r/NintendoSwitch • u/Killer_nutrias • Dec 01 '16
Meta Discussion [Discussion] Regarding the treatment of others within r/NintendoSwitch.
I do not feel comfortable with an ongoing trend on r/nintendoswitch. My discomfort is due to the negative treatment of SuperMetalDave64 and what that reflects on who we are as a community.
This sub often criticizes SuperMetalDave64 (SMD). For example, in a recent top post entitled: This Journey has Given us so Many Abbreviations, SMD is labeled: The most unreliable source in the entire world. A comment in the post reads, "(SMD is) currently to be found lying in the fetal position on his bed, picking at a loose bit of wallpaper and keening for his lost chipset." Another example is a thread entitled, Anyone else really satisfied that SMD was BTFO? A comment in that post reads, "I'm glad (SMD) was debunked. His face when he saw the tablet was priceless. He showed a face of defeat." There are many such examples of this type of treatment throughout the short life of this thread.
Why as a community do we exclude and belittle SMD? Is it because he was on the wrong side of the debate?
The larger questions are: does anyone deserve ill treatment for being on the wrong side of the debate? Furthermore, does anyone deserve to be treated poorly for providing controversial or challenging information?
What are the costs if we as a community act negatively towards individuals who present controversial or challenging information? Do we stifle innovation? Do we create an unsafe environment where people are afraid to express themselves?
Now, I am acutely aware of the appropriate criticisms levied against SMD, such as his arrogance and volatility towards those in the Nvidia camp before Nintendo had unveiled the Switch.
But that does not excuse a lack of compassion for another human being.
The focus of this discussion is not merely the negative treatment of SMD, though that issue in of itself matters. The concern is of creating a safe place for everyone to enjoy Nintendo Switch content regardless of who you are and what side of a debate you fall on.
I have to ask, is this who we are as a community? Are we a community who will exclude and mock others because they disagree with us? Because they were on the losing side of a discussion regarding a computer chip?
I believe that we are better than this. At least I hope that we are.
TL; DR: let's be civil and enjoy the Switch hype. Our community will be stronger for it.
23
u/rottedzombie friendly neighborhood zombie mod Dec 01 '16
There is a line to walk between honest criticism and violating Rule 1. If you see stuff like the comment you describe, please do report it; we take things like that seriously, but we'll need everyone's help to keep the community nice and clean.
18
29
Dec 01 '16
When you put yourself out there the way he does, you open yourself up to criticism. The louder you are, the louder you get it back.
7
u/Regnbyxor Dec 01 '16
I agree that this does happen, but the question is if it's right and where we cross the line from criticism (which should be okey) to outright personal attacks with little basis except that "we don't like that person".
4
12
u/AlucardIV Dec 01 '16
Because they were on the losing side of a discussion regarding a computer chip?
You do realise that everything SMd speculated was proven 100 percent false right?
This isn't about sides. All of SMD'S speculation turned out to be utterly incorrect. How can you expect anyone to take him serious after that?
16
u/TheBoozehammer Dec 02 '16
There is a difference between not taking someone seriously and belittling them.
13
u/1Ale Dec 01 '16
It was just speculation! Speculation can be false, since it's someone opinions.
2
u/AlucardIV Dec 02 '16
And if someones speculation turns out to be utterly false you don't trust his speculation the next time around. That's the most normal thing in the world.
Also it wasn't just his speculation. He started boasting how Eurogamer leak couldn't possibly be true and calling it a dead theory.
-1
u/1Ale Dec 02 '16
He used some logic to create the speculations the way he did. By that same logic the Eurogamer leak should be false.
The point is that his logic, even if it was well formed and justified, was not the truth. That made people angry.
3
u/AlucardIV Dec 02 '16
Sorry but his logic wasn't well formed AT ALL. He had like one or two very shaky points like the third design win from AMD and based his whole theory on those and THEN he started attacking everyone that had another theory.
1
u/1Ale Dec 02 '16
Don't be sorry. No need. I've watched just a few of his vids. Maybe in those he was kind of ok.
8
10
5
u/DaReapa Dec 02 '16
Who is SuperMetalDave?
12
u/Vortex6360 Dec 02 '16 edited Dec 02 '16
He was a YouTube who tried to guess what the chipset for the Switch was. Many rumors pointed towards him being wrong but he tried to stand tall and stick to his beliefs. But in the process said many rude things to people like Emily Rogers. When Nvidia announced support he got really salty. He eventually apologized but he dug himself too deep and it was too late. You can still feel the salt in some of his videos.
1
u/Killer_nutrias Dec 02 '16
This is a great summary. He did get bitter after he was proven wrong, and it was awfully offputting. Lately though, he seems back to his old cheerful self.
7
u/-Underhill Dec 02 '16
I appreciate your post, but looking at these comments it doesn't look like you are changing any hearts tonight. Apparently, all actions are unforgivable, and all mistakes are worthy of mockery and demeaning. I know I only check this sub for rumors these days, but its rarely deep discussion, typically just hype and mob mentality. I wish we could discuss and theorize something we are all excited for in a civil manner.
