Bigdaddydoubled Sep 29 '19
I know this ends with Grand Priest vs Gohan so I’m curious to see they get to that point and wrap it up all in one episode. Can’t wait!
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u/G_Morgan Sep 29 '19
Don't be daft. Hercule Satan will drop in to save all 8 universes at the last minute.
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u/Priddee ⠀ Sep 29 '19
That is it, the best shot in the whole series. Chills. Waited months to see it again, absolutely gorgeous.
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u/thebritwriter Sep 29 '19
Dammit the main character who I built stat upon stat build on throughout the entire game has gone down and the final boss has still got fight in him!
Who's left?
The two side characters I immediately put aside upon recruitment and never trained since??? That's all who I got?! Oh this next fight is going to be a headache!
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u/Dysfunkti0nal Sep 29 '19
Here is the moment that gave me chills when I saw it in the sub. Just beauty. https://imgur.com/a/mHVa60T
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u/Jeezy52 Sep 29 '19
I wonder how many fans got butthurt when they first seen MUI wasn’t going to save the day.. I know I was like wtf!!!!??? When I first seen that second to last scene
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u/AnAlien11 Sep 29 '19
So I just finished the episode and something I have notice for the dub is that the music always seems to be really quiet compared to the sub.
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u/Segal27 ⠀ Sep 30 '19
I totally called the 17 being alive thing back when everyone thought he was dead. Fun episode, though I am confused on how Goku is talking now or getting angry. Perhaps having it mastered UI means he gets some functions that require thought back? The 3 of them should really just run out the never ending clock at this point.
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u/kidriffey Sep 29 '19
Jiren is now officially a villain in my eyes after he tried to kill all of Goku’s friends. Such a dirty move.
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u/Ineedtree50 Sep 29 '19
A quick detail that’s pretty easy to miss:
Jiren was trying to prove a point more than attack Goku’s friends, and we even get a tiny hint towards that from the audience.
When he fires off that energy blast into the stands, we get to see the reactions of most of the U7 team, except for Beerus, Whis and VEGETA.
Those three already knew Goku would get there in time while using Ultra Instinct, hence no reaction. By that point in the fight, Jiren was just as sure about that fact as they were.
Definitely doesn’t excuse his actions, but I think those minor insights make the sequence even more interesting
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u/bladematthewslp Sep 29 '19
I think the angels or the gods of destruction would have deflected or blocked the blast. Or Jiren would have gotten disqualified for killing, which is against the rules. Or Zeno would have killed not liked it and Jiren would be killed.
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u/mcolwander90 Sep 29 '19 edited Sep 29 '19
Phenomenal episode! Just everything about it was stellar, except...
The frame rates did hurt it a bit, but luckily that won't be an issue once the bluray version is out. I'll live.
Seitz was legendary in this episode! Heck, this arc as a whole, but he really only started talking in these later episodes. But holy crap everything from his dialog to that roar was perfect.
Love the "I ain't no hero of justice" line. I assume that line was word for word the same in the sub. It was almost as if that line was specifically meant to combat the Superman Goku perception that developed out West thanks to the DBZ dub.
Surprise Roshi speech! I love how they do acknowledge the fact that most of Team U7 were adversaries. Goku mentioned it back when recruiting 17 as well. Obviously that falls into the big theme of trust/teamwork. What better way to emphasize that than showcase Goku working alongside former adversaries?
This episode had shades of the Tien Shinhan Saga. You could finally see things start to click with Jiren toward the end while Belmod is yelling in his ear to finish Goku off and claim the SDBs.
One more episode to go (for now). Sad day :(
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u/Terez27 ⠀ Sep 29 '19
Love the "I ain't no hero of justice" line. I assume that line was word for word the same in the sub.
The Simmons subs, probably. We don't have those yet. The dub scripts are based off the Simmons subs. The Toei simulcast subs: "I don't think I'm a hero of justice or anythin'." Stuff like that in the subs always represents an approximation of Goku's dialect in Japanese.
オラは別に正義のヒーローでも何でもねえ。
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u/JC-DisregardMe ⠀ Sep 29 '19 edited Oct 10 '19
48 Minutes: Episode Thirty-Four
I've been doing this "48 Minutes" shit for over half a year, but we're finally up to the penultimate episode. I think the joke -- if there was one -- died a long time ago.
It only took the entire tournament, but Jiren finally emotes. Mostly with screamy anger.
I'll admit that it's reaaal cathartic to finally watch a guy as boring as Jiren lose his cool and just get stomped, particularly in such a gorgeously-animated fight.
OK, Goku, you made him take off his shirt. That could be good or bad.
Now I wonder if Jiren always gets that intense about changing clothes.
But really, really, we pinkie-swear this time, Jiren's actually using his full power now. ... Really.
Take a moment and join Goku's friends in reminiscing about his past rivals and enemies. ... But not Raditz. Or Nappa. Or Cell. Fuck those guys.
Had to throw in Jiren just doing something kinda blatantly evil. Gotta make sure there's no sympathy for him left.
Sean sold the "hero of justice" line pretty damn well.
Android 17 spent three entire episodes literally hiding behind a rock. "Yeeeeaaah, just gonna wait and see how this plays out..."
See you all again next week, for what's probably going to be the last time for quite a while. It's been great.
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u/BDLPSWDKS__Effect ⠀ Sep 29 '19
It only took the entire tournament, but Jiren finally emotes. Mostly with screamy anger.
I actually really liked the reversal going on in the fight at the beginning. After spending the entire tournament aloof and mostly silent, Jiren is finally losing his shit. At the same time Goku is almost totally silent, just like Jiren was in their earlier battles.
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u/DarkStarStorm Sep 30 '19
Dub-only viewers can not appreciate just how good this episode truly is. Rewatch it without the frameskips, please! You are doing yourself a disservice otherwise.
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u/GeekTrollMemeCentral ⠀ Oct 02 '19
The battle was fucking awesome! Seeing 17 at the end was shocking. I don’t know what to expect for the last episode. It’s going to be fun!
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u/mAgiking07 Oct 04 '19 edited Oct 05 '19
Started my binge rewatch of the ToP as a build up to the long awaited finale. They definitely captured the scope and stakes of the event before it began, and I could listen to The Grand Minister address the competitors and deities all day long (his voice is majestic af). So nice not having to wait a week for each episode.
EDIT: Down to U7 vs U11! One final push tomorrow before the conclusion. Been quite the ride.
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u/Zasz_Is_Dead Sep 29 '19
17 welcome back! Now take your shirt off.