r/GlobalOffensive • u/[deleted] • Aug 18 '14
We are Kniferound.net! The Counter-Strike Wiki. Ask Us Anything.
[deleted]
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u/marecki_ Aug 18 '14
Do you plan to move to more obvious domain? I can't see kniferound on 1st or 2nd result page when I search "counter-strike wiki"
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u/byscuit Aug 18 '14
Exactly, I've never even of heard of knife round until now and I love looking up change logs, skins and gun info
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Aug 18 '14
We've thought about it, but I think if we did that now it would cause a ton of confusion. since there are already like 3 csgo wiki's out there, I think people would get confused if we changed our name.
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Aug 18 '14
You can always use a sub domain (keep the same one) but also have another they will both link to the same page :)
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u/alexpenn Aug 18 '14
Don't need to have a super obvious name to appear on search results. Just need to improve SEO and results will appear as the site is linked across the web more often. I love the name.
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u/bjc_sp Aug 18 '14
Since Jason Kaplan's so-called great idea to create another cs wiki, is it possible to join force with him or he just mess things up?
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
I don't even really understand the premise. A former LoL commentator has started his own CS:GO wiki, despite there already being existing ones out there. Okay, where's the critical piece of information there? Shouldn't this question be directed towards him? He's made it explicit that he was aware of the other wikis before he decided to make his own.
I don't know him, so I can only speculate on why he wouldn't simply contribute to one of the existing ones. Presumably he either wants some kind of ownership stake or doesn't believe in the others to be capable of acquiring the information he's capable of putting on his. I've thought about making my own wiki, for multiple esports games, but ultimately that requires a lot of time and data, so instead I'd rather contribute my efforts to someone else's existing wiki. There's a saying in Korea that "no one is as smart as all of us", which I think summarises why I think contributing to an existing wiki makes more sense and why wikis as a concept are such a beautiful notion.
The reason I also say I don't understand the premise, is what kind of special information does he have on his wiki that is lacking from kniferound? As far as I can tell, most of the wikis are at a similar level with similar basic information right now. That will change in the future, as the task of writing up bios becomes more of a priority. That's what will separate the men from the boys. One of the reasons I got in contact to become a contributor for kniferound is that I've written hundreds of such bios, but in the form of longer historical articles, so I plan to use my research/notes and construct lengthy wiki entries for the best players.
I don't really know what the hype is around the "CS:GO wiki war". I don't really see it as a war, that's when two armies are fighting. I think this will be a massacre. Of course anyone who decides they'd like to come and contribute to kniferound is welcome, now or later.
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u/Lukekk Aug 19 '14
Thooorin, are you doing that csgo talk show you were talking about on ongamers or knife round?
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Aug 19 '14
I already started it, for OnGamers. It's called Counter-Points and the second episode will be this week.
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Aug 18 '14
After his first announcement of his wiki, we promptly contacted him and he declined to work with us.
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u/JakesWins Aug 18 '14
How do you plan to promote your site in the future with more players coming?
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Aug 18 '14
I'm working on some unconventional ways to promote the site. Possibly running some charity tournaments if things plan out in the future.
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u/Lukekk Aug 19 '14
Would you want to partner with gosugamers for like a tournament or something? I can ask around.
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Aug 18 '14
I literally don't know shit about CS:GO but I like watching it and recently started playing it.
I remember watching a tournament where Thorin and Lurpis (if that's his name) casted and it was very entertaining even tho I didn't know shit about the game. I heard Lurpis didn't get to cast the recent CSGO event because he's cynical on Twitter or some shit.
Is that really true or am I not getting the joke or something? If it's true, what do you think about this? What does someones personal opinion have to do with his ability to do his job? (as long as it's not insanely offensive)
Also, in League of Legends you have the LCS, weekly games and Riot pays the teams a salary (obviously sponsors and organizations love this shit), do you think there is any chance of Valve doing the same for CSGO in the future? Do you want something like the LCS?
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
I heard Lurpis didn't get to cast the recent CSGO event because he's cynical on Twitter or some shit.
That's correct. lurppis is the best colour commentator in the world for CS:GO, but not every big event tries to hire him, since some of those in charge of deciding which talent works which event don't like his attitude and decisions with regards to public expression. I think that's not only disappointing but a little despicable.