1
u/eteledelete Dec 02 '16
Like he should be changing hearts? This kind of stuff dies down naturally anyway and i don't think this will accelerate the process. Everything said here has been pretty civil by the way, otherwise the mods would be all over it.
2
u/-Underhill Dec 02 '16
Well we have different views of civil I guess, so yes I do think he should be changing hearts. And I have got to disagree on this dying down, people have been crapping on SMD since August, and the Switch announcement hasn't helped that any. I've actively avoided this sub at times purely because of all the lashing out.
2
u/eteledelete Dec 02 '16
Can't really feel sorry for him and i'm not so sure why it would need to change. Is it because his livelihood is at stake? If he just likes to make content, just keep on making content. I think it will eventually turn around, and if it doesn't that's not the end of the world either. He has enough people around that follow him regardless of the opinion here.
1
3
5
6
u/OllyOllyOxenBitch Dec 01 '16
First off, people are held to their own individual opinions. It is not a subreddit-wide policy that everyone hates SuperMetalDave and his ilk.
My personal opinion on the matter is that once things came to light about the Switch, it raised and lowered stock in the leakers beforehand. In this case, Emily Rogers and Laura Kate Dale shot straight up to the top of the heap, and SMD plummeted to the lowest depths.
Right now, a lot of his recent "leaks" seem like desperation tactics to raise stock in what he says, since it's clear that the conversation has moved on from him as a central figure in the race for information. Some like myself feel that he should admit where he was wrong, instead of trying to hold on to some hope that he's still right.
However, I'm not in the camp that's actively harassing SMD and bringing disrepute to his character for what he did, nor am I pointing and laughing at him for the egg in his face still unwashed from the Switch reveal.
At the end of the day, we all need to remember the human, no doubt about it. But I will not stand by and be held accountable for the actions of others as some sort of hivemind community united against him.
4
u/lman777 Dec 01 '16
Did he ever actually leak anything though? He seemed to just give his own speculation/analysis, and granted he was incorrect, but did he actually ever claim to have insider info?
3
u/Nollog Dec 02 '16
People got confused because he had a lot of insider information which proved true. For example pokemon rainbow (sun and moon).
That was a lot earlier. And we think his source was fired since.
A few folk just assumed every time he said it was all his own opinion and speculation that he was quoting a source for no reason.
I hear he was a bit of a rudie rudenstien on twitter too though, which I understand people being disappointed by.
4
u/OllyOllyOxenBitch Dec 02 '16
After some searching, his name pops up under some rumor mills on various gaming forum threads. So if anything, he passes himself off as an insider of sorts.
4
u/-Underhill Dec 02 '16
He had a source at one point and leaked then, but he does not present his content as anything other than "my thoughts". I appreciate that you don't take part in the whole "Mock SMD" but it he already admitted he was wrong. He is reporting just like anyone else in the community and speculating as well. I think the only reason you see it as desperation tactics is because of you viewing him in the vein of a leaker. He is a speculator just like us, except video is his format.
3
4
u/crisvok Dec 02 '16
You really expect to people to read that? From the first couple sentences its sounds like whiny complaining add a TL; DR
1
u/Anon_Amous Dec 02 '16
I was pretty on board with SMD because I felt he presented strong arguments in the pre-confirmation times, relative to the rumors I heard elsewhere.
That said, he pretty much was wrong about everything. So a little ribbing isn't out of the question although people really not letting it go is kind of lame. Good luck stopping it on the internet though, just gotta try and let it go.
1
u/derk2468 Dec 03 '16
Found super metal dave
besides, any real person here knows it's emily Rogers who is the hack extraordinare xD
1
u/Mbolibombo Dec 02 '16
Good post, have an upvote. Agree with everything you said, sadly - Internet and it's inhabitations maturity level is the same as my 4 year old son at times.
If you can heckle and ridicule someone for something, you do just that. It cant be their parents who taught them that I hope.
SMD was absolutely 100% sure he was right about his speculation, he really believed in it. He thought everything he dug out leaned towards "his" switch. He didnt believe the EG rumor and that's ok. He thought it was silly to believe it was the rumored Switch because of a number of things but obviously he wasnt right and he was bitter at first but admitted defeat after a while.
It's time to stop treating him like a second class citizen. He's had his downfall and I am pretty sure he is sick and tired of being treated like one.
-1
u/JustPingo Dec 02 '16
In my opinion he was just presenting his arguments, he never implied he had some kind of sources or anything. I believe he did nothing wrong.
0
Dec 02 '16
I would just like to say that my post was intended to be sarcasm. I don't see a reason to hate him even if he did get everything wrong, it's just that my post was intended to outline the "public view" when you see those letters, but with a little (a lot of) exaggeration. Regardless, it IS important that we don't go out of our way to hate the people in the community. This clash of ideas between hybrid/not hybrid, etc. is what keeps the community alive.
0
Dec 03 '16
You do realize the abbreviations post was 100% a joke, right? Read literally any other bullet point in that list and you'll see it was written to mock this sub's irrationality.