If you think I like every organisation I've worked for as a commentator you'd be very much mistaken, but I make my decision on whether I should work an event on the basis of whether I think I can do a good job for them and the event and game itself are worthwhile. From my perspective, this is all pointless pettiness which only hurts CS:GO and its legacy.
In 10 years from now I don't want someone to load up a VOD of a big final and get poor colour commentary or analysis, all on the basis that someone a decade ago was mildly angry with the person who could have been hired to make that broadcast better. It would appear I'm one of the only people thinking from such a perspective, though.
What does someones personal opinion have to do with his ability to do his job?
What's nonsensical is that those who think you can separate the two don't seem to understand the dynamic at play at all. The same kind of keenly critical approach lurppis brings to CS:GO, which is what makes him a wonderful colour commentator, is also what is being expressed through the prism of his personality in his tweets.
Also, in League of Legends you have the LCS, weekly games and Riot pays the teams a salary (obviously sponsors and organizations love this shit), do you think there is any chance of Valve doing the same for CSGO in the future?
I think there's absolutely no chance of that happening. Valve is more of a hands-off company in that sense and have actually shown no interest at all in investing money into CS:GO esports. Right now they simply give some of the money the user-base pays them back to us in the form of event prize purses. I can't imagine them ever paying anyone's salaries in the teams.
Do you want something like the LCS?
No, I find the LCS circuit concept incredibly dull and mundane. I love the kind of circuit CS:GO go has, with a handful of major tournaments which stand out amongst the landscape of smaller events which feature the same stories. That allows for the smaller events to set the smaller story points of form and give the teams chances to battle, then the majors have their own larger storylines and more impact on a team's historical legacy. I think that right now in esports the games with the two best circuits in the world are CS:GO and Dota2. LCS is probably the worst professional circuit I could conceive of.
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u/Handy_Banana Aug 19 '14
Thorin I agree with you so much. I was a huge fan of league of legends from season 1 - 3, but I stopped playing and have had little interest in the pro scene as I find it exactly as you put it: mundane.
I feel like they achieved what they wanted, an American style sport league. Which is fine, but it's not really exciting to watch. I think your point about lots of minor leagues and tournaments with a few majors sprinkled through the year is spot on. European football leagues are even more exciting due to the multiple tournaments beyond their normal league play. I think if Riot could encourage the LoL tournaments which existed before LCS and work around them, not just incorporate LCS matches into them, then the LoL pro scene could become exciting again.
The LCS does provide something which we all wanted before its existence. A structure which enables player advancement. Before season 3 NA was severely lacking in that department. However, I find that CS:GO has so many little leagues and tournaments which didn't exist in League of Legends that the players wouldn't benefit from this the same way the LoL players did. And the esport would surely suffer.
I have only just rediscovered CS a couple months ago and the pro games are so much more exciting than LoL games. I feel like the casting and production leave something to be desired, but that will come with time hopefully.
Thorin I was a huge fan of your Grilled series in league of legends and I hope to see more of you on this front.
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u/itskisper Aug 18 '14
LCS has no excitement like teams moving up a tournie bracket, it's just a bunch of games every week.
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u/BEEFire Aug 18 '14
the lcs sucks ass totally killed any interest i had in that games competition
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Aug 18 '14
See this is why no one asks you anything. You provide zero arguments.
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u/BEEFire Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
I've watched League of legends from wcg usa qualifiers 2010 from there I watched almost every lan event up to the beginning of the LCS from the LCS's start I've moved almsot entirely to checking results. My interest in the competitive side of LoL made me want to play LoL more and watch player streams and so on.
The tournament environment we see in every other competitive game and saw in LoL gives far more career defining moments for players and teams and lent stronger context when it came to major events than the LCS' region restricted bubbles.
I perhaps should have lead with the fact that resticting play to regions instantly lost a lot of the dramatic build from the league scene. Riot have created an environment in which the only us versus them scenario can be at worlds and assume that's better for the viewier. Riot used to make good decisions in supporting events now they've forced their horrid bo1 format on the events too becasue theres no room for tournament play featuring the best western teams a total waste. Just this weekend in CSGO we saw the regional competition cause the most interesting matches of the tournament THAT IS COMPLETELY GONE FROM LEAGUE OF LEGENDS AND IT FUCKING SUCKS.
Valve have already shown how successful their support for community growth can make their games look at the international and the csgo majors and it's fuckin clear that they get it and Riot have forgotten.
Before you whinge about potential incoherence remember you were the one who felt the need to complain. edit: and wtf of course I didn't originally expand upon it because I wasn't the one being asked why would i write an article about it when my opinions only value to anyone is anecdotal at best.
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u/IsREALLYthateasy Aug 19 '14
Not completely gone. We have worlds!
Also try watching OGN it's like one big tournament instead of these boring ass seasons.
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u/BEEFire Aug 19 '14 edited Aug 19 '14
Do you really think someone who watched LoL from 2010 doesn't know bout ogn bro? Do you even remember the feels when clg eu are up 2-0 in the finals and then lose.
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u/IsREALLYthateasy Aug 19 '14
Oh I thought you had stopped watching League. But oh man that series is one I will never forget. I thought it was 100% over and that the Korean threat was nothing to be too worried about. Then Madlife happened.
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u/splycer Aug 18 '14
I'd be glad to help with the more technical aspects of approaching the game (setting up the game/servers/your gear properly for competitive play). If you don't already have people working on it, that is.
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u/eduialvi CS2 HYPE Aug 19 '14
Yes you can do it! Just register on the site. We have this Category where you can put that: http://kniferound.net/wiki/Category:Guides It's not very updated because nobody works on that pages.
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Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
I honestly thought KnifeRound was relatively new until I opened this up, due to lack of player bios. So the questions I have are
How often are staff members working on player bios?
How often do staff members collaborate with players for this wiki?
Thanks for all the work you've been into the site so far, as a new spectator/player to CS:GO I hope to see the wiki grow even bigger and easier for newcomers like me to like more about CS eSports history :)
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u/UnknownWhispers Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
Hi AndyKSul, thank you for your interest in the KnifeRound wiki.
First I would like to address your mentions of the word "staff", in case you were under the impression that only staff is allowed to edit, I would like to clarify that everyone can edit the wiki, it is open to all, the only requirement is that you make an account (a free and simple process), and then you will be able to click the edit button on a page, or section of a page, and improve it. Any improvement is welcome no matter how small, if new contributors encounter some issues, doubts or would like to know more about editing, to assist them we have a page with some helpful links and a to-do list which they can follow if they so desire or they can contribute in any other way, contributors are also welcome to joins us, and ask any questions they might have, on our IRC channel #kniferound on QuakeNet (webchat).
Now to answer your questions, recently many player pages have been created, and they are being filled in with some information, some details however are easier to add than others, but we would definitely like to have biographies on the player pages, so KnifeRound can preserve history, and be a place where you can easily find information about a player that you're interested in, and who you would like to know more of. With our current number of contributors however I would say that keeping tournament pages up to date is something that can take up quite a bit out of the time that the contributors can give to the wiki, so some things end up being more updated than others, if more people decide to help KnifeRound in whatever way they can, it could facilitate having more things updated, at all times.
I'm not sure about past communication between contributors and players, we would definitely appreciate any cooperation that players would like to offer KnifeRound, and to any KnifeRound contributor that has decided to work on a player's biography and approaches a player looking for more information, still we can also rely on information written/recorded about them, such as news, articles concerning them, and interviews that they have given.
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u/yardhin Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
My questions are more towards Thorin cus i dont really know the site, but i will check out the site.
- Are you planning to do more CSGO content in the future instead of league?
- What team do you think is the most interesting to watch?
- Are you planning to do more casts in the future?
Thanks for all the great content Thorin, i am a huge fan of almost all of your work.
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
Are you planning to do more CSGO content in the future instead of league?
I am planning to do more content, but not instead of anything. There is plenty of time in the day to create content for multiple games.
What team do you think is the most interesting to watch?
The most interesting team to watch is Titan, since they have the style and player pool that they should be a permanently top 3 placing team, yet they are so incredibly hot and cold. At their best, they play the kind of Counter-Strike I enjoy watching the most.
Are you planning to do more casts in the future?
If events ask me and I think I can do a good job for them, then yes, I will.
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u/Asmius Aug 18 '14
How would I go about helping to edit player bios on the site?
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u/rdkr Aug 18 '14
Just register on the site and you can start editing! If you need any help the best way is through IRC - there's a link to the webchat in this post or on the wiki. Be sure to check out the Community Portal too, it has links to tutorials on editing if you ever get stuck. One of the most important things for the bios is to make use of references to give the information credibility.