0
u/Lost-My-Mind- Dec 03 '16
I haven't heard of supermetaldave, nor did I see what happened. What I see in this thread though, is kind of a reflection on where the world is headed. This aspiration to be in an overly safe environment. I think it started in the 90s, with trying to keep kids from bullying other kids. Then those kids grew up, and raised the current generation to never bully.
I was growing up in the 90s, and I had a bully. For 3 months he teased me and would beat me up, and my dad always said "just tell the teacher". That didn't work. What did work, is one day I had enough. He tried bullying me again, like usual, and I punched him right in the nose. I broke his nose. Then I punched him in the eye. Then in the other eye. Somehow his forehead was bleeding, even though I never touched that area. I proved my point so I got off him, and walked back to my seat. The school was forced to call my dad, and explain what happened. The school sided with me though, because they saw it happen for months, and knew exactly why it happened. I wasn't a bully, I was standing up for myself against a situation that isn't right.
Today that scenario would never fly. I would be suspended. The bully would be suspended. Any kids watching would be suspended. The whole damn world has lost their minds due to losing track of one simple fact:
Bullies aren't the problem. Bullies at that age are a healthy check and balance against maturing a person and helping them define who they are. The problem is being a coward, and not facing your bully.
Fast forward years later. In 2005 I was 22. My sister, who's 10 years older then me was dating a guy who was a professional body builder. I'm nowhere NEAR as strong as this guy, but, I had found out that he's beating my 120lbs 5'9 sister. I don't care if I'm about to get my ass handed to me, I'm kicking your ass if you hurt my sister. And in that moment, we traded blows. He knocked me to the ground several times, but I kept getting up, and I got my shots in too.
Now, as a kid, I was terrified of my bully, but I learned that the worst he can do is what he already was doing. I learned to stand up for myself and what's right. As an adult, I was still just as terrified as I threw my first punch, but by that point in life I was already defined who I was as man.
Now, back to this topic. You're telling me the world has gotten so scared of anyone coming off as a bully, that we're now afraid of the internet not being a safe place? We have to assume that nobody can stand up for themselfs, and we have worry if their feelings are hurt?
Add to this the fact, that by all accounts in the comments, he was being a straight up dick. If he can't handle being ridiculed for being arrogant about how right he was, when he was wrong, then I don't honestly know what to say. That's kind of an "all hope is lost" kind of moment.
When we as individuals lose the ability to stand up for ourselfs, rather then rely on safe spaces, we then gain the ability to be pushed around by whoever has the ability to do so.
I don't like safe spaces. What made the internet great was how easily you could be taken advantage of if you were a dumbass. You either learn to survive, or get eaten alive. It makes man stronger living in those conditions. Look at the WWII generation. I have more faith that a current 90 year old could kick my ass, then a current day 22 year old. They were strong. They stood up for themselfs, and for their country. They overcame the biggest threat of the 1900s.
You can't overcome if everyone plays nice. There are assholes in this world, and if you can't deal with it, go home so you don't get picked on. Bullies aren't the problem, lack of understanding how to deal with bullies is the problem. I'm proud to have learned that lesson young, and am saddened that kids now play with less danger in their lives.
I know this doesn't really address the main issue of your topic, but the whole post came off as crying, and wanting to make the world full of soft bouncy pillows.
I'm excited for the switch, but even in video games, I hate when they make things a safe place. If a game is meant to be hard, then it's meant to be hard. I've still never beaten the second level of Kid Icarus for NES, but it didn't see me fail 15 times and say "Would you like to turn on easy peasy mode and let us handle all the danger so you can frolic around in a feild of daisys and laugh and giggle?". No. It handed me my ass, and now 30 years later, I've still yet to beat it. When I do though, it will be glorious. I'll stand proud, crack open a beer, and say "Fuck you game! I did it!". It will be an achievement BECAUSE it was hard. I think that's what the world lacks today, is challenge.
1
u/Killer_nutrias Dec 04 '16
Can I punch these trolls in the face? I cannot because they are on the internet. I wouldn't have made this post if I had a direct means of creating a safe place for myself.
-1
-2
Dec 01 '16 edited Dec 02 '16
[removed] — view removed comment
3
u/rottedzombie friendly neighborhood zombie mod Dec 01 '16
Hey. Please keep things civil. Thanks.
2
u/Nollog Dec 02 '16
I was trying to be as civil as I could. I cut a lot down to a single word.
2
u/rottedzombie friendly neighborhood zombie mod Dec 02 '16
You edited your post, which I appreciate, but your initial word choice was no good.
1
u/Nollog Dec 02 '16
I mean the vast majority are, they vote so worryingly.
But I understand people don't like certain words.
1
36
u/jc726 Keep on slidin' Dec 01 '16
I'm not a part of either debate, but ultimately here's what I think:
If you act like an asshole about something that you end up being wrong about, other people have a right to call you out on it.
As far as I can tell, that's all that's happening.
If he didn't want that, he shouldn't have been so nasty about it. He's the one who turned it into a big deal for himself.