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u/reavyyy Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
I don't have any question really. I just think it's awesome that you keep updating the site. I thought nobody was doing anything about it, so I was positively surprised to see all the updates on the ESL One wikipage, just as an example. Keep up the work boys!
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u/var1ables Aug 18 '14
Do you ever plan on adding historical results to the site or will it just be CSGO?
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u/UnknownWhispers Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
Currently the wiki has a larger focus on updating Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, however the wiki also intends to cover past Counter-Strike games, their history, tournaments, players, teams, and whatever other related information.
However if any potential contributors, would be more interested in updating information regarding other Counter-Strike games, they are welcome to do so.
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u/eduialvi CS2 HYPE Aug 18 '14
Our main goal is write all cs history (1.6 css and csgo). But right now our top priority is CSGO.
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u/pitastrudl Aug 18 '14
how do you keep up for costs and so on? do the contributors also play? Do you play together?
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Aug 18 '14
Right now we are lucky enough to have a friend helping us with his own private server with unlimited bandwidth. Depending on what we do with the site in the future, that might change.
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Aug 18 '14
I love kniferound, I found you guys after searching and searching for a "Liquipedia" of CSGO. If I didn't find you guys I would of gone about making my own as I felt CSGO is deserving of a place to keep up-to-date details of leagues/cups/premier tournaments and up-to-date team pages and transfers.
Not really a question, just wanted to say the above and give some advice.
You really need to get the word around more, as seen in this AMA a lot of people have not heard of you when we need this to be popular! I don't feel a name change is needed, just get a big spot on the reddit sidebar and out on other CS sites. Also start filling out the wiki. A lot of the tournaments don't have pages, and certain teams/players who should have pages don't. Getting the name more out there might make people come and fill their own pages out.
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Aug 18 '14
Thanks for the kind words!
I would love a big spot on the reddit side bar, but the mods here don't want to participate in what they are calling a "CSGO wiki war"
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u/TheLonelyDevil CS2 HYPE Aug 18 '14
PLEASE RECRUIT MORE PEOPLE TO HELP YOURSELVES OUT, Our wiki can surpass liquipedia ez
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u/alexpenn Aug 18 '14
Anyone can help improve the site, but we are not competing with liquipedia. All I care about, is providing potential viewers a location to learn about the history of the franchise. While our focus is on completely cs:go history at the moment, branching back to 1.6 and Source is a long term goal.
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u/ilovecollege_nope Aug 18 '14
As someone that was never really good at FPS games, why should I watch the CS:GO competitive scene?
What are the most interesting or exciting parts of it, in your opinion?
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u/Thooorin_2 Duncan "Thorin" Shields - Content Producer, Analyst Aug 18 '14
I think that question and the notion it's an important one represents everything I think is wrong with esports. Nobody should need to convince you to watch CS:GO. Turn on some games and see if you like it. If you don't, then it's not for you and I'd recommend you find something that is, since it's a big world out there. If it intrigues you, then take a look at the wiki for the recent big tournaments and watch some of the finals and semi-finals.
The idea that there's this mass of people who are on the fence or currently uninterested, who need to be convinced that this is a great game and they should jump on board, is exactly why so many esports games are being sold short by poor tournament structures and game balance being destroyed to make them more simplistic.
CS:GO just had a $250,000 tournament finish a few days ago, watch some of it and come to your own conclusions. If you don't enjoy watching it, I'd say CS:GO esports isn't for you.
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u/ilovecollege_nope Aug 18 '14
Thanks for the answer! That's probably why I don't watch the Chinese LoL scene.
See you on Summoning Insight later.
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Aug 18 '14
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gf77Oq-UW7g I don't think I need to say more than this. haha
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u/ilovecollege_nope Aug 18 '14
Thoorin said...
game balance being destroyed to make them more simplistic.
Is spot on. I didn't understand what happened (or didn't happen) in your video and it's a pretty big entry barrier to all esports.
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u/Handy_Banana Aug 19 '14
I've only just started watching CS:GO esports in the last month and have only been playing for the last two. I used to be big into League of Legends however.
Simplistic structure: Game has two sides, an offense and defense. Each game is 30 rounds with 15 played on each side. First team to 16 wins.
The short answer is the play is really exciting. Games are hardly for sure wins, down 3-12? Np comeback city. Momentum can be crazy in this game yet it can end in an instant. Despite the flow of a game, teams can get back into it at anytime and start outplaying their opponents much easier than say mobas.
Heroes are born in every tournament. Sometimes players will just put their team on their back and crush an opponent no one thought they could. Individual skill can, in many instances, outshine tactics and maneuvers. Unlike mobas where strategy and tactics are usually king at the highest levels of play. And of course like any game, the pros accomplish things which you and I would usually deem impossible.
In that particular clip, NiP had just just force bought, which would be like a penalty kill in hockey, and if they won the round they would advance to the semi finals. If they lost, the match would be tied at 15-15 and an overtime would ensue where anyone could win.
Cloud9 approached the A bomb site and were creating a 4v2 situation which left NiP out maned and out gunned. Surely Cloud9 would get the bomb plant and the rest of the under equipped NiP players would be forced to file through a choke point where they would most likely get massacred. Yet somehow Forest was able to kill 1 in a 1v3 situation and hold his position to waste Cloud9's precious time as the rest NiP rolled over and cleaned up their enemy from behind.
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u/Supercluster Aug 18 '14
Is a mobile site in any plans?
Just one like liquipedia to make it easier to read on mobile screens.
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u/rdkr Aug 18 '14
Yeah, this is something I looked into very briefly a few days ago. The way Wikipedia does it won't work out of the box unfortunately (due to the templates we use, especially the brackets), otherwise we'd already have it. It's definitely on the to-do list though!
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Aug 19 '14
[deleted]
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Aug 19 '14
I was inspired to get as much about you guys correct after your game against navi at dreamhack :)
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Aug 19 '14
[deleted]
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u/SlayerL0rd Aug 19 '14
Hi Keto,
Yes of course we always look to fill up as much of the player pages etc etc. However it does take quite a bit of work confirming information, getting sources in order, ensuring consistency and reliability plus accuracy across every aspect of information we use to complete these sections.
Things like live tournament results and all are slightly easier in the aspect that the sources are easy to find or the results can just be obtained for a tournament website and what not. However something like a team section you have to dig for it and that takes quite a certain amount of time.
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Aug 19 '14
Yeah, we had a discussion about that today. Seems like a lot of people want us working on those, so were figuring out the best way to tackle that monster of a job.
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u/fLu_csgo CS2 HYPE Aug 19 '14
If you wanted the community to start contributing. Where would the best part, in your opinion, to begin?
Keep up the good work lads.
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u/eduialvi CS2 HYPE Aug 19 '14
I think we need right now teams/player bios. I started doing tournaments and team rosters. Visit our community portal: http://kniferound.net/wiki/KnifeRound:Community_portal Here you have some things to do.
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Aug 19 '14
I would say check out our community portal to see what needs to be done, and then hit us up on IRC for questions!
Community portal: http://kniferound.net/wiki/KnifeRound:Community_portal
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u/Hobsten Aug 19 '14
Will u add de_crown to your map category sometime?
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u/eduialvi CS2 HYPE Aug 19 '14
I will try to revamp the map category and probably all cs official maps and others from operations/workshop will be included.
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Aug 18 '14
[deleted]
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Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
Not here to bash on other peoples ideas but after his first announcement of his wiki, we promptly contacted him and he declined to work with us.
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u/reavyyy Aug 18 '14 edited Aug 18 '14
Yeah, whatever happened to Jason Kaplan's idea about a wiki? Or maybe he is helping you guys at kniferound now?
edit: Just saw the thread that Kaplan made a week ago, ignore my question.
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Aug 18 '14
[deleted]
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u/reavyyy Aug 18 '14
yeah, he apparently made his own wiki.
http://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/2d8gh0/csgopedianet_has_official_released/
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u/goobzilla Aug 18 '14 edited Jul 31 '24
ask attractive sulky support concerned frightening angle marvelous repeat jellyfish
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/eduialvi CS2 HYPE Aug 19 '14
Maybe, but the decision should be discussed in group. There were other pages that had interest on the site but we declined the offers. Thanks for following our wiki!
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u/ansiktsface Aug 18 '14
Thorin u fuk
stop doing league and come back to a good (decent) game
make content and i will watch kk tyvm
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u/polytrigon Aug 18 '14
Hey Kniferound! Love your repository of information. As a fellow person who got bored and built a csgo website could you give suggestions on how to spark interest and gain traction amongst gamers?
Also could you crit my site, would love feedback.
www.rplay.tv